# A 29g project



## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I have an established 29g tank with driftwood and a gravel bottom. It holds 1 tiger barb, 1 iridescent shark, 3 black skirt tetras, 1 albino pleco, and a small paint turtle that I found wandering in my yard. I plan on adding more tiger barbs later, and suspect the shark may have to go to the 55g (not up yet) in the future.

It has a Coralife F/W Aqualight T5 that has 1 21w colormax full spectrum T5 and 1 21w 6700K T5.

I would like to plant this tank with easily managed plants. I do not want to add CO2 because of expense for now. The tank is about 12"-13" tall 36" wide and 12" in depth (front-back).

I am looking for suggestions on plant types and a layout.



Yes, I have two filters on the tank, the Tetra Whisper 30 just doesn't seem to keep up so I recently added the other. I have had it for some time, but I can't remember what it is? A Marineland of some kind I think. The feces would accumulate on the gravel and need to be vacuumed at least once a week. I thought that odd for such a light fish load, maybe it is more fish than I thought. Hopefully the plants will help out.


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

I'm not sure on the plants...will the turtle eat them?

FWIW: DIY CO2 is a really cheap option if you so choose to go that route. Just a friendly thought for ya. ;o)


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## mk4gti (Jun 15, 2010)

I just made my DIY co2 last night, i made the reactor but the diffuser is such a pain and not worth spending the money trying to create a decent one, i just got this one which was only $14.99Pollen CO2 Diffuser 1000 - Nano | Green Leaf Aquariums i set it up last night im waiting for the difuser in the mail


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I don't think the turtle will eat them, but he will probably uproot them. I am planning on releasing him before I plant.

As for the DIY CO2, I don't want to get into it right now. Just looking at easy to grow plantings for now.


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## longtail4711 (Jun 8, 2010)

Anubias nana or Anubias barterii, Java Moss, Java Fern, Marimo Moss Balls, Cryptocoryne Wendtii, Micro Sword, Dwarf Hairgrass, Hornwort, and Anacharis are all very easy plants to start with and very pretty.

The Anubias, Java Fern, and Java moss you simply tie to the driftwood and do not plant.

Hornwort and Anacharis can either be planted or left free floating.

Cryptocoryne, Micro Sword, and Dwarf Hairgrass you plant.

Marimo Moss Balls can be left free floating in their ball-like state, or you can rip them up and spread them over driftwood or rocks to create a lovely green carpet. 

All these plants do fine with low to moderate light (which you have), no Co2, and just need a good plant fertilizer.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

longtail,

I like your suggestions. I have found a site that sells a package containing most of those plants and a couple others.

Is adding plants like fish as far as changing the bio load on the tank?
Should it be done little by little or is getting such a package and planting all at once fine?


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I have a Magnum 350 Canister filter I plan to use in this tank. Would a spray bar lower in the tank help keep the current from blowing the plants around be a good idea or is the diffuser at the top good?

I am thinking about putting a DIY bar along the back of the tank.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

Ok, I have been working with this tank for the past few days.
I have changed to a larger filter, cleaned the gravel surface(vacuum), and a 40% water change 3 days ago.

I did water tests today with these results:
pH 8.5-9 (More toward 8.5-I hate matching colors.)
GH 22
KH 15
NH 0
NO 0

This indicates high pH and very hard water which gives me no dissolved CO2 for plants.

I can filter through peat to lower the pH, but will that give enough CO2 for the plants?

Could I introduce more fish to increase CO2 and let the plants return O2 for the fish and filter with peat instead of a CO2 generator?


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

i agree with everything above. I also think hygro are good plants. A turtle would eat the plants. I know you said that you would be taking it out... I'm just saying it would eat them. As far as adding plants, it's good to acclimate them a little. You don't have to use quite as much care as you do with fish. maybe a 10 minute bath using 50/50 mix of package water and tank water. Most plants with have a justation period like a week or so where they wilt a little. Otherwise, feel free to stock up as long as you have the nutrients available. good luck.


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

oh yeah, most of these plants will do fine in higher ph ranges.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I have peat in the filter and the pH is on the way down, lost about .5 in 12 hours. By lowering the pH I hope to keep more dissolved CO2 in the water and it should keep the fish a bit happier.



I drained and cleaned the tank last night. I have some 40g plastic barrels, and held the water in one while I worked so not to have a new tank that needed to cycle again. I also put the rock in a bucket with water over it to keep what bacteria I could and kept the existing filter wet so the bacteria are still with it. Hopefully I don't get a mini cycle.

