# Dingo Ate My Baby



## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

Well, more like "Whisker shrimp ate my Neon" (use Aussie accent).

Bought 2 Whisker Shrimp for my 37 gal tank. One a little over an inch the other maybe 1 3/4 inches. Tank has 8 Neon Tetras and 3 platties, with plenty of "cover".

First night after lights out, 2 hrs later a Neon Tetra was mangled, basically just a gnarly head was left.

The next day I noticed 2 of the other tetras were missing their tail flukes. They seem to be OKAY for now, they swim and feed like the others. But another one of the smallest tetras had a cut up face and torso; it did not make it overnight.

After watching the tank for a while I noticed the shrimp stalking the tetras. Sneaking up on the little guys when they were just chillin out.

There should have been plenty for the shrimp to eat other than the tetras. I had not vacuumed for 8 days. Water tests fine across the board.

I am 99% sure these are real Whisker Shrimp. Look just like pics I found online. I took them back to the LFS.

So for next few days I am watching the tetras for more damage although I really doubt the platties are attacking the tetras.

Other than small cat fish or the tinier Ghost Shrimp, what is a good bottom feeder who won't eat the tetras and platties?


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## Fishrule912 (Jan 20, 2013)

With neon tetras and platies...how about loaches? Not clown loaches--they get too large--but I think some dojo loaches (also known as weather loaches) would do well.


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## ScurvyGoat (Dec 1, 2011)

In a 37 you could get a couple of the smaller cory cats no problem. I love cories and try to get them in as many of my tanks as I can. We call them lil tug boats lol! They'll clean the tank up good. If you have algae problems I suggest Amano shrimp or a group of oto cats. Those guys do an awesome job.


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

I had forgotten about this thread. I am posting a followup.

My Neon tetras all grew back their tail flukes! I wound up getting 3 cory catfish and 3 ottos. I'm going to get a few more cories as the debris in the gravel is more than I'd like to admit.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Getting more fish to clean up debris in gravel?The fish ,and possibly overfeeding and lack of maintenace would be the cause of the debris.I would recommend vacumming more often or feeding less.
You may well be able to fit more fish,but don't expect them to clean your tank for you.


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

coralbandit said:


> Getting more fish to clean up debris in gravel?The fish ,and possibly overfeeding and lack of maintenace would be the cause of the debris.I would recommend vacumming more often or feeding less.
> You may well be able to fit more fish,but don't expect them to clean your tank for you.


Agreed here. If there is a lot of debris in the gravel that means there is too much food going in the tank and the fish can't eat it all. I would suggest getting a couple more cory's. Not to clean the tank, but to make them happier (they do best in groups of 6 or more). Try feeding less, vacuum more often, and you should be fine.


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

My main focus on the update is that the tetras grew back their tail flukes.


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

Good, glad to hear your fish are ok!

But there is also no harm in someone passing along some info and experience to try and help you have a nicer, cleaner, more enjoyable aquarium :animated_fish_swimm 

I agree about the corys though! I love those little guys! They will keep things clean but they won't take away all your maintenance.


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## CAM (Jan 27, 2013)

Yep... my Army of Cories likes to fly around the tank and look for pieces of leftover flakes, bloodworms, brine shrimp, or whatever the last meal consisted of. They also like to sniff around my artificial plants cleaning them off... guess they are eating some algea. 

But they sure can't dig into the gravel and clean up the mulm. So it's very important to vacuum the top inch or two of the substrate to keep a clean environment for all the occupants and not expect the Cories to do that.


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

I do not vacuum as much as I used to. This is on purpose. On the advice of a long standing LFS, this has vastly helped get my new-ish 37 gal tank completely cycled.

Anyway, I do vacuum and change water. Just not weekly. More like every 2 weeks for vacuuming, and I do a different section each time. And water changes are monthly.

So far so good.


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## Kehy (Apr 19, 2011)

What size are your water changes? I tend to prefer weekly 20% water changes, and while I could go for longer, I just flat out don't feel comfortable going more than 2 weeks without a water change.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Sorry but,how can you vac every two weeks and change water once a month?They usaully both occur together?


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## rtmaston (Jul 14, 2012)

I like the cory.i vacuum a part of my gravel every week.cory will help but nothing will take the place of doing a gravel vac.


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

coralbandit said:


> Sorry but,how can you vac every two weeks and change water once a month?They usaully both occur together?



Amazon.com: Marina Multi-Vac Battery Powered Vacuum: Pet Supplies


*whistle*


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Those only remove actuall physical matter and dump all the other crap back into your tank.You can't see nitrAtes or just pass them through a product and have them disappear.Vacumming with that "device" is truely only for your asthestic pleasure and serves little to no purpose or good for your fish.And changing water once a month,I truely hope you change at least 75% then as even that is too little of a monthly turn over.IMO all tanks should be turned over at least 100% per month.And to quote Charles(inkmaker) "you need to flush the toilet more often".


