# Advice on Semi-Aggressive vs. Community? (Tropical Freshwater)



## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

I'm working on setting up my new aquarium, and I'm going to be getting my first batch of fish tonight after work.

Now. I've read some places that it's okay to mix -some- semi aggressives with communities and not with others, I've read that they're all okay, and I've read that they're terrible with each other.

The only place around me that sells fish is Petsmart. But I've been going there for a week now watching the tanks and fish and they seem very well taken care of and healthy. However everyone I talk to at Petsmart in the fish department is adamant. "Do not mix semi aggressive and community fish. They will stress each other out and the communities might end up missing."

I don't want to hurt any fish I might be getting, but there are some really pretty semi aggressives I would like to add to my aquarium, which is going to be mostly community.

Is it a good idea? Is it a bad idea? Does it depend on species?


Here's a list of fish I am interested in getting, with *'s next to ones I REALLY want.

Tropical Community:
-White Finned Rosy Tetra
-Black Kuhli Loach
-Honey Sunset Gourami *
-Ghost Shrimp
-Red Claw Crabs *
-Black Phantom Tetra *
-Upside Down Catfish
-Long Finned Red Minor Tetra *
-Dwarf Gourami *


Tropical Semi-Aggressive
-Algae Eater
-Turquoise Rainbow
-Leporinus Fasciatus *
-Opaline Gourami *
-Clown Loach
-Angelfishn *
-Rainbow Shark *


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

You never said how big the tank is or will be.....


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## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

Oh. Sorry. It's a 45 gallon corner tank. Column design.


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## jbrown5217 (Nov 9, 2011)

with a column tank it is hard to say imo, Because it is more tall than wide you may have some more territory issues (possibly) and imo it is better for a fish to have more room to swim horizontally rather than vertically. You should most definitely avoid putting more than one gourami in the tank as they hate their own species, and will probably attack each other. I have no idea about the rainbow shark, or Leporinus Fasciatus. You might also have to watch out for the angelfish too as it may get into a beef with any of the other fish if it doesn't have its own territory. All the tetras you mentioned would do fine with the gouramis and angelfish (assuming you don't add more than 1 gourami, and I don't know angelfish well enough to suggest something for them). I would say get a bunch of the tetras a bunch of shrimp and a gourami, although the gourami may try to eat the fish as well.


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## Manafel (Sep 4, 2011)

I heavily advise against getting Leporinus Fasciatus for your tank. I had one in a semi-aggressive community and it almost tore even my tiger barbs to shreds. Not to mention they get up to 12 inches :/

Most of the time I suggest having a bigger tank if your going to hav angels, but you might be able to make it work.

Opaline gouramis are pretty aggressive as well.

If you want to get a plecostomus, don't get a common, they get massive. Maybe a clown Pleco would be good. they are colorful, and stay small.

What is the footprint of the tank?


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## vdanker (Jan 3, 2012)

You have to consider the sizes of the fish you want to add. The tetras won't grow to much more than a couple of inches, while the catfish could get up to 12 inches. Gouramis are ok in small groups, but only one male. I tried the Honey Sunset, which stays small, and is peaceful, but they didn't live very long. Avoid the Chinese algae eater; they won't eat much algae, and they are so active they can tear up a tank in a hurry. They also can be aggressive toward the more peaceful species. I stick to groups of only a few species. With that size tank, a shoal of 10 tetras, for example, can be very attractive. I have a 30 gallon with 5-7 individuals of these tetras: Black Phantom, Black Skirt, Diamond, Bloodfin. I also have several Cories, and they are very entertaining and very peaceful. One Chinese Butterfly Loach helps keep the glass clean. Oh, and as for the algae eater: try a Siamese Algae Eater. They are more peaceful than the Chinese, and do a better job as part of your cleanup crew. And don't let the lfs people tell you it is the same as a Flying Fox; it isn't.
Finally, you might consider two tanks; one for community fish, and one for the more aggresive species.


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## NeonShark666 (Dec 13, 2010)

Tropical Fish are not robots, they are very individualistic. Some Angels are very agressive, other not. I once had a Brown Discus that let no other fish push it around. A Clown Barb I had in a 10G tank was one of the biggest bullys I have ever seen. Keeping some schooling fish alone angers them and they harass everyone else. Avoid mixing fish of different sizes, large fish eat small fish. Remember that the first fish in the tank owns the tank and will resent and harass ones that are added later.


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## navigator black (Jan 3, 2012)

Tropical Semi-Aggressive
-Algae Eater - If it is the Chinese algae eater, it hardly eats algae, is ugly and is intensely and boringly aggressive. Otoconclus are cute, peaceful and 100 times more efficient.

-Turquoise Rainbow - a beautiful hierarchical fish - needs to be in groups with other three inch fish. It may be too active for a tall deep tank - it likes to run. But other than with other rainbows, it isn't super aggressive.

-Leporinus Fasciatus * too big

-Opaline Gourami * genuinely grouchy, most of the time. 

-Clown Loach - a foot long fish - your tank is too small, especially since they like to be in groups.

-Angelfish* A pair are smooth, or a group of six. The weakest member of the group is often harassed to death by paired off angels though, and as soon as one weakling is gone, another is chosen. Great fish, but aggressive within their groups.

-Rainbow Shark *a fish I hate, so take this with a grain of salt. it is brutally territorial, loses its colour with age and constantly attacks and chases. 

