# Help with Ich progress



## jeffnc (Oct 30, 2010)

I have a 15 gallon filtered aquarium with 4 smallish goldfish, and they contraced Ich somehow. At first it wasn't obvious to me what it was, but now I'm virtually positive that's it. One of the 4 has a kind of fancy fan tail, and it has disintegrated to the point that it looks like the regular tail of the others. Also 3 of them are rather lethargic. In some spots, what appears to be "flaking skin" (maybe the slime coat?) is peeling off, in addition to the white specs.

3 days ago I added the recommended dosage of Ick Guard from Jungle Labs. Today I changed the water and repeated the dosage. The pump is still running with the bio wheel but I removed the filter because it has the activated carbon, as the instructions recommended (not sure how long I'm supposed to leave the filter out though.) I haven't seen any improvement in the last 3 days though. All 4 fish are still interested in eating.

What should I look for or try at this point? Thanks.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

You need to post some pics. Some of what you're describing doesn't sound like ich to me.


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## M1ster Stanl3y (Dec 10, 2010)

Sounds like fin rot plus something else with the flaking skin


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Sounds bacterial but can't tell without pics.


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## jeffnc (Oct 30, 2010)

They appear worse if anything tonight.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

Do you have a test kit for ammonia and nitrites? I my experience these kinds of problems are caused by water quality issues which make the fish weak and prone to things like ich and fin rot.

How long has the tank been running? If less than a couple of months the tank may still be cycling.

With out having a better idea of what is going on I'd recommend adding aquarium salt and doing 30% water changes with dechlorinated water at least every 3 days for a while to see if it improves water quality.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Looks like ich on at least some of them. Since goldies are coldwater fish I would go the med route. Quick Cure has worked well for me in the past. Just remove the carbon from your filter if you use it and follow the instructions. I'd bump the temp to 80F at least to make sure the ich cycle is about 4 days.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Are these pearl scales? Ich should look a little like salt, these white spots look bigger to me in the picture. Do they look bigger than salt to you? Skin sloughing doesn't sound right for ich. If it were me, I would send your pictures and a description, in as much detail as you can, of what each dot looks like, how big they are, and the skin sloughing and how this all came about, what you've treated with so far, etc. to National Fish Pharmacy - Fish Skin Disorders
They do a free email consultation and will tell you what fish medication you need. Or you can look at the skin disorders chart and see if anything on it sounds like what's going on to you. I just don't think this sounds like Ich. Good luck, and my condolences.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

I can't quite tell from the pics what is going on, certainly not all ich, but it could be ich as well. My guess is still that there are multiple problems caused by a problem with water quality.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

The spots on the tail look like ich to me. On the body I can't be sure. The pic isn't clear enough. There is definitely multiple issues as the one fish looks as if he is shedding. Something fungal....


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## jeffnc (Oct 30, 2010)

Well, one of them is gone this morning - I think it's the one with the heavy skin sloughing but I can't be sure. I used to be able to tell them apart but with the fin changes I can't any more.

The water quality was checked at a PetSmart and it was all very good, including chlorine, ammonia, pH, nitrates, nitrites.

This tank is 4 months old. It had higher ammonia levels at the beginning but has been good for about 3 months now so I'm sure it's cycled. We introduced a Pleco to the tank, with an increase in water temp from 68 to 74. The Pleco died within 4-5 few days with no noticeable symptoms other than not eating. Everything still seemed fine for the next couple weeks, but this could be problem introduced by that fish? Or the water temp changing up and then down?


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

The temp changes alone could not do it, although there are some diseases that progress more quickly at higher temps, they would have to already be present in the tank and would have progressed, just more slowly, at the lower temp as well. 

the pleco that died might well have been sick and might have introduced something to the tank. I just wish we could identify what is going on with these fish. I have never seen anything like this, and I've seen a lot of stuff.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

How are the other ones? I must say they really don't look good, goldfish are amazingly hardy fish though so you never know.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Personally, I think the longer you wait to get some form of treatment going you risk losing more if not all of your fish. Once ich covers their gills, of which you may never see, it will usually kill them (if they do have ich). 

If this were me and I was making a decision on what to do....based on the pics I would say that you have at least two issues going on. One is more than likely ich and the other appears as some type of fungal thing. going by that I would do a combination treatment with quick cure (ich) and some type of antibiotic that will cure fungal problems to include things like fin rot. This is all based of the pics of course. Meds usually don't start showing their affects until 2-3 days of treatment IME. The longer you wait, the bigger chance of losing everything.

Start off with a 50% watr change and then follow the instructions. These meds can be found at most Petco/Petsmart/possibly Walmart. If you can't find quick cure, substitute with some other ich med.

My recommendation anway.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

I think the fish are already being treated for ich. I'd use salt treatment because I've found it very affective for goldfish for ich and fungal infections. Along with large water changes.


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## Martini2108 (Jul 23, 2010)

Just to say (proly wont help being goldfish) but Temp CAN kill ich. Only way I got rid of it in my 36 G. no meds worked had ich for more than a month so finally decided to crank my tank temp up to 90 degrees (tropical warm water fish is what i have in there) used no meds at all within 4-5 days all ich was clear, kept tank at 90 for 2 weeks total to make sure and nothing. Just saying high temp can kill ich but that being said there are Florida strains of it that have survived past temp of 90.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Martini2108 said:


> Just to say (proly wont help being goldfish) but Temp CAN kill ich. Only way I got rid of it in my 36 G. no meds worked had ich for more than a month so finally decided to crank my tank temp up to 90 degrees (tropical warm water fish is what i have in there) used no meds at all within 4-5 days all ich was clear, kept tank at 90 for 2 weeks total to make sure and nothing. Just saying high temp can kill ich but that being said there are Florida strains of it that have survived past temp of 90.


But can goldfish (cold water fish) survive at 90? that's really really high. Have you looked at his pictures? These fish are hanging on by a thread. Pushing their temperature tolerance would probably finish them off.


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## Martini2108 (Jul 23, 2010)

That's what I was thinking (never kept goldies personally) The high temp will get rid of most water illnesses but I'm not sure if they can handle that temp, especially being that ill. Anyone who keeps golds care to help out on this one.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I wouldn't try temp with Goldfish.


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## jeffnc (Oct 30, 2010)

I switched to a new ich medicine with malachite green, and also used Maracyn and raised the water temp to 76. Whether that would have worked or not I don't know because all 4 died within 1 day.

I posted this thread to get advice on setting up the tank for new fish - any help appreciated.
http://www.aquariumforum.com/f5/help-resetting-tank-new-fish-11425.html


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

Sorry to hear that, they really did look bad and probably not strong enough to survive the meds.


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