# Hardy fish cycling



## guygenius

Hi all,

I am newbie aquarium enthusiast. Last weekend I got a 20G Agueon aquarium kit from Petco. I have filled the tank with de-chlorinated water and turned on the water pump and heater for the past 4-5 days. Tomorrow I am going to visit Petco, get the water tested. If the water is suitable, I will get hardy fish for cycling the tank.

Any suggestions for hardy fish cycling? Any particular hardy fish that you would recommend? I will be monitoring the water quality closely during tank cycling.

Thanks for your help!


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## majerah1

Any reason why you dont want to fishless cycle?Zebra danios are about the hardiest you cn get for cycling,but it still takes a large toll on them.


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## plecosrawesome

zebra danios,but ihave used my african clawed frog to cycle a lot of tanks,hes 30 some years old..


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## rtbob

+1 on the Danios for cycling with fish. Also get a good liquid test kit and be prepared to do water changes to keep ammonia and nitrIte levels in check. Sometimes daily water changes may be needed to keep these levels non-lethal. I would think 3-4 Danios will be plenty for a 20 gallon tank.


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## DianaHart

My brother just cycled a 15 gallon tanks with a whole lot of plants, lemon tetras, danios and serpaes with the heat set to 80 F. One danio died and the rest are doing well.

I just attemped to cycle a 10 with Danios and they all died.

Nothing is certain when cycling with fish, even with daily water changes and obsessive testing.

Fishless cycling is the safest method IMO.


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## guygenius

Thanks all! The reason I am not going for fishless cycle is because I would like to have atleast few fish in the tank.

I will ask the Petco associate to give me Zebra Danios. I want to take utmost care of them, so will buy the API freshwater test kit to test the water periodically.

One question that I have is after bringing the fish home in the plastic bag, do I have to wait for them to settle down before putting in the tank or I can directly put them in the tank?


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## DianaHart

Float the bag in the tank for at least 20 minutes to half an hour, add a little bit of tank water every few minutes to the bag. When the temperature in the bag is the same as the tank, empty the water into a bucket, catch the fish in a net and put them in your tank. I don't put fish store water in my tank...you never know what's in it, but often there is Ich.


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## beaslbob

I would add a lot of anacharis which is a fast growing aquatic plant. It will help break up the cycle by consuming ammonia directly should the bacteria not be able to keep up.

for a hardy fish I would get a male platy and not add food to the tank for a week. Then add a couple of females and start feeding a single flake per day. The idea is to not only use a hardy fish but to also keep the bioload low until the tank can process that bioload.


my .02


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## NeonShark666

My favorite fishes for cycling are Female Bettas, Guppies and White Mountain Clouds. Use Guppies for high ph (7.5+), Clouds for low ph (6.5-) and Bettas for warm conditions (80+). Limit your added fishes to two.


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## guygenius

beaslbob said:


> I would add a lot of anacharis which is a fast growing aquatic plant. It will help break up the cycle by consuming ammonia directly should the bacteria not be able to keep up.
> 
> for a hardy fish I would get a male platy and not add food to the tank for a week. Then add a couple of females and start feeding a single flake per day. The idea is to not only use a hardy fish but to also keep the bioload low until the tank can process that bioload.
> 
> 
> my .02


Thanks! Where can I get Anacharis? Will I get it in Petco? Will I need fertilizers if I get a small Anacharis?


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## DianaHart

Anacharis grows like mad...you won't need anything special for it.


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## tulip55555

I just finished cycling with Danio and if I had it to do over I would definitely go fishless. As if the worrying weren't enough, the wait was even worse. I think you could cycle much faster without fish.


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## guygenius

tulip55555 said:


> I just finished cycling with Danio and if I had it to do over I would definitely go fishless. As if the worrying weren't enough, the wait was even worse. I think you could cycle much faster without fish.


What was the size of the tank? How long did it take?


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## tulip55555

It's a 40 gallon and it took almost 6 weeks, and from what I hear I'm pretty lucky. Fish-in cycles can go on for months because the amount of ammonia has to stay so low for the fish to live. And the stress...every time a fish swam funny or didn't eat I got so worried.