After scrubbing the tank out with vinegar and rinsing it good, I put in the substrate. I used Activ Flora brand as it was the only one I could find between Petco and Petsmart. It settled quickly and didn't cloud the water bad at all.

After the substrate I positioned the driftwood and plants. Once those were placed I started gently placing gravel over the substrate and around the plants. I put piles in the open areas to level and fill in after the water level was higher and things settled so I could see better.

With a small plate on the gravel I started filling. When the tank was about half full I worked the gravel around the two Anacharis, at this point they floated enough that I could get around them without burying the ends.

While all this went on, the new fish were acclimating in a holding tank with the plants. I used a Whisper 30 on a 10g tank to hold the fish and plants during the work. I used some of the aquarium water and the water from the bags the fish and plants were in to let them acclimate.

Now the tank holds:

4 Green Tiger Barbs
5 Tiger Barbs
3 Black Skirt Tetra
2 Opaline Gourami
1 Iridescent Shark

3 Anacharis (2 planted, 1 floating)
1 Anubias nana on driftwood
2 Micro Sword
1 Cryptocoryne wendtii

I may add more later, but this should be a good start.
*reading

Photos when I can!!!


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## fishwrangler516 (Jul 11, 2010)

your set up sounds great i can't wait to see the pics of the finished product


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

The tank all planted and new inhabitants.

There is haze on the tank from being used before and the lime etched the glass. I have tried soaking it in vinegar and it just doesn't go away. I should have taken advantage of a tank sale when I got the plants and fish.....grrrr. Oh well, I spent enough money for one day and I get to set up another tank later. 






If anyone knows what the plant with the cluster of little banana looking things are let me know.

More to come......


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I tested the pH this morning and it has stopped dropping. Could anyone that has used peat to lower pH give me some idea of how much of a change to expect. Do I need to change the peat?

More pics...


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

How much the pH will drop has many variables such as current GH/KH levels (these will show the waters buffering abilities) and the amount of peat being used just to name a couple.


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## mk4gti (Jun 15, 2010)

Tank looks great, you need to get some more plants in there, the tiger barbs are going to start playfully nipping, if they have places to hid it reduces the stress on the smaller ones who are more frequently picked on. A fair ammount of nipping is healthy within a school of tiger barbs just make sure no one gets out of control.


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## fishwrangler516 (Jul 11, 2010)

Tank looks great David! I also think it would be a good idea to get more plants in there when you can, but other then that i love the tank!


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## Fishman Dan (Sep 18, 2009)

"If anyone knows what the plant with the cluster of little banana looking things are let me know".

That is known as the banana plant (Nymphoides Aquatica). It is actually a dwarf lily with root tubes. Leave it planted just how you have it now for best results.

Dan


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

Thanks for the comments.

I have had barbs before and they do love to nip and play! That's part of the reason for a bigger school of them, they can play among themselves without bothering the other fish.

I still want to get some other plants that have been mentioned. The stores I went to didn't have some of the ones I wanted. I still want a java fern to put on the big piece of driftwood, some hornwort, and the dwarf hairgrass looks cool.

I have several large rocks that we have been collecting locally to use around our outdoor pond. I would like to arrange them with some plants in between them.

So far all the fish and plants are looking healthy.

pH 8 down .5-1
NH3 0
NO2 0
GH 26 up 4
KH 13 down 2

Looks like no cycling is happening, but the water is getting harder and softer?


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

Well, I lost the iridescent shark. He tried to take over an area the gourami's staked claim to. They would run him all around the tank every time he came around them. I didn't have a tank to move him to. Who would think the biggest fish in the tank would get bullied.

On the up side everything else is doing good. The Anacharis is showing new growth and nothing is looking wilted. I have checked the water and everything is looking good and stable.


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## fishwrangler516 (Jul 11, 2010)

I'm glad to here that all is going well with your new tank, sorry bout your shark though..


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

Next addition to the tank is putting the canister filter on it. I should probably post a thread in DIY for that. The filter is a commercial unit, Magnum 350, but I am building the intake and return for the tank. If I put CO2 on this tank I may inject it into the intake for the filter......more to come later.


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

nice. I loved what co2 did to my tank. I never ran it to my intake, so i don't know how well that works. My fear is that it could mess up the filter motor or the syphoning. I think that most of the in line style set ups that I've seem used a co2 reactor on the return side of the filter. I would try it and see what happens. Also, I thought the bubble counters and solenoids were a waste of money. with a drop checker you can constantly monitor your co2 levels and set the co2 injection such that there aren't high ph swings when leaving the co2 on 24/7. In the morning my checker was green but on the yellow side. At night the checker was green but on the blue side. CO2 opens some doors on what types of plants you can keep, but you'll also need a good fertilizer schedule, and some good algea eaters. Good luck. 

