# New tank question.



## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

I just got a 20 gallon tank 2 weeks ago. When I was setting it up I took the fake plants from my old tank and placed them into the new one. I started putting fish into the new tank 2 days after setting it up, and have been putting them in two at a time about every 3 days. Its now been 2 weeks and I have 8 small fish in it. Since I set up the tank I have had the water tested about every 2-3 days and every time It has been perfect except for it has been a little alkaline. 
My question: Shouldn't the ammonia levels be very elevated because I have been putting too many fish in it too fast. Has putting the plants from my old tank into the new tank speed up the cycle.


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## tate23am (Nov 5, 2008)

You will eventually get a spike of ammonia in your tank. the plants might help a little with whatever bacteria they might have on them. but it will not be enough to cycle your tank in that time since they are fake. I woul suggest not putting more fish since you migh loose most of them when the soike hits. I have always use the hekp of Cycle concentrated bacteria bottle. it seems to help in the process time. I hav never had a fish loss when in cycle. but I dont put too many at the beginning.


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## MediaHound (Jul 19, 2006)

I agree with Tate, just be patient now and dont add any more fish till you are sure its established and you have a good colony of beneficial bacteria in place. 
btw, the more alkaline the water is, the more toxic the same amount of ammonia becomes, keep that in mind as well, because your tank is alkaline


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

I did forget to mention that I am using Cycle, so that should help a bit. So you really think I will loose some fish when the spike hits?


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## djrichie (May 15, 2008)

Do you have a friend with an established tank.... If so see if you can get the dirty white floss from his filter and cut it into strip and put it in you filter box. This will seed the tank better than CYCLE. Also you will need to do daily WC's you have alot of bio-load on the the tank and if it doesn't kill the fish outright you run a good chance of gill damage, which wioll lead to more problems down the road for your fish and you.


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## motoracergabe (Dec 3, 2008)

what is this "dirty white floss"...?


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## eaglesfan3711 (Nov 16, 2008)

the tank will continue to cycle through and that is when it will spike.


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## djrichie (May 15, 2008)

the white materal that filters the water is called floss.... get some from a friend who filter is running have him change the floss and that it home and put it in your tank filter, it will seed the tank.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

I just had my water tested and the guy said that the ammonia levels are very high. He also told me that I should not do a water change seeing how my tank is still so new and hasn't gone through the cycle yet. Is this what I should do or is there something else I should do.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

If the tank didn't have any fish, I would leave it alone and let it cycle, but since you have put fish in it, I would do a water change at least every couple of days. The tank will cycle but your fish won't hurt as bad going through the spikes.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

Well Im getting a lot of conflicting info here so Im not sure what to do. It seems to me that doing a water change would help but the guy at the store told me not to.

Also, if I should do a water change should I just do the water or should I vacuum out the rocks as well.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

You can vac the gravel to get out any wastes and food that goes to the bottom.

Most people in fish stores will tell you wrong. You can let the fish go through the cycle without water changes but would end up hurting your fish.

Picture it this way. You have to live in a closet with no toilet, fresh air or water. Live that way for 6 weeks. You are having to leave your personal wastes anywhere that you can. What kind of condition do you think that you would be in, in 6 weeks. Not very healthy if you are still alive.

Sorry to be so blunt, but that is the easiest way to show you what the fish will go through not doing any water changes.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

makes sense. Thanks for the vivid explanation =)

How much water should I change out.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Your welcome, wish I could have given a better example but that is the best way to look at it.

I would change out at least 25 to 30% every other day. Keep check on your ammonia and nitrite levels if they stay up go to every day. If you can add lots of fast growing plants like hornwort, duckweed, elodea, frogbit and such it would help it a lot in cycling, If you put in enough to cover at least 75% of the tank, you should be able to cut back water changes to a couple of times a week.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

Are you talking about doing a water change every other day forever or just until the spike is over.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Just until the cycle finishes, then you can go to once a week water changes.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

Ill do that then. Thanks.