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## jrman83

Most cycles take 3-8wks. Every tank is different.


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## holly12

I'm currently cycling a 20 gallon tank and started this past Sunday. It's been 5 days and my ammonia is going down and Nitrites are going up, which means the cycle is well on it's way. (NOT finished but definitely cycling). It's the first time I've ever cycled fishless and I will NEVER cycle with fish again! I'm anxious to move everyone from my 10g to the 20g because it's a new tank and I want it all set up and running but I want to do it right and not hurt anyone in the process. There is no stress when cycling fishless because there is no one to worry about killing. It's going much faster than cycling with fish ever has. (Just a recommendation.) I was a die hard "use fish to cycle" person but had so many ppl recommend fishless that I decided to try it. It's amazing! (And really easy if you have a water test kit!)

Also, since fishless cycling puts more ammonia into the water than your animals ever will, the tank is ready for a full stock (not to over stock your tank, but you can put all the fish in at once) when it's done cycling. When you cycle with fish, even when it's done cycling you have to add the animals slowly to build up the bio-load capabilities of the filter. (Since I've got a lot of algae eaters, I've got to stock slowly to give the tank time to grow micro-algea, but I also have to get some fish in there as soon as it's done cycling or the good bacteria will die and I'll have to start all over again, lol). I'm going to put the guppy, 2 cards, 4 rasboras (they are literally one cm long, lol, tiny!), maaaybe get some danios (not sure yet).... in and then wait a week or two. Then I'll move in the frogs, snails, Otos, bamboo shrimp and RCS after dosing the water with Phytoplankton for the Bamboo shrimp.


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## FishesRDelicious

My first tank consisted of goldfish and fake plants. I didn't know anything about cycling. I just decorated the tank and put water conditioner in for chlorine and added 5 small comets that were given to me. Never had a problem. Did the same with a convict after I heard of cycling but before I fully understood it, though they are extremely tough. Starting a new tank with what I know now, I'd just get some gravel from another tank and let it sit at least a week. Add a couple fish and test a couple times before really stocking it. You want a stable tank for adding a lot of fish at once.


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## guygenius

Hi all,

I got the water tested in Petco store and they said that the water quality is good. So I got three Zebra Danios (long fin) and one Anubias (in wood). I have few more questions about the new aquatic pets 

1) The three Zebra Danios appear to be exploring the aquarium and they are quite active. Often they chase each other. I read that this species is social but is their chasing behavior expected (I think all three that I have got are males).

2) For lighting, I will eventually buy a timer but for the time-being, I am thinking of turning the hood light on in the morning when we wake up and turning it off at night before we go to sleep so that they follow the day-night cycle like us. Is this ok?

3) I have tropical fish flakes as food. The flakes are kinda big in comparison with the fish. Do I need to to crush them into smaller pieces before feeding or the fish can nibble small proportions of the large flakes themselves?

Regards,
Kalpesh


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## holly12

1. They are social. Have also been called 'high strung' at times, lol. I think you are fine. (When they get bored they've been known to pick on other fish, so it sounds like they are just burning energy). If you notice them actually biting each others fins or doing damage, you may have to separate them or take them back.

2. Should be fine. If you find you are starting to get algae, cut back on the time you keep the light on. (Mine's on for about 14 hours or so..... but I've got Otos, snails and RCS that eat algae, lol).

3. I'm sure they could nibble the food as is, but I'd crush it up into more manageable bits for them. (That's what I've always done with my fish).


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## Nik Uyr

Just my opinion on fishless cycling: While it definitely is a lesson in patience, it is worth its weight (or worth the wait) in gold in terms of how much one can learn about water chemistry, biology etc. I learned all about the nitrogen cycle, and observed over time as nematodes appeared, hydra appeared, copepods (cyclops), and various algaes. Fun stuff.


