# Help! New and need advice!



## lemoncupcake (May 2, 2011)

So we went to the local pet store with our 3 year old daughter for a goldfish in a bowl....and were talked into a 10G tank. Now I want to do it right. 

I have washed the tank with water, gravel with water and started the filter. I do not currently have a heater. We purchased a feeder fish to make my daughter happy for now which is in a bowl and I want it in the aquarium soon. I have added tap water with 1 tbsp of aquarium salt, 10 ml tap water conditioner, 25 ml biological aquarium supplement as the labels said. I do not have water testing kit yet as it was a sudden purchase. So, when can I add the goldfish. I can't stand the thought of the fish dying the first night! Also, how do I add new fish? I've tried to read forums on this subject, but I just end up confused. I was thinking of adding about 6 danios and maybe a bottomfeeding catfish to the mix after the goldfish. CAn I add fish right away? 

Do I need a heater for danios, tetras, and similar small fish? 

Any help or links to specific sites with step by step instructions on what to do from here would be helpful!


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

Welcome!Glad you got the ten gallon,but it will not be enough.Goldfish need 30 gallons minimum,for one,and ten extra for any additional goldfish.Therefore,The tank cannot hold anything but the single goldfish,and not permanently.Also,yes you will need a heater for the other fish,but the goldfish is coldwater,so they will not be happy together.In order to get the tank ready,you will need to cycle it,and that will take at least two weeks.A test kit will be needed.Acclimating fish are easy.You take the bag o fish,cut the top of the bag off,and float the bag down a bit.Pour out a good bit of the water(not in the tank)Leave enough where as the fish can still be wet.After floating him for about fifteen minutes,take a cup and gently add a little water from the tank.Then wait a few more minutes.Keep doing this until you have what was the beginning amount of water in the bag.Then pour out the excess,like before,and add some more.Once its about halfway up to the original,net the fish and release him.

Look through the forums for the cycling method,its too complex to describe.
Best bet,IMO/E is to take the goldie back,look up fishless cycling and then look into the fish that you would like to have.That way you can spend two weeks researching the ones you want and will be an almost expert by the tame they come home.


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## lemoncupcake (May 2, 2011)

So does that mean I need to wait 2 weeks to introduce the goldfish? I'll check out the cycling process, but I can't take the goldfish back since it's my daughters fish now, so what should I do with him for now?


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

majerah1 is exactly right with the advice given! (I was thinking all the same things).

Gold fish have high ammonia levels in their urine, so until you have it in the filtered tank you are going to have to change at least 1/2 the water in the bowl every day. The changing of the water every day will also aerate the water so the fish doesn't suffocate. (Once in the tank the filter will help keep the water clean and aerated). You could put an air stone in the bowl until your tank is cycled... that will help put air in the water, but it will still need to be changed to get rid of the ammonia.

As for the 2 weeks before introduction, every tank cycles differently. Some are faster than others. You can take a water sample to a life fish store and have them test it for you in a few weeks to see if it's ready (or you can get the test strips to do yourself at home).

The gold fish will out grow the tank... is there no way you can take it back and get something smaller for when the tank is cycled? (I know your daughter is attached to it, so this may not be possible...) But, there are lots of options for fish for a 10g tank when you put a heater in it. (In my signature you can see what I've got in my 10g. Yes, my cardinals should be in a school of 6, but they all died off and now I've got 2 left, lol).


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

If the filter has been running a couple of hours and you have no choice, then yes, you can add the goldfish now if you need to. I hope you at least have a thermometer. You can cycle with fish just as easily as fishless. Obviously, the fishless way doesn't have the risk of losing fish and therefore a better way to do it. I would not keep it in a bowl for very long. But as was mentioned, they dont mix with tropicals and it will outgrow that tank.


