# Sick Guppy, swimming in one place



## th

Could someone help identify the problem/disease? One of my male adult guppy is not eating and not swimming much since last 3 days.

He is in a 29gal cycled tank, started 3 years ago, has two filters (one filter with BIO wheel), oxygen supply on timer, and co2 diffuser for plants. I change 25-30% water every weekend, every two weeks I vacuum the gravel.

Water reading:
Ammonia-0
Nitrite-0
Nitrate more than zero but less than 20ppm
GH-8
KH-7
pH-7.6 (tap water also has the same pH)

Today I did a 25% water change. Last 25-30% water change was done 3 days ago. 

Appreciate any and all advice!


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## majerah1

He may be an old fish. How long have you had him? Any tank mates who may be picking at him?


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## th

hmmm, maybe 6 months old. [url=http://www.aquariumforum.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=15578&ppuser=27747][/URL]


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## th

I watched to see if other fish are bullying him but no.


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## Cat696

first, your pH is too high.. second, does he have a school? third, Is there salt in the tank. (not marine salt).. Live Bearer Salt works well.. I'm asking these questions for a reason, I know it sounds abrupt, but it's important..


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## jrman83

Try feeding green peas. Throw a few in the microwave (about 15-20sec), peel the outer shell off and then cut up the two sections. See if he eats any of that. 

What do you feed them and how often?


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## jrman83

Cat696 said:


> first, your pH is too high..


What do you suggest to do with the ph? I've kept mine in 8.2ph and never had an issue. Guppies can handle a very wide range of ph. Most sources say 6.8-7.6, but many of use keep them or have them in much higher values. Most fish can adjust to your ph.


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## Cat696

In reference to the guppy, I would lower the pH to between 6.7 and 7.2, if he has no school, or if he bonded with a fish that died (yup, it happens. Had one bond with a Cory once. That is an interesting story), he needs friends that trigger his schooling instincts. I used to keep guppies and managed to keep them for a little over 4 years at a max growth of just under 3 inches. (of course, breeding them is no problem, they reproduce like bunnies in most water conditions).. Many people believe they don't need salt, that isn't the case. Aquarium salt is ... I quit using it a long time ago and switched to Live Bearer Salt. It works in ways that I can't even explain, I couldn't tell you what the difference is anymore it's been over 10 years since I researched it. But since doing so, I had better luck with illness before it got a good foothold (with no medication needed), and breeding many species became much easier. It even seems to help with "depression" in fish. I know it sounds odd, but it seems to work. That and the usual keeping tabs on the bio cycle, and keeping up with water changes. It could just be that he is old if none of the above is helpful. 4 years is not the usual for guppies. I've rarely heard of anyone keeping them for more than 2 years or so..and goodness knows that my first attempts at keeping anything were nothing to grin about.. *shrug* It's a suggestion..


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## th

Hi Cat696, thanks for your suggestions. My pH is little on high side (same as the tap water) but I couldn't find a natural way to lower it down. I read somewhere that injecting CO2 should bring it down but no luck and its been high since 3 years never had problem with guppies. Any suggestion as to how to lower the pH without adding stuff like baking soda or other stuff? I use aquarium salt on regular basis, never heard of live bearer salt. Will give it a try. and yes this tank has about 20 more guppies, both males and females+babies as you mentioned they reproduce like bunnies.


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## th

I gave them peas the way jrman suggested but he din eat. I gave garlic laced food too but he din eat that either. I feed them Spirulina 20 twice a day. I also feed them tropical flakes and sometimes frozen daphnia.


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## coralbandit

wood(suitable for aquarium) ,peat moss(turns water yellow/brownish),or any decaying organics(dead leaves{suitable for aquarium} or from dying plants in tank) will all cause acidification and lower ph a little.In small tanks DIY co2 could help and not be alot of work.You are right to stay away from "chemicals/buffers" as they create many other issues.Most fish will adjust to ph if not drastically out of their range,and I don't think 7.6 is a problem(right about where I keep discus!).


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## Cat696

Baking soda would actually raise your pH. It raises the KH (had to find that one out the hard way, boy was that a bad experience). It sounds like your KH is at a level that keeps the pH pretty stable.. HOWEVER.. the suggestions that Coralbandit made are a good way to bring the pH down a little at a time in a totally natural way. It's part of how I used to make Black Water tanks (minus the Black Water additives like "Instant Amazon" and "Black Water Expert"). You are adding natural tanins and humic acids to the water that won't hurt the fish, but in the right amounts it will bring down the pH slowly enough to avoid "shock" and help to enrich the water somewhat. Seachem makes the live bearer salt.


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## coralbandit

I forgot another "natural " way to lower ph if you feel the need;RO or distilled water.Just mix in measured amounts "cutting" to achieve desired ph.I still feel 7.6 is acceptable for guppies and as far as water quality goes; CONSISTENCY is more important than "perfect preference";meaning if 7.6 is what you get and you won't ALWAYS be able to adjust the same stick with what you know you will ALWAYS have.If fish don't have issue with your water within 1 month(most show signs of distress(death) much sooner)other than breeding(which does require proper adjustment{at least for discus and"sensative" fish}) then giving what you can ALWAYS give is best.


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## jrman83

There is no need to mess with your ph. Guppies live fine in ph levels of 8+. When you try to alter it is where most people have trouble. Lowering it naturally is the preferred method obviously, but like I said - no need here and it certainly isn't the cause of whatever is causing issue with this fish.


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## th

Using distilled water is a good idea but I think you need to be careful making it to same scale every water change. I might transfer him to my 15gal quarantine tank. Rest of my guppies and platies are doing great but its mistery what happened to this guy.

I have to stop removing dead and decaying leaves...din know it can lower pH!


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## goldie

th said:


> Could someone help identify the problem/disease? One of my male adult guppy is not eating and not swimming much since last 3 days.
> 
> He is in a 29gal cycled tank, started 3 years ago, has two filters (one filter with BIO wheel), oxygen supply on timer, and co2 diffuser for plants. I change 25-30% water every weekend, every two weeks I vacuum the gravel.
> 
> Water reading:
> Ammonia-0
> Nitrite-0
> Nitrate more than zero but less than 20ppm
> GH-8
> KH-7
> pH-7.6 (tap water also has the same pH)
> 
> Today I did a 25% water change. Last 25-30% water change was done 3 days ago.
> 
> Appreciate any and all advice!


HiTh
Just my opinion but i personally wouldn't worry about that PH especially if he's been in that level for some while, also as it's not affecting the other Guppies. Loads keep them without problems in that count.I haven't got any right now but a few years ago mine were always in 7.5 and they were perfectly okay with that reading,
Have you tried him on Frozen Bloodworm? 
Hope he improves whatever you decide to do


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## jrman83

th said:


> I have to stop removing dead and decaying leaves...din know it can lower pH!


This is something you want to continue to do. Anything decaying in your tank can be a source of ammonia.


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## jrman83

th said:


> I gave them peas the way jrman suggested but he din eat. I gave garlic laced food too but he din eat that either. I feed them Spirulina 20 twice a day. I also feed them tropical flakes and sometimes frozen daphnia.


Also, no need to feed twice a day. I would suggest once per day and skip one day per week. Try the peas once the fish is eating again.


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## th

That fish died today after a week without food.


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