# An Idea and Some Questions about Beaslbob Method



## Kazzy (Jan 3, 2011)

Well, after reading several different methods of creating a self sustaining environment in a tank I think I've got a plan for mine. Here goes:

Since this will be trial and error I've decided to do it in a small (10g) tank just so it's easier to remove everything and start again should something go wrong. So here's my 'ingredients' list:

10 Gallon Tank
Soil (probably clay then some organic potting soil)
Bucket
Sand (gravel works too)
Fast growing plants (will add slow growers later mainly so I can get the plants rooting faster through the soil to help with any bubbles forming)
Peat moss
Spray Bottle
Glass top
Lighting (of course)
Heater (off course)
Water (well, duh...) from one of my established tanks
Bunch of blood worms and MTS

So, here's what I'm basically going to do. I'm going to collect some clay soil (which I know we have plenty here. also, clay is nutrient rich but releases nutrients slowly) and put it in a bucket after breaking it up and pulling out rocks and such. Fill the bucket with water just to the surface of the soil, stir, and then remove any plant matter, etc. that floats to the top. Let dry, then do it all over again. 

Meanwhile I'll have the tank all cleaned and purdy while soaking some peat moss. Once the the peat moss has soaked up a good amount of water I'll place it on the bottom of the tank with a small amount of water from one of my established tanks(just to keep the moss wet). Once the clay has dried out again I'll put a very thin layer (just an inch) over the moss and then add a very thin layer of the organic potting soil (just an inch, maybe less). Add more water (again, from one of my established tanks) VERY slowly (place plate into tank and pour what over that) and just so it covers the soil. 

Now that the first few layers of the substrate are in I'll add my blood worms and wait for them so burrow into the soil (just FYI, these will be replenished every so often if they don't manage to breed on their own, and they will be food to anything that catches them as well as help keep any pockets of anaerobic bacteria from forming as they will 'stir' the soil). 

After the blood worms have all borrowed I'll add an inch of sand, again adding water just the cover the sand. Now I plant my fast rooting plants, as well as add any decor I don't plan on attaching other plants to (they will be added later). I'll spray the edges of the tank with dechlorinated water and place the glass lid on and the lights. 

I'll let this sit like this for probably a week or two (depending on how the plants are rooting), continuing to spray the inside of the tank to keep it nice and humid. 

Once the roots have grown decently and everything looks nice and healthy I'll add my slow growing plants, rest of the decor, and fill the rest of the water up and add the heater and MTS. For about another week I'll just keep track of the parameters and add a tiny bit of fish food to the tank every other day (by tiny I mean like maybe 1 flake, or 1 pellet). 

Once the parameters look good and everything seems to be staying consistent I'll add either 1 fish or 1 shrimp (depending on what I plan to keep in it, which will probably just be shrimp). I will continue to only feed a tiny tiny bit 
every other day and continue to test the water. If everything still looks consistent for a week I'll add about 4-5 more shrimp/fish (again, depending), feed a little bit more, and watch for another week. 

If everything continues to look good for that week I'll begin to gradually add more shrimp/fish and up the food (GRADUALLY!) until I feel that it is fully stocked. 

I won't be doing any water changes on this, and won't run a filter. All I'll have to do is prune the plants, feed everyone (not the plants, don't plan on using fertilizers), and top off the water.

Since it will be heavily planted, the plants will be able to take care of the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. And since the tank will be heavily stocked the livestock will be able to feed the plants. I'll just have to very closely monitor how much the plants need from the livestock, what the can take from the water, and what they can add. Same goes for the livestock. 

Once I can get this set up I'll post here how everything is going, including daily param readings and probably pictures to show the 'step by step'. Let me know what you think of this!

This is basically a mix of the Beaslbob method, a method from another member on another forum, and a few things I added. Here are my questions:

1.) Without water changes, would this greatly deplete the trace elements, buffers, minerals, etc.? Or would frequent top offs (depending on how much the water evaporates) replenish these? 
2.) For those using this method, how long have you had the tank(s) set up without water changes?
3.) Has anyone had a tank crash from this method, considering the loss of the elements, etc., and how long was the tank set up before it crashed? What caused the crash, if you know?

Thanks!!!


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## Niki7 (Aug 16, 2010)

Wow! seems like you have it all planned out...don't forget to have fun!

Having just done a beaslbob planting, I just have a couple comments. First, a 10 gal tank is TINY. You are looking at putting 3 1/2" of substrate in such a tiny tank that the plants may outgrow it very quickly because there isn't much headroom. I'm new to this too so maybe someone else will correct me on this! 

Secondly, I found that no matter how careful I was with the sand, peat, etc, there was still a ton of it floating around in the water. I found a fiilter absolutely necessary to clear it up quickly because peat floats for a LONG time! Maybe if I was patient and waited a couple weeks it would have settled but I couldn't wait that long! *sh

Not sure why you are waiting to fill the tank? Also, I've never used bloodworms, so that is new to me.

Good luck, and btw, welcome to the forum! *w2


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## Kazzy (Jan 3, 2011)

Thanks! I've since made a few changes after talking to a few others on a few other boards, so going to list them here:

The soil will be a mix of pond soil (collected from a local pond from a nicely established area, i.e. lots of plant growth), a tiny bit a clay (as it is iron rich and don't want iron poisoning the tank), OC potting soil, and maybe a small bit of peat moss (mainly because peat moss is a nonrenewable resource, which I just learned, so don't really want to mess with it too much and cause damage). I may change this mix a little bit (getting some ideas about sawdust actually, will get back to you on that). The soils will all be mixed together and there will only be a 2" layer, then a 1" layer of sand.