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

lemoncupcake said:


> 1. I do not have water testing kit yet as it was a sudden purchase.
> 2. So, when can I add the goldfish. I can't stand the thought of the fish dying the first night!
> 3. Also, how do I add new fish?
> 4. I was thinking of adding about 6 danios and maybe a bottomfeeding catfish to the mix after the goldfish.
> ...


Michelle, welcome to the forum!

Here we go...

1. I would strongly advise you get a water testing kit, and a liquid titration/liquid drop test kit. It's a little more involved and time-consuming than the test strips, but the results are much more accurate and precise, and you get a much better bang for your buck (each liquid test is good for about 100 tests or so). I would get a liquid test kit for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, as these are the crucial chemical components of an aquarium's nitrogen cycle. If you end up liking testing (like I do) you can branch out into other tests like pH, hardness, alkalinity, etc. But for now, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate are almost a necessity. Otherwise, you can never be completely sure your aquarium's nitrogen cycle is fully functioning.

2. You may add fish after a nitrogen cycle has been established. Otherwise, the fish (any fish) will generate ammonia from poop, excess food it doesn't eat, etc. and the ammonia will kill the fish or at least really make its life miserable for awhile. You need bacteria colonies to naturally colonize the tank to take care of the ammonia and convert it first to nitrite, then to nitrate. To do this you'll need some of that tank starter solution you were using that has bacteria colonies in solution, and a source of ammonia to feed the bacteria so they don't starve and die. I would suggest either daily doses of straight ammonia to the tank with an eye dropper, or daily doses of flake food (which is easier but will take longer to establish the nitrogen cycle), or my favorite - a piece of raw seafood in a mesh bag that will decompose and generate ammonia (but this takes the longest to start the cycle). For more info on a nitrogen cycle, read the following article: The Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle

3. You will want to drip-acclimate your new fish. To do that, you'll need a tupperware or similar temporary holding vessel and some aquarium airline tubing with either knots in it or a plastic airline needle valve to slow the flow of water to 5 drips every second or so. When you get the fish it will be in a bag of store water - empty most of the store water down the sink (or water your plants with it). Dump the little bit left in the bag and the fish into the temporary holding vessel and place near the tank. Tape the airline tubing so it's sticking in the tank at one end, and the other end is in the vessel. Start a siphon by sucking on the end of the airline tubing and let it drip water into the vessel with the fish in it. This will allow the fish to slowly adjust to your tank's temperature, pH, hardness, etc. Otherwise you run the risk of osmotic shock (also called temperature or pH shock) if you just dump the fish and water into the tank.

4. Keep in mind the cute little pet store fish get BIG. The goldie is a big poop/ammonia machine that is very hardy and can do just fine in cold water, and the danios are fast semi-aggressive swimmers that prefer warm water. I would definitely recommend the goldie-catfish combo as the cat will clean the bottom of the tank (they're garbage eaters, after all). However, don't think you can just get away with the cat surviving solely off garbage - buy some algae wafers or shrimp pellets for the cat to eat maybe once or twice a week. I would advise against the danios as seven fish in the middle of the tank will get crowded, the goldie will get big, and the danios will get about 2" long fully grown.

5. No, wait until the nitrogen cycle has been established. Technically (especially with tough fish like goldies) you could add the fish and let them be the source of ammonia for establishing the nitrogen cycle, but I don't like the idea of intentionally poisoning fish with elevated levels of ammonia and nitrite, which you will encounter as the bacteria colonies populate your tank to a level high enough to handle the amount of ammonia being generated (called a bio-load).

6. Generally, yes.

7. Sources:
The Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle
http://www.aquariumforum.com/f66/fish-poop-you-primer-8310.html
Properly Maintaining the pH in a Freshwater Aquarium - Rate My Fish Tank

Hope all this helps some! Hit us up with more questions when they come along. Also, on a side note - check Craigslist or your other local classifieds for some awesome deals on fish, hardware, and accessories for your fish tank, and don't discount the awesomeness of a few live plants! They're easy to maintain, lower stress levels on your fish, and help filter the water (though, goldies like to munch on some plants).


