# LED vs. Metal halide



## timeforFOWLR

Has anyone else found a comparison head to head like this one comparing MH and LED?

orphek


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## Levi

I had MH and bought LED and it is vastly superior to MH. I just posted LED pics in another post under equipment.


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## timeforFOWLR

Levi said:


> I had MH and bought LED and it is vastly superior to MH. I just posted LED pics in another post under equipment.


 couldn't find that thread. Can you link me to it...


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## Levi

woops sorry. I forgot that I had started the thread when my tank was a 10 gallon nano... My mistake 

http://www.aquariumforum.com/f20/t5-my-10-gallon-nano-13169.html


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## phys

I havent found many comparisons outside of seeing what people have in certain sized tanks compared to what others have in their tanks.. and these were just personal comparisons while searching around. But as i've seen so far: 50W LED (3W per LED) is about equal to 150-200 watts MH depending on types of MH lamps.


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## Levi

phys said:


> I havent found many comparisons outside of seeing what people have in certain sized tanks compared to what others have in their tanks.. and these were just personal comparisons while searching around. But as i've seen so far: 50W LED (3W per LED) is about equal to 150-200 watts MH depending on types of MH lamps.


+1

It is hard to compare but one trend I've noticed and it only goes one way. Once you go LED you never go back. MH you get high electric bills and heat so people switch to T5 or whatever. LED is all benefit it seems


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## elva

for all i know the led light 1 watt power is equal to 6 to 7 watts MH lamps


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## timeforFOWLR

Levi said:


> woops sorry. I forgot that I had started the thread when my tank was a 10 gallon nano... My mistake
> 
> http://www.aquariumforum.com/f20/t5-my-10-gallon-nano-13169.html


Thanks. That 30 is loking nice. How are your LEDs doing for you?


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## timeforFOWLR

Levi said:


> +1
> 
> It is hard to compare but one trend I've noticed and it only goes one way. Once you go LED you never go back. MH you get high electric bills and heat so people switch to T5 or whatever. LED is all benefit it seems


Yeah, that is what I am seeing. The thing about LED is the lack of tanks that have been grown under it. People have tanks that have recently switched but not many out there that I can find that grew up with LED.

Here is video I found of a tank switching to LED. It is a gorgeous tank. Video is halfway down.

orphek


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## Levi

Yeah it's a new technology so it will be a while before you see many


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## trouble93

Just wanted to weigh in here...I have used MH's for years now and have been very happy. Though I myself have not taken LED plunge I have two friends that have. First let me tell you about there setups. Both have 90gal RR tanks with two 17.5" panels with 1watt LED's backed up by two 65k grow bulbs(the ones they use for hydroponics, bulbs and ballast all in one). In theory this should work well. They have growth like you wouldn't believe, but the color sucks. When I started to do research on my own, I found you should use no less then 3watt LED's for a reef tank. The units I priced for a standard 48" tank would cost up upwards of $2500.00 Big money up front but over time it will save you on your light bill big time. Being in this hobby for a few years now, I tell people that ask me about LED's it's still relatively new technology. So I would wait until the dust settles for two reasons first you will have more people to poll and second the prices will start to come down.


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## timeforFOWLR

trouble93 said:


> Just wanted to weigh in here...I have used MH's for years now and have been very happy. Though I myself have not taken LED plunge I have two friends that have. First let me tell you about there setups. Both have 90gal RR tanks with two 17.5" panels with 1watt LED's backed up by two 65k grow bulbs(the ones they use for hydroponics, bulbs and ballast all in one). In theory this should work well. They have growth like you wouldn't believe, but the color sucks. When I started to do research on my own, I found you should use no less then 3watt LED's for a reef tank. The units I priced for a standard 48" tank would cost up upwards of $2500.00 Big money up front but over time it will save you on your light bill big time. Being in this hobby for a few years now, I tell people that ask me about LED's it's still relatively new technology. So I would wait until the dust settles for two reasons first you will have more people to poll and second the prices will start to come down.