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## Nik Uyr

Re: Zebra Danios...I have come to regard them as the "punks" of my aquarium. They push my cories out of the way and steal their food, they chase each other and any other fish around. But all my fish have learned to deal with them. Even my Ember tetras which are less than an inch long, they where afraid of the Danios at first, but now they swim freely about the tank, seemingly unconcerned. If a Danio does chase an Ember Tetra, it usually outmaneuvers the Danio pretty quickly. Danios definitely are spastic. One of mine jumped out of the tank during the night...I heard him flopping on the carpet and jumped out of bed and got him back in the tank...two months later he is doing fine.


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## guygenius

Thanks all. Yesterday was day 5 of tank cycling with the Zebra Danios. I checked the water quality with API liquid test kit. Here are the results:

Water temp = 79 F
pH = 8.0
Ammonia + Ammonium = 0.5 ppm
Nitrite = 0 ppm
Nitrate = 0 ppm

The water pH level looks on the high side. Also, the Ammonia level has began to shoot up. It looks a little high for the fish to tolerate. Should I change the water now? If yes, how much %? I am afraid that in the process of doing so, the good bacteria may also get removed.


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## jrman83

Ph looks fine. I would not change any water unless ammonia or nitrite get _above_ 1. If it stays below, leave it. Amount of change should be based off of how much above 1 it gets. Water removal will slow down the cycle some, but it will not be a huge effect.


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## RobertTheFish

I have to say I won't try fish-in cycling ever again.

I tried with 4 danios, monitored water daily and had the worst time doing WCs to keep the ammonia at a survivable level for them. 1 by 1 they all died.

I finally finished the cycle by just dropping some fish food in everyday and letting it make the ammonia for me.

The thing with cycling is that you want your ammonia to spike so the N-bacteria have something to eat. But that would kill your fish. 

In my mind it's two opposite things. I just suggest going fishless, and cyle faster at water parms that are fatal for fish...then your n-bacteria grow like crazy and you're good to go.

Don't get me wrong. I am not knocking you in any way. I've done it myself (fish-in). That's why I recommend against it.


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## beaslbob

RobertTheFish said:


> I have to say I won't try fish-in cycling ever again.
> 
> I tried with 4 danios, monitored water daily and had the worst time doing WCs to keep the ammonia at a survivable level for them. 1 by 1 they all died.
> 
> I finally finished the cycle by just dropping some fish food in everyday and letting it make the ammonia for me.
> 
> The thing with cycling is that you want your ammonia to spike so the N-bacteria have something to eat. But that would kill your fish.
> 
> In my mind it's two opposite things. I just suggest going fishless, and cyle faster at water parms that are fatal for fish...then your n-bacteria grow like crazy and you're good to go.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. I am not knocking you in any way. I've done it myself (fish-in). That's why I recommend against it.


What you didn't do (IMHO) is first start the tank heavily planted, wait a week, add a single fish, and not add food for a week. *old dude

That way ammonia never spikes and there is no stress for the fish.

(the plants consume the ammonia directly preventing the spikes).


my .02


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## guygenius

Today is day 9 of tank cycling. Of the three Zebra Danios that I got for cycling, one has started to behave weirdly. This one is the leanest of the three and often used to get chased by the other two. Lately, it has begun hiding below the wood (that houses Anubias) and gravel. Also, it is opening and closing its mouth more often than others. From what I read online, it means that the fish is doing so due to less oxygen and more ammonia in water. The Zebra Danio while hiding makes occasional movements and those movement look usual, so I think its sick and trying to recover by taking maximum rest. Would like to know your opinion about it.

Here are the water parameters:

Water temp = 79 F
pH = 8.0
Ammonia + Ammonium = 0.5 ppm
Nitrite = 0 ppm
Nitrate = 0 ppm


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## braindoc77

Your danio may just be doing what it would have done no matter what tank it got put into; you're right in the window where a fish that was probably not going to make it will start to declare itself. On the other hand, doing a water change is a quick and (relatively) easy way to rule out a problem with the water that your test kits may or may not pick up. The majority of the bacteria live in your filter and the substrate, not the water itself, so just make sure to dechlorinate your new water before you add it in and you shouldn't significantly prolong the cycling process. Even a 15% change may make the difference for a fish that is on the cusp.