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

A fishless cycle can last well over a month. She doesn't have another location to put the gf that her daughter has already become attached to. If it is put somewhere else as a temp solution while the tank is taken through a fishless cycle, whatever body of water it is put into will then start to cycle also and will more than likely be smaller than the aquarium and almost without a doubt - die.

Recommending what you suggest for #5 is not good if you don't have a way to deal with the fish she already has, but you left that out.


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> A fishless cycle can last well over a month. She doesn't have another location to put the gf that her daughter has already become attached to. If it is put somewhere else as a temp solution while the tank is taken through a fishless cycle, whatever body of water it is put into will then start to cycle also and will more than likely be smaller than the aquarium and almost without a doubt - die.


Gotcha. Yeah, using the goldie as ammonia fuel will work best in that case. I would definitely buy a testing kit then and keep a close eye on ammonia levels then, and keep some buckets and a gravel vac handy in case the ammonia levels get too high.


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## lemoncupcake (May 2, 2011)

Ok, I have had Goldie (my 3 year olds official name for it) since Sunday around 6 and it's just in a bowl in the kitchen. It's not eating and the tank is all ready....I have a heater now and it's holding steady at 75/6. So I'm going to try to add it to the tank now. I will get the water testing drops as soon as I can. 

My understanding of cycling....ammonia will be produced from the poop and uneaten food....the bacteria will turn the ammonia into nitrite...and then the nitrite is turned into nitrate. When the cycling process is done, there should be minimal levels of ammonia and nitrite and I can then add more fish to the tank.....a few at a time. So during this process, if the ammonia levels spike, what do I do? if the nitrite levels spike, what do I do? If the nitrate levels are too high, is this when I do the 10-15% water change?

I've always wanted a small aquarium, but never thought it would be this complicated to get it started right!

I would like to in the future have some neon tetras or zebra dannios, can I add a couple dannios at the same time that I add goldie and start cycling with 3 fish? 

To get Goldie from the bowl to the tank, should I reduce the amount of water in the bowl and then slowly add water from the tank to the bowl?


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

lemoncupcake said:


> 1. My understanding of cycling....ammonia will be produced from the poop and uneaten food....the bacteria will turn the ammonia into nitrite...and then the nitrite is turned into nitrate. When the cycling process is done, there should be minimal levels of ammonia and nitrite and I can then add more fish to the tank.....a few at a time.
> 2. So during this process, if the ammonia levels spike, what do I do? if the nitrite levels spike, what do I do? If the nitrate levels are too high, is this when I do the 10-15% water change?
> 3. I would like to in the future have some neon tetras or zebra dannios, can I add a couple dannios at the same time that I add goldie and start cycling with 3 fish?
> 4. To get Goldie from the bowl to the tank, should I reduce the amount of water in the bowl and then slowly add water from the tank to the bowl?


1. Right on.
2. If you get an ammonia spike, a nitrite spike, or you're ever worried about nitrate levels (which eventually you'll have to reduce), do a water change! Buy some tap water conditioner (to remove chlorine) and a gravel vacuum/siphon hose. You can change anywhere from 1%-50% of the water at a time - any more and you risk shocking your fish, same as when you add them brand new. Remember to remove and add water slowly, and to dechlorinate your tap water BEFORE adding it to the tank.
3. I would suggest tetras over danios - they are more docile and are generally smaller, so you could have 2-3 in there, however keep in mind small tropical community fish like danios and tetras are schooling fish - they do better in groups of 6-10, but that would be WAY too many fish in with a big goldie.
4. Perfect idea.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Your gold fish will do better with out a heater. They are fish that need lot of O2 in the water. The warmer the water, the less O2 there is. 

The other fish you want to put in your tank need a heater. I would suggest maybe getting some snails or researching fish that don't need heaters. (Wouldn't want the heater to kill the gf now that your daughter is attached to it).


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