I can understand that thought process. It seems to me that very few companies out there are doing their own thing and pushing the envelope. All you ever hear is "Cree, Cree, Cree..." Good marketing on Cree's part BUT if LED is really going to push ahead into our sector and be sucessful it seems to me that being forthright and honest about their products is going to get them a long way. Spectrographs and good info on what exactly their products produce in the way of light will help me to make decisions.


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## John7429

I still prefer my halide. Tried LED, didn't work well for me.


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## timeforFOWLR

John7429 said:


> I still prefer my halide. Tried LED, didn't work well for me.


I hear ya on that. 

MH is going to continue to be the top dog until....

1. technology is proven- Big beautiful tanks grown under LED....
2. More modularity- ability to exchange out for different LEDs
3. Price drops- it's all about the spouses approval...and it's easier to get if it's less $$$. *r2


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## trouble93

timeforFOWLR said:


> I hear ya on that.
> 
> MH is going to continue to be the top dog until....
> 
> 1. technology is proven- Big beautiful tanks grown under LED....
> 2. More modularity- ability to exchange out for different LEDs
> 3. Price drops- it's all about the spouses approval...and it's easier to get if it's less $$$. *r2


+1 It would take alot for me to even think about taking down my MH. They are still just to new. And the company's that do offer then now 6 month from now they will tell you these are the ones you should have gotten. I run 400watts all the way around because a few years ago I thought unless I go to a longer tank I never have to upgrade my lights. I talked to another friend today that said if you are going to do LED's the best way is doing a DIY setup. One thing I have learned in this hobby, no matter what way you go it's going to cost you.


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## phys

$2500!!! wow! yea, ripoff! 3 watt LEDs should be the way to go. they have more light output per area and will penetrate the water deeper due to this. I built my LED setup for 200 bucks and it was overkill. I could have spent 130-150 and had the same results (due to the full output of the 3 watt LEDs was too much for a 20 gallon with the number of them i have). Pricing for LED has come down and you'll probably see a drop in overall prices by the end of the summer as LED companies hash out the newest and brightest LEDs yet. 

For color!!! Yes, this is important! You'll need to make sure you get a good mixture of actinic and white leds orrrrr go with actinic and tri-color setups. That means, Red, Green, Blue and some Royal Blue to get things growing well with tons of color. White LEDs have good spectral response across a good portion but the RGB-RB setup will allow a better coverage of more of the spectrum for those subtle colors you'll look for. But! White LEDs do provide a good amount of light where its needed. I have several zoanthid colonies that have kept the colors from a MH (person i purchased from used this) to my LED setup and some that have changed color (probably due to the different location despite it was from the same colony)). 

Personally, i think MH and fluorescent lights are terrible in the sense of power usage and waste. I hope to see all lighting converted to some form of LED or equivilent due to the extremely low power usage and the long lifetime.


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## trouble93

phys said:


> $2500!!! wow! yea, ripoff! 3 watt LEDs should be the way to go. they have more light output per area and will penetrate the water deeper due to this. I built my LED setup for 200 bucks and it was overkill. I could have spent 130-150 and had the same results (due to the full output of the 3 watt LEDs was too much for a 20 gallon with the number of them i have). Pricing for LED has come down and you'll probably see a drop in overall prices by the end of the summer as LED companies hash out the newest and brightest LEDs yet.
> 
> For color!!! Yes, this is important! You'll need to make sure you get a good mixture of actinic and white leds orrrrr go with actinic and tri-color setups. That means, Red, Green, Blue and some Royal Blue to get things growing well with tons of color. White LEDs have good spectral response across a good portion but the RGB-RB setup will allow a better coverage of more of the spectrum for those subtle colors you'll look for. But! White LEDs do provide a good amount of light where its needed. I have several zoanthid colonies that have kept the colors from a MH (person i purchased from used this) to my LED setup and some that have changed color (probably due to the different location despite it was from the same colony)).
> 
> Personally, i think MH and fluorescent lights are terrible in the sense of power usage and waste. I hope to see all lighting converted to some form of LED or equivilent due to the extremely low power usage and the long lifetime.


Do you have the DIY plans you used for your build? I would like to take a look at them.


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## phys

i dont have them now.. but i'll put some up soon.


