# Advice for beginning breeder



## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

I plan to start my business soon and need some advice. What species of fish/invert/plant could I breed/propagate to get a decent return. I have a lot of knowledge about the hobby but little actual experience, though I am almost certain I could handle most freshwater fish and inverts as well as some saltwater fish such as seahorses. Any advice would be appreciated. *c/p* Also, I know I won't get a huge return, but all I want is a little income. I was leaning towards seahorses, shrimp, and the like. I can't spend a lot of money and so the organism needs to be relatively low cost to set up and maintain while still being profitable.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Most fish or inverts take a little longer and cost a little more to breed and raise than most think.Turning a profit or even breaking even is WORK!
Look for simple fish that are hot now.
Showa swordtails would be a good start.Aqubids has some for sale,but many LFS don't even no about them,this makes them hot now.Being a livebearer they are pretty easy to breed ,raise and grow out fairly quickly.
As for seahorses,good luck!
Many of the shrimp are also "easy " to breed and are hot now also.


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## Tolak (Mar 10, 2013)

Every location is different as far as what sells well. Go to some local club auctions, see what moves for a decent price. Ask around shops, inform them of your plan, see what they would be interested in buying. 

Anything that is low cost to set up & maintain won't be a huge seller, but if you start small, reinvest any profit into your breeding program, as well as research what does sell there is potential for growth. For the setup buy as much gear as you can used, garage sales are great for 10 gallon tanks & such. Club auctions also sell tanks & related hardware, often for an incredibly cheap price.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

I will look into the shrimp and swordtails and will definitely ask around to see if I can't get a local fish store to buy some stock. As for the shrimp, how large of an aquarium would I need to make a decent shrimp hatchery? Thanks for the quick replies!


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

I breed guppies, found a local fish store that will buy them from me for what he would normally pay his dealer, so anywhere from $1 on up. Multiply that by the 20-100 fry each drop...decent return.


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## z1200 (Jan 26, 2012)

High dollar Guppy strains could probably turn a few coin. I breed guppies and all you need is a tank, filter, and some water. If you add Java moss, slate, and an extra tank, you'll be overrun before you know it.

Just remember you need a place to sell your stock -Z


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

I have bred guppies before, though if I do again I'd selectively breed them. I do have my work cut out for me whatever I decide, what with all the research and all.


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## tbub1221 (Nov 1, 2012)

I realize what your attempting to do , but truthfully its a little unrealistic . My good friend has more than 5k gallons in his home and basement. He raises peacocks and has close to 20 breeding males as well as c moorii(blue dolphin) by the hundreds ,E BLUE HAPS , Zrocks and many other things. He told me it ofcoarse starts as a hobby but grows you attempt to supplement income but that requires more time , water food cleaning etc its really a labor of love , breeders grow in outdoor concrete ponds in central and south Fla and in other warm places so they make there money on masses. But a mature male blue moorii sells for 35-50 locally for me and my buddy gives away more than he sells. Every time I see him its like a thing he makes me take fish not a fish last time it was amature M haps and 2 females .
I'm not saying you can't but the key really is something easy and something people want .
Guppies ate a hard one. I keep guppies a few different types and most ppl can't give them away. I got fifty for 5$ last saturday at my LfS sold as feeders , there are strains worth money ant yes there beautiful fish but iv no clue what they actually sell for , I just know that 40-60 $ is high for live bearers of any kind breeding pare or not. Iv seen before ppl on eBay sell a mated pare , it said garontee to give you laughed thinking every male guppie I ever had would screw anything especially a female guppies. 
I think if you wana go live bearer go swordtail..
If I was going to rais a fish to sell I'd get myself a few 20$Betta males to breed like king or elephant ears or german blue rams possibly. 
Either way you go best of luck.
I got 8$ a piece for my showa swordtail fry 2 months back at my LfS


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

Personally I have to agree with Tbub. Trying to breed for profit is really just probably not going to work. The only reason I started "breeding" was because I bought a female who was preggo and needed to find a way to get rid of the babies since I dont have room for 80+ fish right now. I just got lucky that a LFS will take them for what he normally pays based on color and pattern. You will really have to end up quitting your job, shelling out pockets of money to make breeding racks and getting tanks and probably finding a way to keep water changing constantly automatically (like petstores try to do). Essentially, you will probably have to start your own fish store.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

Honestly, I want to start my own lfs, hence my business. I am just trying to build up a reputation. I also hope to try and breed all types of fish so we don't have to deplete wild populations.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Go with SHOWAS!


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

How much do the showas go for? I looked them up on aquabid and there's 8 of them going for just over $20 bucks last I checked. Is this the regular price they go for? Thanks for all the replies and advice!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

$20 for a group or pair is fair.You don't want to breed cheap fish do you? GBR's may be fine if you have a place to send them and can get the right water quality for them.
Shrimp are a little different then fish on stocking and you really can get more per gallon(to start ) than fish.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

No, I don't want to breed cheap fish. I was just wondering if that was a fair price so I know how much I should pay for some and to help calculate return. Thanks again for everything!


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## Tolak (Mar 10, 2013)

If your looking to breed with the hopes of seeing a return you really do have to reverse engineer it. See what consistently sells well in your area. Find out if there is an opening where this species is wanted, but not being supplied. See what shops are selling them for, you can expect the shop to pay you about 1/3 that price. You might sell them at auctions & swaps for 50% to 80% of what shops are selling them for. l'd take a look on AquaBid as well, for price as well as turnover, nothing sucks worse than working hard to breed a species only to find out nobody wants them.

