# A New Reef Tank



## Mr.Eeks

I have a 55gal tank I am wanting to start as a reef tank. I read thru ReefingMadness stickie at top of the forum quickly and will likely be reading thru it again as I go. I have yet to even buy much of the equipment needed as I would like some more input (other then the reviews from the stores on their sites). So far I have a Rapids Pro Wet/Dry filter setup. Its a combo filter, and skimmer and I also purchased the auto-fill box (for evaporation). I had read good things on it and it included a couple things that were needed so that's why I settled on it. I'm currently looking at lights, and wavemakers/powerheads. For lights I would like to run LEDs (cost savings and slimmer profile). Will the LED be powerful enough? One type I'm looking at is TruLumen Pro, tank is 48" across so two 48" or four 24" strips would suffice or not? Another I was told to check out is 

New Dimmable 120W Aquarium Coral Reef Fish Tank White Blue LED Light White US | eBay

As for powerhead/wavemakers ReefingMadness article recommends 20x tank size, so Koralia Evolution 550 x 2 one on each end of tank would be a perfect fit?
Also any recommendations on live rock/sand (or use all dry rock), or substrate?


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## coralbandit

I use the true lumen pros on all my tanks(fresh and salt/reefs).I am really pleased with them(reef is almost 2 years old).Two may work out for you I use 4 (48") on my 75g.One is all blue and 1 diamond white(12k) and the other two are the fusions.If you want 4 @24" you will need 2 transformers,where if you go 2 @48" you'll only need 1 transformer.
I also use and love the hydors.
The rock substrate is up to you,you can mix dry/live or go all live if it is available.You could go all dry rock but much of the bacteria and bio diversity comes from live rock so I would go without,but it is up to you.
The light you linked looks good also (have no knowledge of though).You would need two to cover your tank.


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## Reefing Madness

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## tike

The light RM is recommending I use myself on a 60 gallon cube and it rocks!


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## Mr.Eeks

I settled on Kent salt mix, the hydor pumps mentioned above and a Finnex 150 titanium heater with a digital control. Those lights RM linked look awesome, is there any other way to mount them other than hanging, just curious. As far as rock and sand go, if I use all dry rock like RM suggests what jump starts the nitrogen cycle and bacteria? And for sand any argonite sand is ok? Then I should be ok to start it up?
Thanks for the help guys!


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## coralbandit

A cocktail shrimp in a mesh bag is standard way of fishless cycling marine tanks.The bag helps control the mess of a deteriorating shrimp.
I've cut wood(mahagony) into strips to fit tank rim and set lights on them?


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## Mr.Eeks

Looking to finally pick up some rock and sand this week. I do like what I've read about Macro Rocks so I'll probably order from them. A 50lb box of dry rock and maybe another 10-15ishlb box of their "prime cut" dry rock to use to make bridges/overhangs and other structures with. That be a good amount of rock? 
Also might get some sand from them. I was kind of wanting to go with a darker sand tho, with hopes that it would make the colors pop a little more? 
How much sand would I be looking at needing?

Suggestions, comments and recommendations welcomed!
Thanks guys/gals


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Got almost everything I need to start tank, just waiting on FedEx. 70# rock from marcorock, decided sand from them as well. Test kits, refractometer, rodi system from aquasystems. Need to order lights going to order either Taotronics or the ones RM linked me above. also picked a book up from lfs, a simple guide to marine aquariums, by Jeff Kurtz. Pretty good easy read informative. In it he mentions a plenum setup briefly to control for nitrates. I have been looking for more info on this, found garf.org. Does anyone run this setup? Seems very easy to setup just some PVC pipe and fiberglass door screen. Thoughts?


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

I have been hammering on my rock today, since Marco Rock is so amazing very few of the pieces are smaller than a football, not a complaint its amazing but I hate to wreck it! I have also been toying with different methods of stacking and think I have found what I like, picture at the link since the insert image button will not work from my tablet....
imgur: the simple image sharer
There is still a few smaller pieces of the rock I have yet to put in there, and none of this is bonded yet, I purchased the mortar from MarcoRocks as well. Also 80lbs of sand from Marco Rocks, 40lbs in coarse and fine. And still debating on the idea of getting a 5-10lb chunk of "fully cured" live rock from my lfs....how long would it take to cycle if I just use the dry rock vs if I pick up a chunk of cured rock?
Also my RODI should be here anyday and then I can mix up a batch of saltwater *w3
Thanks for the help guys/gals!


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

So by using a chunk of fully cured live rock I'll only save myself like 2 weeks? Well in that case I'll skip it...thanks.