Now, if you want to _shorten_ the cycling process, just look to beaslbob's advice; a heavily planted tank is a joy to cycle. Depending on your budget, you may even want to look into one of the nitrosomonas/nitrobacter preparations out there; why wait for the right bacteria to show up on their own when you can just dump them in out of a bottle?


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## Lil Gashog

I have 7 danios they chase each other 24/7 dont worry about it.


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## holly12

Danios are "high strung." They chase each other and then when they get tired of that, they chase other fish. Normal.


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## braindoc77

My wife calls them the "frat boys" of the tank (giant danios, not zebras, but same general behavior).


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## RobertTheFish

guygenius said:


> ...it is opening and closing its mouth more often than others. From what I read online, it means that the fish is doing so due to less oxygen and more ammonia in water.
> 
> Here are the water parameters:
> 
> Water temp = 79 F
> pH = 8.0
> Ammonia + Ammonium = 0.5 ppm
> Nitrite = 0 ppm
> Nitrate = 0 ppm


Your ammonia doesn't sound too crazy, honestly. He's probably just the most sensitive. If you let it go up from there they will all die. If you keep your WCs regular then you may be able to help them survive the cycle.

You'll probably lose the weak one. He's panting because the ammonia is clogging up his blood, preventing the oxygen from binding. Fish is suffocating.


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## beaslbob

guygenius said:


> Today is day 9 of tank cycling. Of the three Zebra Danios that I got for cycling, one has started to behave weirdly. This one is the leanest of the three and often used to get chased by the other two. Lately, it has begun hiding below the wood (that houses Anubias) and gravel. Also, it is opening and closing its mouth more often than others. From what I read online, it means that the fish is doing so due to less oxygen and more ammonia in water. The Zebra Danio while hiding makes occasional movements and those movement look usual, so I think its sick and trying to recover by taking maximum rest. Would like to know your opinion about it.
> 
> Here are the water parameters:
> 
> Water temp = 79 F
> pH = 8.0
> Ammonia + Ammonium = 0.5 ppm
> Nitrite = 0 ppm
> Nitrate = 0 ppm


Zebras are a schooling fish and as such you should have 1 or more then 4 but nothing inbetween. They establish a "pecking order". With more then 4 the one above and one below a given fish are more closely matched to that given fish. I worry the "runt" in your three will not make it.


my .02


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## guygenius

beaslbob said:


> Zebras are a schooling fish and as such you should have 1 or more then 4 but nothing inbetween. They establish a "pecking order". With more then 4 the one above and one below a given fish are more closely matched to that given fish. I worry the "runt" in your three will not make it.
> 
> 
> my .02


I was told to pick three by the Petco associate, hence the number. I performed a 20% water change today. The "runt" has come out of the hiding place and is moving around but it is often chased by one of the other two Danios. Should I add one more to the family now?

Should I add nitrosomonas / nitrobacter preparations to help bacterial growth? If yes, which brand should I use?


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## celticsfan13

i would go fishless if i was u i did cycling with guppies and everything went fine even with constant monitoring and water changes, but after 5 months my tank randomly went haywire with bad conditions literally overnight


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## beaslbob

guygenius said:


> I was told to pick three by the Petco associate, hence the number. I performed a 20% water change today. The "runt" has come out of the hiding place and is moving around but it is often chased by one of the other two Danios. Should I add one more to the family now?


At this point I would get the population down to 1 then add 4 later. let the tank get more established before adding more fish.


> Should I add nitrosomonas / nitrobacter preparations to help bacterial growth? If yes, which brand should I use?


NO

repeat 

No

*old dude

Those are junk and a waste of money IMHO. 

Instead I would add fast growing plants like anacharis instead. That will cost about the same and have a much better effect on the health of your tank and fish then any chemical additive.


my .02


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