# Need help, white patch on my guppy



## Niki7

Ok I have a problem I can't figure out with my guppy. She has a white patch on her back and I don;t know what it is. I thought it was fungus so I used an antifungal a week or two ago and it seemed to go away. The fry in my tank recently started picking at her again and a few days ago I woke up to see her have a white patch on her back again although now it looks worse.

I have tried the fungus guard again, parasite meds, and ick meds (not all at the same time) and these have included malachite green, metronidazole, prazanquil, and other stuff I can't pronounce. No change. I am trying clout now although it seems like I just keep trying the same types of meds and nothing is touching it. What is it and what should I try for meds next??

If you see little white spots on the pics I think those are just reflections off her scales as it doesn't appear to be visible in person. 




Thanks everyone!


----------



## jrman83

Are you strapping saddles on your fish again? 

Definitely looks like fingus to me. I don't know all the meds by their active ingredient, but have you tried an antibiotic?


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> Are you strapping saddles on your fish again?
> 
> Definitely looks like fingus to me. I don't know all the meds by their active ingredient, but have you tried an antibiotic?


lol I can always count on you Ben! Nope no saddles *r2

The only antibiotic I tried was the metronidazole in one of the meds. I am very concerned that this might be columnaris....what do you think? Costia was another thought but the antiparasitic meds didn;t do anything and it should have killed the costia. Clout is supposed to kill off costia so maybe it will do something (just put it in the tank today). 

I also raised the temp when I thought it might be a weird strain of ick. That is probably contraindicated with fungus, right?

All the juvies that are in her tank are fine <knock on wood>.


----------



## jrman83

Can you isolate the fish? You put the temp back, right? Don't think it is needed.

Doesn't look like any columanaris I've seen. Usually columnaris, or saddleback columnaris (true name  ), will show a discoloration in that area of the fish but have never seen anything like peeling skin. It;s not a skin problem and this looks like one.

Only fungus problems I've had, or my fish have had, was fixed by melafix/pimafix for the most part - whichever treats skin fungus . I would try one of these:

Bacteria & Fungus Medications: T.C. Tetracycline and E.M. Erythromycin


----------



## chris oe

Eeegh - you're right JR doesn't really look like saddleback columnaris, but with anything in that region, showing that pattern, I'd be sorely tempted if nothing else is being effective, to try a columnaris remedy. Maybe this is some kind of new strain or variation - my condolences on your mystery - keep us posted on your progress and let us know if it spreads


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> Can you isolate the fish? You put the temp back, right? Don't think it is needed.
> 
> Doesn't look like any columanaris I've seen. Usually columnaris, or saddleback columnaris (true name  ), will show a discoloration in that area of the fish but have never seen anything like peeling skin. It;s not a skin problem and this looks like one.
> 
> Only fungus problems I've had, or my fish have had, was fixed by melafix/pimafix for the most part - whichever treats skin fungus . I would try one of these:
> 
> Bacteria & Fungus Medications: T.C. Tetracycline and E.M. Erythromycin


Ok thanks...I'm going to go get one of the two antibiotics. I forgot that I also tried Maracyn 2 and it did nothing, so it isn't gram negative, whatever it is.


----------



## jrman83

The problem I have had with columnaris remedies is my fish always die after treatment. I have yet to have a fish live after getting it and be treated. Understanding the disease is one of the toughest to defeat, or almost never defeated.


----------



## Niki7

In the meantime do you think it would be worth it to try a hydrogen peroxide wipe with a q-tip? I've done this before with injuries...


----------



## jrman83

Niki7 said:


> In the meantime do you think it would be worth it to try a hydrogen peroxide wipe with a q-tip? I've done this before with injuries...


Chris can answer that question better....

In the meantime, halt the guppy rodeo you got going on there *pc


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> Chris can answer that question better....
> 
> In the meantime, halt the guppy rodeo you got going on there *pc


lol ok if you say so *whip*


----------



## Niki7

Ok well, here's the update. Yesterday before I went to the lfs, I netted her and gently wiped her back down with a q-tip dipped in hydrogen peroxide. The white patch literally wiped off her leaving a patch of white discoloration but no fuzziness. Her scales looked ok, no open wounds. 

I went and got erythromycin and pimafix, dosed her with both yesterday. This morning she looked a little fuzzy again. Dosed again with pimafix according to directions. By tonight, she looked like she had long weird strands coming off her back, like a cotton ball strand. I got frustrated because it looked like it was just getting worse not better.