Just to answer some questions and clear some things up:

Why I'm not filling the water right away: Aquatic place are basically bog plants. They are made to live on land but can adapt to living submerged in water. Since they are made to live on land, being emerged will quicken their growth of roots (main priority) and leaves. Also, the plants will be able to easily pull CO2 directly from the atmosphere, which is a little harder for them to do submerged. This will ensure that my soil substrate mix will have a decent amount of roots running through it, which means the nutrient rich soils won't start leaking too much into the water, killing any fish/shrimp/etc. Also means the plants will have a better start in the tank. Side note: Since adding water too quickly may cause stress to the plants with the depletion of CO2 I plan to slowly fill the water in the tank. Just a small amount each day so as to slowly acclimate them.

Meant to say black worms, not blood worms...so anywhere I said blood worms, replace with black worms. Whoops! Blood worms live in the water column, black worms in the substrate. The black worms will help with three things...they will continuously stir my soil (which otherwise I would have to 'poke' fairly often to discourage pockets of bad bacteria which can easily crash a tank with soil substrate), they will eat anything and everything that the other critters don't eat so they'll help cut down on anything rotting in the tank, and thirdly...if they end up on the surface they will feed my fish/shrimp 

I know this is a small tank, but I do plan on using small plants (mainly ground plants since it will be a shrimp tank (yes, finally decided on shrimp) and anything that I get that grows too big will be moved VERY carefully to another tank but going to try to avoid that). I haven't decided on plants yet but I know for sure I will have some moss...well, lots of moss. Plus a good bit of floating plants once water is added.

Hopefully I won't have an issue with soil and sand settling since I'll be adding the water slowly over time (and when pouring the water I'll be sure to do so INCREDIBLY slowly, hopefully find a way to reduce splashing. If I have a problem with it I'll try to deal with it...if I can deal with it...well, I have a filter for the 10g I have in mind for this little project just in case 

I will probably have a powerhead in the tank mainly because I hope to be able to get a clam (just one) and hopefully have it survive (also, forgot to add, if I get the clam there will be a thin piece of plexiglass between sand and soil with holes drilled throughout it that let plenty of the roots to go through but doesn't allow the clam to borrow passed the sand).

Hope that covers everything!


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Kazzy said:


> Has anyone had a tank crash from this method, considering the loss of the elements, etc., and how long was the tank set up before it crashed? What caused the crash, if you know?


I've never even dared to try such an endeavor, but a friend of mine tried using potting soil and ended up leeching some pretty nasty chems into the water that destroyed his tank. Can't remember what chems (he used a specific term like ozmo-somethingorother), all I remember is the potting soil severely ruined his tank.

My only advice - be careful and bury that stuff DEEP.


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## Kazzy (Jan 3, 2011)

Yes, you have to be VERY careful when using soils. He probably had built up pockets of bad bacteria which seems to be the biggest killer in this type of tank. As long as you watch it (or in this case, smell it as this bacteria build up will smell like sulfur) and have good root growth you'll be fine.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

Would MTS help?


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Kazzy said:


> ...
> 
> 1.) Without water changes, would this greatly deplete the trace elements, buffers, minerals, etc.? Or would frequent top offs (depending on how much the water evaporates) replenish these?


Actually could go either way. I have found tanks with peat tend to maintain kh and gh at reasonalble values for years. But my tanks with just sand have both kh and gh rise.


> 2.) For those using this method, how long have you had the tank(s) set up without water changes?


IME up to 9 years with descendants for the original cycle trio. Numerous times in the 5-7 year range. And ditto for marine tanks as well.


> 3.) Has anyone had a tank crash from this method, considering the loss of the elements, etc., and how long was the tank set up before it crashed? What caused the crash, if you know?


I have had 1 tank crash after I rinsed crushed oyster shells in a marine system wearing gloves that has an oil on them. Ammonia pegged the api test kit (8+ppm) in less that a few hours. I was able to remove most fish, treat with prime and ammonia dropped down 2 days ofter rinsing the shells with no gloves. Lost 2 of 8 fish and all corals. never had a tank crash with FW tanks.


> Thanks!!!


Welcome.

You use of black worms is interesting and reminds my of the DSB operation in saltwater tanks. Where the worms are used for the same purpose to help the sand process nitrates.

I do use the pc select as my clay source which is a baked clay kinda like a red/brown gravel.


I do feel that as long as you are heavily planted everything else is secondary.

Keep us posted


my .02


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## Chillwill007 (Aug 20, 2010)

If you use floor dry from TSC it will save you asl the steps to dry out and soft and dry out your clay idea. Its 3 or 4 different kind of dried out clay. And for $5 for a 40 lb bag can't beat it
Safe T Sorb Oil Absorbent, 40 lb. - 0800989 | Tractor Supply Company
I'm gonna use this and mix it in with peat moss as my bottom later then add white sand on top.that way the iron from the clay gets mixed with the peat. The black worms sound like a good idea. Like beaslbob said in salt water tanks they use 4 in sand beds and get bristle worms and other small critters that sift through the sand to keep the toxins from building up. U can actually see the lil tunnels and caves they make. They call it live sand. So I think i might try this out. Since I believe beaslbob suggest planting the tank and leaving it plant only for about a week I would put the worms on at this point so they would be well hidden b4 any fish get in.


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