Oh I know where to buy good co2 equipment. As far as co2 cylinders (which I hope you plan to use rather than diy) there is a beverage company online that has the best prices i've ever seen on bottles. They are brand new aluminum hydrotested bottles. This was the best deal I ever found for 5lb bottles. I later upgraded to a 20 lb bottle which was cheaper through the place that I got my co2 refilled at. Anyway, here it is
Co2 & Nitrogen Air Tanks | BeverageFactory.com

As far as regulators I used ebay and bought a package with the aquatek regulator, needle valve, bubble counter, and solenoid. The regulator worked great. I never had any end of tank dump issues or any thing else. Since i didn't need the bubble counter or solenoid, I sold those to someone who thought that they needed them (I told them they didn't need them, but they insisted). 

I used ebay for the drop checker and 4 dkh solution as well.

The co2 line and check valves i got from here. This place also had decent prices on the reactors. However, a diy reactor would work just as well. 
Clippard Check Valve | Green Leaf Aquariums

as far as ferts. i suggest EI (estimative index) dosing. 
This is where i got my ferts...
Planted Aquarium Fertilizer - Home

this is the EI dosing schedule...
Welcome To The UK Aquatic Plant Society - The Estimative Index (EI)

What I did was do some math and come up with a mix of dry ferts and distilled water to mix in old prime bottles so that I could dose a capful or 2 each time I needed. What I ended up with was a solution that used 4 cafuls of micros everyother day, 4 capfulls of macros everyother day, and 4 capfulls of GHbooster/ iron chelate once a week in a 55 gallon tank. I labeled each bottle with the recipes so that it was easy to duplicate. The reason prime bottles worked well is because they were handy and they don't let a lot of light in. I forget which solution... macros or micros.. had a tendency to mold if not refridgerated. However, when using the prime bottles i didn't need to refridgerate. 

As far as algea eaters, well, with co2 and fertilizing you get a number of different algeas that show up for different reasons. So, it's good to have the right fish for each occasion. I had ottos, bristlenose, and Siamese algea eaters (true SAEs). here's a guide on algeas. Some of the listing mention a fish that eat it, however i think that with the 3 I mentioned above, that you will cover all of your potential algea problems. This is however a great guide.
James' Planted Tank - Algae Guide

Well good luck again. ADMINS feel free to sticky this if you want.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

MasRobert9,

Thanks for all the information. As far as hard water goes I have got it. Almost off the scale for gh and kh usually.

Could you elaborate on the micro and macro side of the fertilizers. This is the first time for me going with live plants and I am still learning.

I have always thought that a tank can be balanced between fish load and plant to create a system that the fish produce the CO2 and the plants replenish the O2 without having to fertilize. I am hoping to find that balance. The problem I see is fish type. If the fish are not using the plants for carbon intake(food) I must feed them which introduces more carbons that the plants will use to grow. I suppose the only solution is to remove carbon from the system by pruning and removing plant matter.


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## TylerT (Jul 11, 2010)

do shrimp eat algae?


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## gretchup (Jul 9, 2010)

TylerT said:


> do shrimp eat algae?


ive seen saltwater shrimp eat algae


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## fishwrangler516 (Jul 11, 2010)

TylerT said:


> do shrimp eat algae?


I have a freshwater shrimp that does a pretty good job at keeping the algae cleaned up


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

macro are the macro nutrients that the plant needs most of... NPK. Which is nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium. There is a dosing called EI natural which refers to the fish providing all the nutrients for the plants or something along those lines. I think it'd be a good read. As long as you don't use 2.5 - 3 watts per gallon I would think EI natural might work. I'm really not an expert on EI natural, however I know that if you use high wattage lights on you plants then you need to give your plants a lot of nutrients and co2. The way I think of high wattage lighting is the wattage of light is like a person's pace. Low light= walking, high light= running, co2 to plants= oxygen to the person. Since plant photosynthesis is driven by light the plant is forced to work more when wattage is more. When a person walks they can breathe normally and maintain a normal moderate diet, however when a person goes running everyday they consume more oxygen and tend to consume more food (nutrients). So, same with the plants. If they work more then they consume more. If you don't provide enough nutrients then your plant can become thin, begin to wilt, and have less intense coloring.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

I haven't changed anything with the tank yet. I am wanting things to come to a balance of their own. The anacharis is growing, the anubias seems to be putting on new leaves, the micro sword is hard to tell-I suspect it is a slow grower, but haven't researched that yet.