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## AZDesertRat

I just made the switch from 2x250w XM 15K MH to two Aqua Illumination Sol Blues with their controller.
I was a dyed in the wool MH fan but I'm now a convert!
For one the power consumption measured on my Kill A Watt meter went from 500 watts to 49 watts running the two modules at 45% white, 40% blue and 45% royal blue. Thats a huge savings in power costs, $31.50 a month to be exact at my electric rates and 8-10 hours a day usage. Throw in the $200 I sold the old MH and VHO lights, ballasts and reflectors for and the lack of annual bulb changes and I will see a payback in 16 months or less. Thats not even considering the reduced load on my home AC, the cost to run the fans or chiller which I sold too or the reduced RO/DI since it will not be evaporating as much now and the house humidity will be lower.

I held out for the AI Sol Blue and I really feel they were worth the wait. I'm still acclimating the system and tweaking the individual colors but I am extremely happy with LED.


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## trouble93

AZDesertRat said:


> I just made the switch from 2x250w XM 15K MH to two Aqua Illumination Sol Blues with their controller.
> I was a dyed in the wool MH fan but I'm now a convert!
> For one the power consumption measured on my Kill A Watt meter went from 500 watts to 49 watts running the two modules at 45% white, 40% blue and 45% royal blue. Thats a huge savings in power costs, $31.50 a month to be exact at my electric rates and 8-10 hours a day usage. Throw in the $200 I sold the old MH and VHO lights, ballasts and reflectors for and the lack of annual bulb changes and I will see a payback in 16 months or less. Thats not even considering the reduced load on my home AC, the cost to run the fans or chiller which I sold too or the reduced RO/DI since it will not be evaporating as much now and the house humidity will be lower.
> 
> I held out for the AI Sol Blue and I really feel they were worth the wait. I'm still acclimating the system and tweaking the individual colors but I am extremely happy with LED.


I kinda know the answer,but what was the up front cost?


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## AZDesertRat

$1100.


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## trouble93

AZDesertRat said:


> $1100.


That's not bad... The last time I looked for a 4 foot tank 4 units and the controller would be about $2300


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## AZDesertRat

With the AI units thats overkill. My tank is 5 foot x 18" and I turned two modules lengthwise and have no shadows or dark spots, at most 3 modules on a 4 or 5 foot tank is plenty.


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## trouble93

AZDesertRat said:


> With the AI units thats overkill. My tank is 5 foot x 18" and I turned two modules lengthwise and have no shadows or dark spots, at most 3 modules on a 4 or 5 foot tank is plenty.


I do know a guy that has one AI with a controller over a 37gal. tank looks good. And when he showed me the lightning mode it was awesome. Just like any new toy in this hobby if you are going to run with the big boys you have to have big boy toys. They said I was crazy when I got my first vortech powerhead, so much money for one powerhead and now I have two and wouldn't own anything else. I say the to say it's inevitable one day I will take the LED plunge, but for now I'm just going to wait until the dust settles.


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## timeforFOWLR

Ok, I think I am going to take the plunge and go for the Orphek PR156.

This tank and look is what I am going for....

YouTube - ‪IMG 0067‬‏

Here is a good article to help you to understand the difference in the lighting....


How to Choose and Compare LEDs - They're Not Metal Halides! - Captive Aquatics: An Aquarium and Ecology Blog


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## AZDesertRat

The Orpheks are not receiving the good reviews like the AI are. You might want to do more investigating before jumping in. For me they did not have the adjustability I was looking for.
Here is a thread on RC that is already 86 pages long and its not even a month old.
AquaIllumination PAR Measurements - Reef Central Online Community


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## trouble93

AZDesertRat said:


> The Orpheks are not receiving the good reviews like the AI are. You might want to do more investigating before jumping in. For me they did not have the adjustability I was looking for.
> Here is a thread on RC that is already 86 pages long and its not even a month old.
> AquaIllumination PAR Measurements - Reef Central Online Community


 I agree from all I have read and all I have heard and seen, AI would be your best bet.


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## timeforFOWLR

This is a 1350 gallon tank lit with the Orpheks. WOW

Peter's Albums


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