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## djrichie (May 15, 2008)

Just change the water you don't want to gravel vac... that were the major portion of the Bac is growing.... just siphon out the water.... also cut back the amount of food. Like I seid see if you can seed the tank with bac from another tank.....

Also the guy at the store must not have know you have fish in the tank already or he want to sell you new fish when they all die from have the gills burnt from the ammonia or he just a complete idoit. You need to get your own water testing kit.. and test your water readings dailly and when you reach 20ppm in ammonia than do a 20% water change. just the water no vacuming. Add some low light fast growing plants water sprite will do the trick. Your tank needs to cycle, but you don't want to kill your fish.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

I really want to get real plants but the plants at the store are not very healthy looking and they have mold growing on them. So I decided against it.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

shouldn't that ammonia reading be .20. Other wise if you get it up to 20 your fish will be dead no matter what. Doing a vac of the gravel won't remove the bacteria it will just clean the waste from around it. If it would remove bacteria you would never want to rinse out your filter material in old tank water either as it would kill the bacteria, but that isn't the case.


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## djrichie (May 15, 2008)

most people understand 20ppm or .20... (but yes it was a typing error) I try and stay away from saying this but you are WRONG Susan... that brown stuff you are Vacuming up is Bac.... Right now she wants ever bit of it in the tank.... to break down the ammonia.... after the tank is cycled than she can Vacume the gravel..... When you stock fish to an uncycled tank, not just some term cycling fish, your concern is not for the looks of the tank its for the life of the fish..... A newbe mistake was made and I have a fealing it was caused bad advice, at the LFS level. I would start looking for a Mom and Pop LFS that has been around. Yes they still want to sell you something but they generally know what to do and what to give you, to fix the problem. Chain Stores hire anyone to work there.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

I understand what you are saying but you also have to look at the fact that it won't be good mulm till the bacteria breaks it down. What it does during cycling it will cause ammonia and nitrites to spike, to help the bacteria build up. But with fish in the tank you don't want that type of ammonia.

In fact the best advice I can really give is to either take the fish back or find someone to hold the fish till the tank cycles. Or try to find someone with a healthy tank to give you some filter media or even gravel that has been in the tank for a long while.

Mulms best use is for plants to utilize it for nutrients.


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## tate23am (Nov 5, 2008)

1st I would leave the gravel alone for the first few weeks. you dont want to disturb the bacteria thats growing there. since the tank is rather new you shouldn't have to much accumulation in the gravel as long as you dont over feed your fish. keep the feeding low!

2nd see if your LFS will hold your fish while your tank cycles. When I move from Miami to Orlando I had a LSF hold mine for three weeks. had no problems with them. the good stores are alays weeling to help to promote their business. If you fine one willing I suggest making a list of your fish and make the holding tank has no other fish or at least that they mark what is yours.

3rd like Richie mentioned try to get filter pads or a bit of gravel from a established tank. that will help a lot in the cycle time. some LFS will sell you a portion of substrate from their tanks.

last if have to keep your fish in the tanks check your ammonia levels daily and make sure it doesnt go too high. make water changes but dont do too much to wipe out all the ammonia or your tank will take forever to cycle.

i think that would cover most of it.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

I just got some ammonia test strips and it says that my level is at about 2.0 ppm. Is that still way high, I know that it should be at 0ppm but I'm not sure if 2ppm is a lot.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Any thing over .25 is to much for the fish. You should do a water change.


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## TheCheeseWizz (Dec 9, 2008)

Even if I just did one yesterday.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

anything over .25 is toxic to the fish, so its up to you, but I would.


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## djrichie (May 15, 2008)

yes you need to do a 20% WC and you may need to do it everyday until you get it under control.......anytime you see it above point 20 you need to do it. Also those strips are not the best thing to use, they are effected by humitity in the air and will give you false reading..... a COMPLETE FRESHWATER TESTING KIT, they a the liquids you have to add the drops to, they will give you the truest readings


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