A bit of brown algae is starting to grow on the plants and sides of the tank. I have cleaned it from the leaves of everything by rubbing with my fingers and using a magnetic cleaner on the glass. It removes easily so not a big problem. I am still waiting for things to get a good root system before adding a bristle nose plecostemus. 

The one that used to reside in this tank is in one of the girls 10g tank that was covered with algae. I let it go knowing I would do this so I could see just how good they work. The kids and wife are amazed at how fast the pleco cleaned the tank. The wife and girls both asked if I had cleaned the glass!


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

Well, I put the new intake and return in the tank and have the magnum 350 running on it. I have carbon in the cartridge now just in case the paint leaches any chemical.

On a side note, I lost a gourami. I think the other one beat him up. I had two males and they fought often. I noticed him acting a bit sluggish so I put him in the quarantine tank. He seemed to be getting better after a few hours, but the next morning he was dead.


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## TylerT (Jul 11, 2010)

David C said:


> On a side note, I lost a gourami. I think the other one beat him up. I had two males and they fought often. I noticed him acting a bit sluggish so I put him in the quarantine tank. He seemed to be getting better after a few hours, but the next morning he was dead.


thats sucks sorry.


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

yeah bn's are pretty great. I hear red lizard cats are pretty good too. sorry about your gourami


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

*Update...*

The canister filter is doing a fine job, however I keep getting a film on the water surface. I just run a HOB filter without a cartridge in it overnight and it is gone for a couple days. I think I may need to build a skimmer type intake for the Magnum 350 canister.

I obviously need more plants as the algae has started to grow well. I knew this when I started planting. When my schedule allows I will get more. All the plants seem to be doing well without CO2. The Anacharis is sprouting new shoots, the micro sword has new growth, and the banana lily has new leaves. I have started cutting back on lighting time to slow the algae. I do have to rub the leaves of the plants weekly or so to remove some brown algae that seems to like the plants.

Thanks to all who have posted and given advice, suggestions, and encouragement.


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

with most planted tanks in the early stages you will have algea that blooms. This is because the plants haven't learned how to take in all the available nutrients. However then plants will eventually (somewhere between a few weeks and a month) learn how to consume more nutrients. Unfortunelty there is a limit on what they can consume and that limit is based on several factors. So, if in a few weeks or month your algea is still thriving, then you know that something needs to be done to remove the excess nutrients. 
Water changes will help but won't usually take care of it on its own. That's because with a 20% water change you only get rid of 20% of the excess nutrients. Another option is to add more plants. You can also increase the co2 (which is a suggested cure for many types of algea). Reducing the light will help the algea to quit growing, but won't actually reduce the amount of excess nutrients. However increasing the light (which would require adequate co2 concentrations) would drive the plants to consume more nutrients. Also, you can allow some of the algea to remain. I have done that effectively. 
I kept a convict tank that I wanted to be low maintenance and I liked (still do) the look of algea covered rocks. It looked natural to me. So as the algea grew, I scrapped it off of the front and side glass and rubbed it off of the plants (when i had plants). I allowed it to continue growing on the back glass and the rocks. Eventually, the tank stablized in such a way that no new algea would grow, I had no nitrate problems, and i was able to leave the light on for 14 -16 hours if i chose to. 
I think I posted this link before, but here is a great algea guide...
James' Planted Tank - Algae Guide


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## MasRoberts9 (Jun 15, 2009)

oh yeah, the film on the top of tank isn't real bad. It's actually kind of benificial. That film occurs because of the lack of surface aggitation. I'm sure you knew that. However, in a planted tank surface aggitation isn't usually a good thing. Well, the surface aggitation allows for oxygen to transfer into the water and it releases co2 from the water. So, if your fish are looking like they are suffocating without the surface aggitation, then then surface aggitation is good (at least temporarily), if the fish are breathing fine without the surface aggitation, then having a still surface will benifit the plants. As you probably know, they more co2 the plants consume the more oxygen they can produce. So, in essence, in a well planted tank, there is no need for surface aggitation other than aesthitics. In that case you can get a surface skimming attachment for your canister like the Tom Aquatic Surface Skimmer...
Tom Aquatics Aquarium Surface Skimmer
You may be able to find a better price, I didn't really look at prices.


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## David C (Jul 7, 2010)

After all this time, the plants are doing well. The Anubias Nana is doing great. The micro sword and cryptocoryne wendtii are spreading and filling in. I have lost a few more fish.

Green algae tried to take over, but things have started to come to a balance and the algae has become less and less.


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