# first fish death! T_T



## sephnroth (Jul 30, 2013)

oh no! one of my cloudy white mountain minnows is dead! I have no idea why  

anyone reading my other thread will know last night i shook the tank up adding a water heater (which hasnt needed to turn on due to the heat here in england atm) and i removed an oranament and replaced it with some bogwood (which is left over from one of my dads old tanks so had been soaked for a long time, i washed it before putting it in) and i put in a plant. My other two minnows seem fine - i thought another was dead just floating amongst one of my older plants but when i brought the definately dead (upside down) fish out with a net the other "woke up" from his snooze and has been swimming around happily with the other surviving minnow and my dinos. two of my shrimpo appear asleep in corner (little bit of movement) and the third is swimming around happy as pie.

Did i do something wrong or should this be chalked up to just life? I just put one of those test strips in, i dont have one for ammonia but nitrates and chlorine and ph etc is all reading in the "safe" markers.

i put dead fish in a jar and took a photo so you could see and tell me if something specific got him - my minnows are a sort of dark colour and the dead one has turned.. whiteish? 

http://i40.tinypic.com/1zxwpih.jpg


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## sephnroth (Jul 30, 2013)

just did the evening feed. when the two remaining minnows saw that food was in the tank they became very lively and have been feeding well. my three zebra dinios who have been chillin in a group at the bottom didnt stir thou and usually they are straight to the top. when some flakes fell past them they got more excited and started moving alot more but only around the bottom. my two pleckys remained hiding by the bog wood which they've been doing since i added it.

examining a dinio his gills seemed to be moving quite fast but i didnt really pay attention before so i dont know how fast they should move :/ but i realised installing the heater i had brought the filter much higher up the glass and as a result the surface ripple was greatly reduced! could it be an oxygen problem? i've moved the filter back down so the whole surface is rippling properly again :/

edit: just peeked at the tank and the pleckys are swimming around quite happily - my smaller one went straight back to bog wood when he saw me, i think they are shy!


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## sephnroth (Jul 30, 2013)

just did a 25% ish water change. gravel cleaner was sucking up ALOT of detritus from the floor. alot of food flakes which I believe will decay and raise amonia levels crazy fast?

when i was sold the shrimp (the more i research and the more you guys tell me the more i realise that guy really wasnt giving me good info) i was told they will only eat what floats to the bottom so feed extra so stuff floats down for them... think i've taken "extra" too far or shrimp just aint hungry!

the fish seem quite happy after the fresh water.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Overfeeding will cause more trouble than almost anything else we can control.The shrimp will get by on "scraps"(I mean this literally!).Feed no more food than is COMPLETELY eaten in 2 minutes.
Good for you changing water,never a mistake done properly.
You should invest in a liquid api test kit if you don't have one to know where your water is at(has ammonia test included and is much more accurate than test strips).That way you'll know how much water to change.The amount of water cahnged(%) is how much nutrients will be reduced.For example if you have 1ppm ammonia in a 20 gallon tank a 25% water change will reduce ammonia to .75ppm(25% water change 25% reduction in nutrients).The water change lowers all nutrients(ammonia,nitrite and nitrate).
I'm guessing your tank is new so 0nitrite and nitrate wouls indicate your not cycled.You do have ammonia(step 1 in cycle) and most dangreous to fish.It will spike to lethal levels well before your tank is cycled so test and change water.


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## sephnroth (Jul 30, 2013)

thanks coral! i've been reading about cycles and such, here and other places but i've managed to confuse myself about how much water i should change and how frequently.

its also worth noting that i found my tank i was given to be a bit small so tonight i picked up a new one off someone online for cheap - its MUCH bigger (80x30x40 cm) and im looking forward to setting it up - but im unsure if i should concentrate on the smaller tank and keep cycling and just ignore the new tank or start the new tank, get fish aclimatised to it and cycle that with them in or set them BOTH up and cycle the new tank without fish (..somehow) and cycle the small one whilst the new one is setting up?

i've sort of information overloaded myself and need to pull back and get the clear picture!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

You could move everyone over to bigger tank and cycle "fish in" ,just take your old filter with fish to get as much help as possible.OR you could fishless cycle new tank with ammonia and no fish.It may cycle completely faster than with fish in and then you could move over the fish to nice cycled tank.
Here's the sites sticky on fishless cycle
http://www.aquariumforum.com/f66/fishless-cycle-15036.html


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## silvergourami1 (Jun 20, 2013)

How long had the bogwood been sitting around? If for an extended amount of time it could of had chems saturated into it through the air. Just a simple washing it might not have done the trick....soaking it again to leech any chem or boiling it might have been better.

What is the filter your using? Has the media been inspected? IS it adequate filtration?...1 1/2 -2 times the min rate. Was the heater washed before injection? Are all your fish compatible? 

I have a small school of white clouds and they are tough....and veracious eaters too! 

If their is an aggressor in your tank; it/they could be the cause. 

I would just continue with the cycling in the older tank, and start up a new cycle in the new tank. Then when the other tank is completely cycled transfer some of the water between the two tanks and add a few fish from your old tank to the new one, and let it run a few days. Then if you want you can add all the fish to the new tank and leave the older one for shrimp or as a quarantine/breeder aquarium. 

As a vendor of bogwood and driftwood I can attest...you have to be careful as they have to be prepared properly and effectively. It is ecologically sound for any freshwater tank to have wood in it as this is a natural occurance in bodies of water so duplicating this to the aquarium environ is only beneficial, but some can harbor chems, pests, bio organisms that should not be transferred to tropical fish environs. 

Wood from the US must be prepared before introduction to an aquarium with fish/inhabitants of other regions.

The heater too might of had chems on it...hopefully you washed it before hand! Even our hands that we insert into a tank must be washed with the tank water before inserting.


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