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## Shaun843

coralbandit said:


> I use the true lumen pros on all my tanks(fresh and salt/reefs).I am really pleased with them(reef is almost 2 years old).Two may work out for you I use 4 (48") on my 75g.One is all blue and 1 diamond white(12k) and the other two are the fusions.If you want 4 @24" you will need 2 transformers,where if you go 2 @48" you'll only need 1 transformer.
> I also use and love the hydors.
> The rock substrate is up to you,you can mix dry/live or go all live if it is available.You could go all dry rock but much of the bacteria and bio diversity comes from live rock so I would go without,but it is up to you.
> The light you linked looks good also (have no knowledge of though).You would need two to cover your tank.



Bro check out my new thread under new to saltwater aquarium hobby
I bought the trulumen because i seen you tank and i liked it! Thanks for some of your help! very satisfied with this light, starting to see growth on some of the green algae trees...  i have 1 24" marine combo, but was thinking of going with another FULL BLUE actnic tell me what ya think on my thread. *w3


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## Mr.Eeks

Got my RODI filter the other day, have been letting it run while I rinse dead rock and mortar it together. Am also in process of rinsing the sand, I am not sure how to go about this though, a friend of mine (who has many freshwater tanks) said just stick a garden hose in a bucket and turn it on and let bubble over for a while. Would that be appropriate for sand that will be used in a SW tank? Hoping to get sand finished rinsing tonight or Sat morning so I can start it cycling, 2 raw shrimps in a little mesh bag will kick start I think I read? Will get some pods of my final rock formations posted too.

Also order lights. Settled on Reef Breeder LED, but I think they sent me wrong ones because I ordered ones with 120* lens and the ones I received don't appear to have any lens so have to call them on that.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Reefing Madness said:


> If its another type of sand, rinse it in a bucket or tub until the water runs clear.
> If you got the unit and it appears it has no lenses, then you got the right ones. I believe that the LEDs themselves are 120 without lenses, and you'd see an optic over them if you had one of the others.


Marco Rocks sand 80# of it coarse and fine, and sounds good hose in bucket now 

Ok picture on their website of the lights must have been with a 90 or 60 degree lens.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Thanks for the help RM. 
I started assembling the tank last night. Pic below. Rock is all mortared in place, that was a huge pain. Still have about 10 lbs of sand I am thinking on adding to compensate for the water and CuC packing it down. Right now I have a maxi-jet 1200 mixing me up some saltwater in the Rubbermaid (about 25 gal) my RODI drains into, haven't tested any SG/salinity yet, I just tossed some salt in a flipped on mj before work, I have a refractometer I will test it against when I get off work.
imgur: the simple image sharer *w3


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## Mr.Eeks

Just thought of another question I had regarding my filter/skimmer. The filter has 3 baskets for media, included with it were a mechanical media on top (just a couple thin white pads), 2nd basket was filled with bio-balls, and 3rd had these glass ball things with a carbon pillow (that's what manu called it) topping off bottom basket. Now with roughly 70lbs of live rock would I be correct in assuming I can completely ditch the bio balls? And if so what should I replace them with, activated carbon? Also the glass ball things do I use those or replace them?


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## Reefing Madness

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## Johnnycat

I'm still new, but the science behind Chemipure Elite and Purigen looks good.


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## Mr.Eeks

Should I use GFO in both baskets? Or something else in one? Fill up a media bag and just place in basket right?


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

I started my cycle with a few shrimp on Thursday I think. I have the temp set at 80, and check salinity at 1.025 and ammonia at 2.0 ppm today. For filtration I have the 70lbs of dead rock, the water flows from the tank to my wet/dry thru filter floss, a carbon pad, to chemi-pure elite, and the bottom most basket I currently have empty. Skimmer and pump appear to be in good working order, hydors are circulating water good, but one end of my tank is slightly (2*) cooler than side I have heater on.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Place heater next to filter exit maybe? Also as far as the shrimp go should I just keep them in there for a while, or pull them out when ammonia stops rising? I think I read somewhere it peaks about 4ppm, is that correct?
Thanks


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Oh no I have 2 600gph hydor korlia on opposite sides of tank near top of water kind of aimed at center to tank.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

I have started to look into and research what I would like to stock my tank with. A few fish for starters before adding corals I read was a good idea.
I think the first couple fish I will add is some clowns, either one or 2 I'm not sure yet haven't decided. Then after having some fish I could add a few snails, shrimp, crab a cleaner crew correct? There is one crab I am really interested in having, I believe it is a porcelain crab, but he carries an anemone on his back, would this be compatible with corals and the fish I would like I have read conflicting info on this. 
I also would maybe like a dwarf angel, they are so colorful, I've read conflicting info on these guys and corals also, but think I would maybe like to give it a go anyway.
As far as any corals I want, I really like tree looking corals, and very much interested in devils hand leather coral and some of the zoanthids are cool. 
Thanks for the continued support!