Tropical Community:
-White Finned Rosy Tetra - peaceful, able to handle traffic
-Black Kuhli Loach - secretive.
-Honey Sunset Gourami * delicate only one gourami species will go in a tank like yours. males seem to fight.
-Ghost Shrimp - angelfish food.
-Red Claw Crabs * no experience here.
-Black Phantom Tetra * peaceful, able to handle traffic
-Upside Down Catfish - not always peaceful - a shoaling fish that can throw its weight around. There are several different species traveling under this trade name, and they aren't all small.
-Dwarf Gourami * see honey sunset...
-Long Finned Red Minor Tetra * don't know this trade name


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## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

Didn't have the time to look over this thread before work tonight. Got the fish tonight. Kind of worried now because I got 3 Honey Sunset Gourami and 2 Dwarf Gourami. Not really sure what to do. The guy at the store said they liked to school together (With their own kind not other gourami) but the two types I got would be okay together. So far they seem to be friendly. They're not chasing each other, and the Dwarf Gourami seem to be defending the Sunset Gourami from the crabs. (The crabs aren't actively attacking anyone, just scaring away fish that get too close to it's food. It's only one of the three I got doing it. I've already named him Dick)

I didn't get an algae eater or an upside down catfish. Decided against those and got a Pleco. He's about oh 2-3 inches now.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

I believe crab needs to be able to get out of the water to breath air. The time the crabs might cause problems is at night when the fish are sleeping.

Some of the fish you mentioned get too big for your tank, lots of the others will be fine but you still have to watch you are not going to end up with too many fish.
This might be helpful for you: AqAdvisor - Intelligent Freshwater Tropical Fish Aquarium Stocking Calculator and Aquarium Tank/Filter Advisor
I suggest you also do a bit of research about each fish before you get it. Feel free to ask questions here. Some shop workers know what they are talking about but not many. You are much more likely to get bad advice so don't act on what they say alone.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Overall, you can mix but it doesnt work with all species and even if itt did for someone else, doesn't mean it will for you. Fish act differently from one environment to the next.


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## vdanker (Jan 3, 2012)

What type of pleco did you get? Some get very large, some stay as small a couple of inches. I had two Plecostamus and they were as bad as the Chinese Algae Eaters; didn't eat algae, and were too active for a peaceful community tank. The Bulldog Pleco is smaller, and more peaceful. The female Gourami has a rounded dorsal fin; the male has a pointed dorsal fin. It's best to have just one male, as they can be aggressive toward each other.


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## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

@vdanker: I think I got one of each male/female of the Dwarf Gourami. One of their dorsal fins runs all the way from the back of their head to their tail fin and doesn't really 'point', the other one sort of crops up midway along the back and has a more dramatic curve to it.

The Honey Sunset Gourami are all sticking together so I'm assuming they're not going to fight. All of their fins are the same.

As for the crabs, they didn't bother the fish overnight as far as I can tell. Two of them are hiding out in the little underwater habitat I bought for them and the third is sitting on top of a bamboo plant.


Although honestly all this stuff with the crabs is starting to irritate me. The guy's at Petsmart say they can't live 100% underwater, various crab care websites say they CAN but like to be able to get out of it, you guys are saying they CAN'T, etc etc.

Concerning the Pleco I think he'll be okay. He hasn't been throwing his weight around or anything. As far as I can tell he doesn't even care about the other fish or, frankly, anything else. He just shoves his mouth on the nearest surface and sucks away.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

Streptovsky said:


> Although honestly all this stuff with the crabs is starting to irritate me. The guy's at Petsmart say they can't live 100% underwater, various crab care websites say they CAN but like to be able to get out of it, you guys are saying they CAN'T, etc etc.


It can be frustrating but after a while you will the get the hang of knowing what sources of advice are the most reliable. Look for people who have had personal long term success and don't trust sources that just want to sell. Some information given is just wrong, in other cases what works for one doesn't work for another, usually you can get to the bottom of it by comparing different sources and discounting the less reliable ones. In this case what people are saying might not be all that different. Crabs need easy access to the air and should have a place to get out of the water. If you were setting up an aquarium just for them it would probably be half water, half land. While you can be sure they can't live 100% underwater some people have had success keeping them in almost normal aquariums with a little extra thought. Here is an example:
moss rope ladder


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## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

I have an underwater bubble dome thing for them.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

If you got more than one male D. Gourami, they will end up fighting once they start to try and establish territory.


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## Streptovsky (Feb 9, 2012)

I'm hoping they're not both male then. They have different dorsal fins...


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## vdanker (Jan 3, 2012)

Most lfs people are helpful, but I have gotten various answers to the same question. I research my questions on line, listen to the lfs people, and consider my own experience. When I put all of this together, I usually come up with the best answer to my problems/questions.


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## JonJonHobbyist (Aug 24, 2011)

You can see the inhabitants of my tank in my Signature and they all get along wonderfully. 
The only thing is after some time the black skirt tetras get to comfortable and just swim around individually all over the place which is when I usually decide it's time to do some general maintenance like prune my plants, clean my filter intake tubes, siphon substrate, etc. At which point they start shoaling tightly for a week or two till they get to comfortable again and start floating again. 
My honey sunset gouramis are a male and a female, I love them, they added lots of color to the tank and they are interesting fish to watch. They stick fairly close together and seem to enjoy each others company but I don't know how they'd act with multiple males in there, also if they're head/throat/bellyish areas start turning black don't be alarmed, it's normal in the males.
Cory cats also add lots of life to the tank, they clean up all the leftovers on the substrate and there are some extremely attractive strands of the fish also, my favorite is the Sterbai Cory which I'm currently trying to find more of but they aren't plentiful around these parts.
Anyway, good luck stocking up!


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