Then I did a stupid thing - I put a dose of Fu-Ba Fix in the tank. I was impatient because it didn't look like anything was getting better, the patch just was getting bigger and bigger, and she's only in a 1 gal quarantine so I was afraid that my dosing wasn't right (ie, I didn;t put enough meds in). Well, I just checked her and she was in horrible distress, violently shimmying in place, while the stuff on her back started kind of falling off her. Then she started falling to the bottom of the tank and hardly moving and I honestly thought she was dying. So I immediately changed out half the water. She's shimmying again but at least she isn't resting at the bottom.

I think it was really stupid of me to put the Fu-Ba in there because when I looked at the label, the ingredients say 'natural plant extracts'. For all I know it is the same thing as the Pimafix and I just overdosed her. I hope the water change helped, but I wouldn't be surprised if she is dead by morning from the way she looks. It's just awful. But on the positive side, the fungus or bacterial problem seems to be changing, so maybe she is shimmying because she can feel it working somehow?


----------



## jrman83

That doesn't sound very promising.


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> That doesn't sound very promising.


I know. But I just checked her and she is resting semi-comfortably and not shimmying too bad now. I hope she is ok, time will tell.


----------



## Niki7

She passed away this morning 

Nothing seemed to help her, it was so strange. I'm wondering if it was columnaris after all. A couple other fish in the tank are hanging at the top. Super.


----------



## jrman83

Sorry to hear. No more Rodeo jokes, huh? 

The many cases of columnaris I've had looked a little different than what you had, so not sure. It looks more like an area of discoloration than fungus. Just slightly different, but still could have been I guess.


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> Sorry to hear. No more Rodeo jokes, huh?


Oh the jokes keep me smiling when I'm going through the stress of my poor fish dying on me. Keep 'em coming

I just don't get the disease. It looked like mouth rot, but on her back. In the end, parts of her just started falling off. Poor thing. 

My tank is well kept, regular vac's and pwc's every week like clockwork. I will say I have had a stubborn bout of ammonia which probably made her weak. I'm at .25ppm right now and I just can't get it down to 0. I thought by taking the pleco out it would help but so far there is no change. I think it may be my water sprite. It isn't doing well and keeps dying back, so I may take it out and see if the dying plant is causing the ammonia.

Thanks Ben. How is your fish with the septicemia?


----------



## jrman83

Niki7 said:


> Thanks Ben. How is your fish with the septicemia?


I treated her the second time last night and just looked at her a little while ago and it looks like the red blotching on her sides is starting to fade away. Home today 'cause of a migraine. Thanks for asking.

Do you have plants in the tank with the ammonia problem? Tried not feeding for a couple of days to see if it goes away? I used to get that damn .25 reading all the time, but now that the 2 tanks I used to get it in are crowded with plants, I don't see it anymore. I'm really bad about overfeeding in my livebearer tanks because I want my babies to get plenty of food and grow fast.


----------



## danilykins

I'm so sorry for your loss  Hopefully now you can prevent the others from getting sick. Have you done a good water change?


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> I treated her the second time last night and just looked at her a little while ago and it looks like the red blotching on her sides is starting to fade away. Home today 'cause of a migraine. Thanks for asking.
> 
> Do you have plants in the tank with the ammonia problem? Tried not feeding for a couple of days to see if it goes away? I used to get that damn .25 reading all the time, but now that the 2 tanks I used to get it in are crowded with plants, I don't see it anymore. I'm really bad about overfeeding in my livebearer tanks because I want my babies to get plenty of food and grow fast.


Such good news on your fish! congrats...sounds like she'll pull through 

The tank is a 20 gal and is completely planted. However the watersprite I don't think is getting enough light, so it keeps going brown then resprouting. it may be the nature of that plant but I'm not sure. i have it in another tank and not as bad a die-off as this one. i will probably try to float some and see if that helps. i know it dies easily if you bury the roots which i am guilty of because i don't like them floating usually cause they get tangled on the filter. the rest of the plants are mostly java which is growing like crazy and another plant that I don't know the name of and two weigii (or a name something like that)...

good idea on no feeding. i will try that.


----------



## Niki7

danilykins said:


> I'm so sorry for your loss  Hopefully now you can prevent the others from getting sick. Have you done a good water change?


thanks...

when she got sick i did a 50% change, and twice since (past week or maybe 8 days). there are mostly fry in there so as they look like they are getting sick i cull them. hopefully it will be ok!!


----------



## jrman83

Need some Wisteria? I got a forrest in one of my tanks that I am thinning and eventually rescaping.


----------



## Niki7

jrman83 said:


> Need some Wisteria? I got a forrest in one of my tanks that I am thinning and eventually rescaping.


Would love some! but what kind of light does it need? After tax refund I hope to get a better fixture  but for now it is low...


----------



## jrman83

Niki7 said:


> Would love some! but what kind of light does it need? After tax refund I hope to get a better fixture  but for now it is low...


It'll work in low light. It'll just grow slower. PM me if you're serious about wanting some.


----------