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## coralbandit

Possibly a paticular porcelain crab you saw has an anenome on it but for the most part porcelain crabs don't have anenomes(my 2 don't).Possibly you saw a pom pom crab that has 2 little anenomes on its claws?I love my porcelain crabs ,but they hide ALL THE TIME.Still I dig them,but do have look for them(they're always in the same spot{cave like area}).
Dwarf angels shouldn't cause too much trouble but be shocked if the "pick" at stuff every now and then.I have a pygmy and a blue girdled angel(not dwarf) in my 75 with mostly leathers and mushrooms and they cause no trouble.I had a flame but he lost a long battle with re occuring popeye.He was way more active than either of the two I still have.
Make your mind up about number of clowns and install them at same time.Same species is best in my opinion,and they may form a pair as they do change sex to make it work.


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## Mr.Eeks

coralbandit said:


> Possibly a paticular porcelain crab you saw has an anenome on it but for the most part porcelain crabs don't have anenomes(my 2 don't).Possibly you saw a pom pom crab that has 2 little anenomes on its claws?I love my porcelain crabs ,but they hide ALL THE TIME.


I just double checked, and you are right not a porcelain crab, rather a hermit crab. He will pick up certain types of anemones and place them on his shell (or you can buy them together sometimes), and they form a symbiotic relationship, the anemone provides additional protection for the crab and the crab moves the anemone about the water. And supposedly when the crab outgrows his shell he will place his anemone on his new shell. Sounds very cool to me!


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## coralbandit

My opinion of hermit crabs in reef tanks is not favorable!The few I had definately caused the death of a couple of my corals by climbing on them and hanging out all day,pi**ing them off and keeping them from gtting the light they needed.I no longer have any!Shrimp are great for a CUC and many of the snails are great also.I do have porcelain crabs(they have no claws).They are "filter feeders" with "net" like claws that constantly sweep the water for small particles and such.
A crab with an anenome,although very cool sounding an looking sounds like twice the trouble for corals.Anenomes will sting and win over most everything else in a reef tank.


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## Mr.Eeks

Hmm bummer with the hermits, other types of crabs usually ok? 

Day 14 of cycle and ammonia is still 2.0ppm, temp 78, SG 1.025


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## Johnnycat

Mr.Eeks said:


> Hmm bummer with the hermits, other types of crabs usually ok?


I absolutely LOVE Emerald Crabs. They constantly pick junk off my rocks and can eat bubble algae if you have it.


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## perm_dogg

I second CB on hermit crabs. Worthless. They fight each other, they terrorize and climb on everything in the tank. Whatever else you gotta do, I'd go for it. There are hundreds of species out there to choose from, hermits are like buying pets at a thrift store. I'm gonna pop some tags.....etc.


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

ha ha. Thata boy. Welcome back!!


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## Johnnycat

Reefing Madness said:


> Ok, I gotta throw down here. Emeralds don't really eat Bubble Algae, as you've been told. Its really the Black Emerald Crab that eats Bubble Algae, and those guys are hard to come by in our trade.


Wait a minute. Are you suggesting that something I read off the internet isn't true? 

I could have sworn one of my emerald's was eating a clump of bubble algae that came in on a mushroom rock. Maybe he was just eating some junk around it. 

But, they are fun to watch picking junk off rocks and sand and eating then spitting stuff out.


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

I used to use search engines for all of my saltwater info. until I found this forum. I've learned more real life knowledge from these guys than Google could ever feed me. So pay attention, this is the truth. ha ha


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## Goby

Johnnycat said:


> I absolutely LOVE Emerald Crabs. They constantly pick junk off my rocks and can eat bubble algae if you have it.


I really enjoy my emerald crab too...such a character. He lives under the pedal of my Haddoni Carpet Anemone. I thought you might enjoy this video...I watched it awhile back and kept it in my favorites. 

Emerald Crab eating Bubble Algae - YouTube


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## Mr.Eeks

WOW! Awesome vid Goby. Now I know I've got several weeks to start stocking yet, but generally would a person add some fish before inverts like snails, shrimps, crabs ect? Because if that's the case I think I will see if I can find a mated pair of clowns in town here, give them a few weeks in QT, and after a few weeks in DT add some inverts?


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## Reefing Madness

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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

Madness, do you have a devil's hand coral too?


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

I thought I seen it in the picture. What's your secret to getting it to extract it's polyps or whatever? Mine only did that once and never again. How do you make it happy?