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

coralbandit said:


> Those only remove actuall physical matter and dump all the other crap back into your tank.You can't see nitrAtes or just pass them through a product and have them disappear.Vacumming with that "device" is *truely* only for your asthestic pleasure and serves little to no purpose or good for your fish.And changing water once a month,I *truely* hope you change at least 75% then as even that is too little of a monthly turn over.IMO all tanks should be turned over at least 100% per month.And to quote Charles(inkmaker) "you need to flush the toilet more often".


 Aren't you just a little ray of sunshine! You make a lot of ASSumptions with your condescending posts.

Yep I can't see nitrATes. Nor nitrItes. Not even Ammonia. And I do NOT have any detected with my API Master Test Kit. You must be having fits over this.

It *TRULY* seems that if someone doesn't do it YOUR way then it cannot possibly work or be correct.

This is working for me. Now piss off. I don't abide rude children.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

It was not my intention to make you feel so defensive,nor to "fluff" you about your approach to maintenance.
Condescending would be to say you are not a fish keeper ,but more someone with an aquarium.
If you say you no nitrAtes I question your honesty or the true condition of your tank(probably both).
I have not written any books about how I keep fish,but have read a few and make recommendations that are endorsed by knowledgable,known authors and scientist.
Your way may be working ,but is not the best(even par)nor should given to others as this is all you need to do.I'm sure somewhere inbetween my practice and yours(there is quite some distance) there is acceptable habbits.Water changes once a month is no where near enough and I would love to hear from all who think you are correct.
I appreciate your suggestion(and correcting my spelling{TRULY HELPFUL},but I feel I was not rude and as much as it would seem an appropriate response to be rude to you,I will wish you and your fish good luck(as I feel they need and deserve it) and mention I am a 48 year child who has been keeping fish for more than 30 years.Some of my fish are almost 10 years old(I can't imagine with your attittude, short temper and lack of proper maintenance that you will ever see anyrthing close to that).
I will however return the favor and correct you also:FISH DON'T HAVE FLUKES,mamals and inverts do,fish have FINS.
And although I started with it was not my intention to "upset" you ,I feel the need to say I'm NOT sorry!Most people who become so defensive know in their hearts(however tiny and misformed) that what they are doing is wrong.
It's 9:45 a.m. here on the east coast of America and I'd like to say GOOD MORNING!(That's your wake up call!)


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

Wow there chillax a second. Bandit offers good advice. He is a lot over what most people do for water changes, but that doesn't make him or anyone else wrong for doing such high amounts of WC. I don't do anywhere near what he does for WC and my tanks are fine. But take the text for what it is. The information was stating that what you are using for tools are not the best that's all.


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## WalkGood (Dec 8, 2012)

hotwingz said:


> Wow there chillax a second. Bandit offers good advice. He is a lot over what most people do for water changes, but that doesn't make him or anyone else wrong for doing such high amounts of WC. I don't do anywhere near what he does for WC and my tanks are fine. But take the text for what it is. The information was stating that what you are using for tools are not the best that's all.


I am quite relaxed "tank you" very much. I never said or implied that very frequent water changes are wrong. I am following a prescribed schedule that is working very well for me.

I vacuum surface debris with the battery operated vacuum. Nothing "wrong" with this at all. When I do a water change, I do it with a gravel siphon which does remove the visible debris and finer invisible bad stuff. I kinda wish I had bought the Python faucet setup as it seems a lot easier than siphon into a bucket.

And regardless of others disbelief, my water tests are ZERO (0) for ammonia, nitrItes and nitrAtes. Using a fresh API master kit.

My freshwater community of neon tetras, platies, cories and ottos are all very happy and active. We even have a bunch of baby platy fry. My various plants are thriving and growing. And even the few snails that hitched onto the plants are active. I have very little visible algae - Ottos are busy.

*rotating smile


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

Ok, this clarifies a few things. Thank you. If this is working for you than fine. I would probably suggest upping your water change too. I started doing this, as recommended by bandit and my fish are brighter more active and my plants are starting to creep! I got in the habit of changing one gallon a night from each of my tanks. Not a hard thing to do. But it has helped.


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## CAM (Jan 27, 2013)

See Bandit's profile? See how many times he's been thanked?

He's only trying to help because he genuinely cares about fish so much.... his, yours, mine, ones in the wild............

I hope you come to realize that and say the right words.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

I know enough to let sleeping dogs(or dingos) lie. And my desire to help this individual lacks(slightly) but I am concerned for his fish as CAM stated. Doesn't ANYONE have anything to say about a "cycled " tank that only has water changed once a month(who knows how little) with no trace of nitrAtes?
I'll say shake your bottle and re-read the directions.
Anyone else?


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## CAM (Jan 27, 2013)

I think that claim speaks for itself, Bandit.

Hell, my tap water contains 5 ppm Nitrates so it's more cycled than that tank. ;-)


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

I can't say much for the chemistry on my tanks, I don't check it...I know, I know. But I keep an eye on others signs, mainly my plants. For example and keep this in mind I did this for a while until just recently. I agree and now a big supporter of WC. But before, I would only fill up the tanks with what had evaporated, and had no problems. With that said, they are much healthier now that I have been changing water regularly.