This should give you a ballpark figure of how many of what you can move for what price, start the budget there. Then look into what it takes to breed this species as far as hardware, consumables, and time. This comes out of the projected budget. Hardware can for the most part be bought used or built, consumables are an online purchase. Build as much as you can yourself, understand that tanks or a fishroom set up for breeding for profit don't look as pretty as show tanks.

Now just figure out how to breed the particular species, get good at it & you're off to the races! There's a lot of little time saving tricks that make running many tanks a whole lot easier, I've got 20 out of 30 running ATM, fishroom is oriented towards breeding angels. It took about 8 years & several reconfigurations to get it to this, I've got an expansion/upgrade planned, but it's too darn nice out now to be messing around with fish in the basement!


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## henningc (Apr 17, 2013)

Angel fish. Been there done that. Guppys,lots of small tanks, swords, multiple 20L-55S for grow out. Angels, a couple of 29s a 10 or two and a 55 for grow out-DONE.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

Okay. I may be out of date with my info, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm right, Puntius denisonii (Roseline Shark) are not currently bred in captivity. I know I probably won't get a great return with these fish, but one of my goals for breeding fish is to save the wild populations from endangerment so they don't go extinct in the wild. Are these bred in captivity? I don't mean in fish farms that use hormones to incite the fish to breed. I can't stand that. Are they being bred in captivity to help relieve the stress on the wild population? I believe I can breed these fish. I think I know how to naturally incite them to breed. *c/p* I will talk to my lfs to see if they would be willing to buy these from me if they spawn.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Share your idea on "inciting " them as I have 14 in my 180 for last 4 years+.
Basically they are bred now buy fish farms(using hormones) and no one else is claiming otherwise.I to have been very interested in helping to preserve them as they were on endagered list.I don't believe they are now,as petsmart usaully stocks them for $7.99 and puts them on sale for $5.99(which is how I ended up with so many ).I paid over $20 for my first 5 or so,but that was 4+ years ago and the most expensive fish shop I ever visit.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

Okay, here goes.

Basically, from a ton of research of how to breed them (which I've been doing since I heard about them approximately a year ago), my guess would be that you have to replicate the monsoon season. I read a drop of pH and other things that happen in a monsoon season have happened in aquariums where they have "accidently" been spawned. I found this yesterday in a 5 minute google search just to see if anything was updated as far as if anyone has been able to get them to spawn: Breeding Roseline Barbs (Puntius Denisoni) I know it's from 2009, but the last post on this link sums up my research nicely: simulate the monsoon season. The rainy (monsoon) season is a major breeding period for a lot of characins/cyprinids, so it's worth a shot.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

First thanks for sharing!Second OH BOY if it is that simple then it will happen.Next I'll share that these fish will probly not spawn in anything under 75G,but maybe 4x12 (55,40,33Long) would work also.
I could easily clear out my 75 grow out and even have a 55& 33long!
Your info sounds good and would seem to be common sense.Along with pH drop ,temp swing going down(possibly 5-10 degrees) will be necessary.Maybe even the addition of soil type substrate or floating "silt" would be beneficial?Peat moss comes to mind quickly to aid in pH decrease and "cloud "water with tannins and even allow some to enter active water column?
Again thanks for sharing,I rarely give this advice to people,but go to petsmart and buy them cheap!
Petco will be having their dollar per gallon sale soon(seems like every 3 months) and they sell 55 and 40 breeders for a dollar per gallon,so in theory you could be up and running for well under $150 with 4-6 fishin tank to experiment with!
Even if the money isn't great and they take a little more effort,I'm all about it as I don't breed for profit as much as I do for pride.The store credit or money doesn"t pain me though.
The LFS that takes anything I breed from me sells the roseline for $20 still!
On average you can get 25-33% of selling price if you can hook up!


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

Oh, and don't forget to add extra food to simulate the extra food that would be in the water in the wild.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

I will post a new thread soon outlining the steps I think people should follow to breed Puntius denisonii. It will be a rough outline, but I think it's time the world knew how to breed these marvelous fish. Oh, and coralbandit? Feel free to try and breed them and tell us all how it works out. I will get some ASAP and do the same.


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## tbub1221 (Nov 1, 2012)

other than dropping the water lvl down some half way and increasing the temp then slowly adding water and bumping the ph what could one do to better recreate this ??


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

I am about to cover that in my new thread. It'll be in the breeding freshwater fishes and inverts section.


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

What kind of shrimp should make a good return? I've been looking at OEBT (Orange Eyed Blue Tiger) Shrimp.

So far, I know I am going to start with:
1) Puntius denisonii (Roseline Shark)
2) Showa Swordtails
3) Triops Cancriformis (I think they're cool and would make great fish food)
4) Some species of shrimp (Hence my question above.)

*c/p*

Thanks again for all the quick replies!


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

I agree the Triops are cool!! What can they be fed to though?


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## J4C8_GreenGo (May 19, 2013)

@ Jamnigh: I think they could be fed to smaller fish when the triops hatch and larger fish when the triops are adults.

Also, I want shrimp that do not have a larval stage. I am also looking at blue pearl shrimp. Do OEBT shrimp and blue pearl shrimp have a larval stage when they breed? Thanks!


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

Nice. I was just reading...so the eggs need to be dried out before they will hatch? I've been looking into trying to find a food source I can essentially grow and have live in my tank and just be a continuous source...like these

Gammarus Scuds Starter Culture Free Shipping Aquaponic Earthworms | eBay


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