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

how do you measure mag?


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## coralbandit

The mag test kit is one of the most "painful" test.Besides being $35-50!
Amazon.com: Seachem Reef Status Magnesium Test Kit: Pet Supplies this is the kit I use.
My most finicky(and they are) leather has just opened up beautifully and consistently when I upped my mag.


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

Shoulda known. Mr. Eeks. Keep that pocket book open, this is just the beginning


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## Mr.Eeks

Yea no kidding, well I've got a while before adding coral, since I've decided I would add some fish and mobile inverts first. But would eventually like the devils hand, it just looks soo cool. My ammonia should peak at 4ppm right? I still haven't hit that high of ammonia. There isn't necessarily anything else I should be concerned with while cycling is there? Of course temp and SG but SG has been constant at 1.025 and temp I have a little high at about 80-81, but its starting to get cooler here in ND and I usually leave windows open at nights and shut them during day, so tank cools overnight slightly maybe to 77ish, of course when stocked I'll have to figure something else out.

Also I've been trying to decide on a method to suspend my LEDs. I've got 2 value reef breeders as mentioned. What I'm thinking on swinging by WalMart and getting a plastic shelf and stacking one section on either side of my tank and suspending them from that. Had seen a photo on the reef breeder website of someone's tank and it looked like that's what they had done.


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## perm_dogg

I believe either in my gallery or on my previous soap opera thread entitled "Appreciate any advice I can get", I did post a few pictures of how I hung my LED light before I had a tank big enough to fit the bars that came with it. It was simple and, for the record, I am in no way a carpenter, so if I can do it, so can you....or a monkey ha ha


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

Yeah dude, did you say North Dakota? It aint exactly tropical here in Wisconsin either! Although, today was like 96' and humid, but before we know it, frozen tundra, my fish survive temperatures most probably wouldn't even risk. The key is to not let it drop or raise dramatically all at once. Ha ha. Look at me tryin to sound all smart


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## perm_dogg

What do you guys use for a salinity tester? I just got the cheap plastic thing. I'm sure some of you have some kind of fancy digital one. But I was wondering if I can rely on mine because when you use it, it seems to dry up inside and take some soaking before it reads right again.


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## coralbandit

You got to clean it with freshwater everytime you use it.I had 3 different ones and each read differently(without bubbles messing them up!).I am one of the ones who is digital(like $200),and have to say I love it 100%.It is the most common,often important test done,hence my decision to invest so much on the digital(hanna).Many have great accurate readings with refractometers.I'll post a link for one in a minute!
Many to choose from cheap!
Saltwater Refractometer: Fish & Aquariums | eBay
This is the digital meter I use;
Marine Aquarium Salinity: Specific Gravity Testing: Hanna Instruments Digital Seawater Refractometer


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## Reefing Madness

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## perm_dogg

Yep, that's the one I got on my Amazon wish list. I guess maybe it's time to invest.....Again.


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## Shaun843

coralbandit said:


> I use the true lumen pros on all my tanks(fresh and salt/reefs).I am really pleased with them(reef is almost 2 years old).Two may work out for you I use 4 (48") on my 75g.One is all blue and 1 diamond white(12k) and the other two are the fusions.If you want 4 @24" you will need 2 transformers,where if you go 2 @48" you'll only need 1 transformer.
> I also use and love the hydors.
> The rock substrate is up to you,you can mix dry/live or go all live if it is available.You could go all dry rock but much of the bacteria and bio diversity comes from live rock so I would go without,but it is up to you.
> The light you linked looks good also (have no knowledge of though).You would need two to cover your tank.


BUMP to coralbandit: for true lumen pros, I currently have 1 24" marine combo white/blue...Plan on purchasing another FULL BLUE and a WHITE DIAMOND..BUMP for hydors! as those wave makers are all I have used on my 12 gal, 14 gal and now my 30 gal.. 

I personally got 15 lbs of dry and almost 5 lbs of live rock as of now...My opinion...I need more live rock!$$$

I actually use distilled water to rinse off my hydrometer and/or any equipment going back into the tank.

Also if your ph or KH is off your polyps will shy away some...I use API test kits, there not too bad, but be sure to check in good lighting against a white background.


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## Mr.Eeks

Parameters today after 4 weeks cycling:
SG 1.025
T 79.4
NH4 0ppm
NO3 5.0ppm
I haven't yet tested the nitrate levels
Do you think it would be acceptable to mix up some more saltwater, fill a 10g QT give it a day or so to level off the temp, and make sure SG is good and acclimate a couple clownfish? Give them a couple weeks in QT and hopefully after that time acclimate them to DT?