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## CAM (Jan 27, 2013)

hotwingz said:


> I can't say much for the chemistry on my tanks, I don't check it...I know, I know.............. But before, I would only fill up the tanks with what had evaporated



GASP!!!!!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

First I really wanted to thank CAM twice for his GASP!But more over I do APPRECIATE YOUR HONESTY HOTWINGZ,so I'll fill you in.Keepers cycle their tanks so ammonia will be converted to nitrItes,then to nitrAtes.A HEALTHY CYCLED tank will have no ammonia or nitrItes,BUT ALWAYS NITRATES!They are the end game of a cycled filter and the only way to remove them(and we do want them to be removed) is to do waterchanges.It's the same as any other other nutrient in that the % of water removed is the % nitrAtes will be reduced.Acceptable limits on nitrAtes could be as high as 40 ppm so if you only changed 50% with a reading of 40 ppm(and the API liquid test kit reads up to 180ppm for a reason,and I highly doubt the OP of this thread does this much)then you would still have 20ppm nitrAtes.99.9% of the time if a newb post they have no nitrAtes everyone and anyone (who knows) would say that they are not cycled yet.
So to REPEATEDLY say you have no detectable nitrates in an established aquarium,is either totall BS or the poster does not know how to properly test.If I had to choose ,I couldn't,I'm going with both!


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## CAM (Jan 27, 2013)

I'd bet there is no testing. The cover-up disclosed a lack of understanding of the nitrogen cycle.

It's a shame he got all ruffled instead of accepting help and seeking knowledge.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

So I'm not in this to win an argument but TRULY to help.OP would not be the first or last to receive bad info from lfs and run with it.
I SAW A GLIMMER OF HOPE IN THAT HE HAD WISHED HE PURCHASED A PYTHON FOR EASING WATERCHANGES.
IT'S NOT TO LATE,BUY ONE WALKGOOD.MAKE DOING THE RIGHT THING EASIER(THAT IS NOT A CRIME).
If your tank does really look good and you enjoy it take it from Hotwingz the advice I offer(it's only advice) will pay off .Change just a little more water a little more often.The colors in your neons WILL be more robust,THE GROWTH RATE of your fry wil excell.I'm not going to complain about changing water,but if I could get the same results without it I would.I'd sit back sip on one more beer and stare at my little piece of art.Unfortunately ,after 30+ years I know I will have to take my beer downstairs (instead of sitting back) and change some water.My main tank is semi automated (and a little easier) but all my others I vac with buckets(a python won't work for me downstairs).
I'm not sure if the marineland battery vac was part of the lfs info on how you could do less,but I'm not charging or selling any accessories with my advice.Try it out(with the python) and see for yourself.
I'm not sure how familiar with this site you are but when I'm signed in and view your post I can see who else is viewing your post,so I know without you replying ,that you have read all of todays post,you were here when I made my last post.I think the python would be a good investment and use it every two weeks instead of the battery powered thing.That alone will add more fresh water and improve things for you.I'm not posting to knock you down,I would rather you really did well,your tank really looked great and your fish were really healthy and happy.
Again just advice ,no obligation,and just saying.I post for others because I care,my fish are well,this sorta thing is karma for me and I don't need to be causing aggrevation,that was never my intention.
Tom


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## lonedove55 (Jan 25, 2012)

Sorry, but just had to chime in on this thread..you might want to check out this link...seems like others are having this same problem with the "Whisker Shrimp"...whisker shrimp

And A++++++ to coralbandit's responses....*w3


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

I personally, dont see the point in getting all ruffled up on bandits advice lol. I have only been on here but a short time, and everybody seems to only offer advice, not attack others. I'll be honest, along with hotwingz, for years I couldn't tell you the chemistry of my tanks. Now I check once in a while, but frequent water changes keep everything happy!

Kudos though to bandits responses....loved em!


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

Ya I need to get myself a test kit. I know this lol. But I'm cheap and my tanks are healthy. Plus, there is going to be a biiiiiiig fish show coming to town in a June and part of the registration is a gift bag worth $200+ at the moment, which has a master test kit *whistle*


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Change water religously until June then!


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## hotwingz (Mar 3, 2013)

Haha ya I have been...well for the most part. I work 50+ hours most weeks so, some days it doesn't get done.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

We all work and I hear ya!If you are hanging out and think of it ,then do it.
I'll quote Charles(inkmaker )again(his signature)CHANGE AS MUCH WATER AS OFTEN AS YOU CAN!
Charles is still an active and very valuable member of this site,I hope you never need to talk with him(he makes the meds for camallanus,among other horrible diseases{he's a retired chemist})He knows what the real deal is,and between him and Navigator Black(gone and missed daily by me) I've learned a ton from them!


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

I'm with ya Hotwingz. I work about 70 hours a week, and dont get to WC as much as I would like, but every other night before bed I try to get at least a little bit in, and do a bigger WC on the weekends at some point.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

For those of you who are cycled you only really need a nitrAte kit ,not the whole master kit,as you should have well passed the ammonia ,nitrIte phase of the show.And I know you all read other post, but I can highly recommend PURIGEN from seachem.Among all the other crap and making your water crystal clear,it does do some work on eliminating nitrAtes!


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