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## perm_dogg

with no other fish in there yes. I didn't wait that long and had a clown fish that was plenty happy, until the lights went out and the Damsels tore him apart. My opinion, it's worth a shot.


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## coralbandit

Your parameters seem good.If you are going to QT the clowns then your tank should be all good buy the time that is over.
Enjoy!


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## Mr.Eeks

Got my QT up and running $30 WalMart kit had basically everything I needed. So I'm just running the basic HOB filter cheap thermometer and hopefully go check out LFS tomorrow morning and scope it out. In the event I find something, how should the acclimation to QT go?
Float LFS bag with fish in QT for hour
Empty bag into container
Siphon water from QT with air hose and slowly drip into container
That sounds to me from reading to be the most common method. How long do I let it drip into the container before I net them and place them in QT? And once there its just observation (I found a page that was advocating pre-emptively treating fish with chems)? How often should I be doing water changes in QT, every day or every other most places I've read didn't really say. Then give them 3ish weeks in QT and as long as my DT has finished cycling do a big water change and I can toss them in?
Thanks a ton for the help guys/gals!!


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## coralbandit

I always drip everything(it is the best way).
Check the Qt daily for ammonia and nitrite since it isn't cycled and change water if either go over .5 ppm.You want to keep the levels very low since you're not trying to cycle the QT but more so assure the health of the fish.
I wouldn't medicate the fish unless you see a sign of infection as most meds stress fish anyways.


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## Mr.Eeks

My new Clowns :fish-in-a-bag:
Got some chunks of PVC that I will be tossing in so they can hide from my cats but otherwise this is my QT tank set up. Both are very lively since the transfer from the LFS, and continue to be. I have not fed them since I brought them home a couple hours ago, I think I will just wait until morning to do so. For food I got Hikari Mega Marine frozen food, it was recommended to me. Thanks for the help thus far guys/gals!


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## Mr.Eeks

This Thursday will be the end of the 9th week of tank cycling. My Nitrites still seem to be somewhere between 2.0ppm and 5.0ppm. My temps are fairly stable at 78, my SG is stable at 1.025. I took a picture of my most recent nitrogen related tests, they were performed minutes before posting this. I have not changed any filter media, water falls from tanks, thru a few layers of filter floss, a carbon pad, down to a layer of Chemi-Pure Elite, surrounded by more filter floss, then gets pumped back to the tank. Any tips or suggestions, or is it just going to be a couple more weeks? Thanks guys









The clowns are also doing well in the quarantine tank, they are eating very well, seem very active most of the time, will occasionally follow my finger around the glass. I will have had them in quarantine 2 full weeks this Thursday.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

So I ran a water sample from my main tank over to the LFS today to have them test it. They said its not quite ready, ammonia is good, zero they said, but nitrites are still around 3ppm and nitrates are at about 20ppm, but I'm just assuming (and correct me if I'm wrong) that could very well be because there isn't enough denitrifying bacteria to convert the nitrite to nitrate. I asked her about how much longer she said maybe another week or two.


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Nope haven't really done anything I haven't written about on this thread, could it have something to do with an open tank? I have yet get a glass cover because Petco n the other LFS here doesn't have one that will fit, but that's only because I have my overflow box on the end of my tank rather then on the back, so it doesn't need as long of a cover as they sell already made. Got the name of a glass place here in town that frequently puts covers together for customers aquariums. Other then that, I haven't really done anything at all to make except make sure my auto-fill box is regularly filled with RO/DI, and my testing. I haven't changed filter media, haven't added any, no PWC, no adding of decor/more/less rock. I've just tossed in 3 thawed shrimp (raw frozen from grocery store) on whatever date I had mentioned it above.
thanks for the help!


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## Reefing Madness

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## Mr.Eeks

Finally got everything to zero and am doing a PWC as I type this. Now I have thought of another question. Most of the threads I've read say after the cycle to do a big PWC like 50% range. Well if you look at my tank pics the way I have my rock positioned that is kinda of impossible without disturbing the rock formation or exposing the rock to air and killing the bacteria. Now as I am doing this I am gonna end up only being able to pull out around 16-17 gallons of water before I expose that rock to the air (which is all I am going to do). Is there anything wrong with this? Or should I just do another PWC in like a week and then call it good for a while? 
Also have decided that until I get some fish that like to jump I am going topless (oo la la). Clowns are doing well in the QT eating and swimming good. They seem quite healthy, though I have not fed them today as I think I am going to wait until later this evening after a few hours in DT and then see if they will eat.
Will post pics probably tomorrow or this weekend when I have time.
Thanks for all the help you guys have been!!


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## Reefing Madness

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