# What happened to my tank?!



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

Please i need your help. My tank is utterly covered in algae. I am not sure what kind it is but its on everything and my tank is half what it use to be. But how did this happen?

I was given the opportunity to teach english in korea which i took advantage of leaving my fully cycled lightly planted 30g freahwater tropical tank to my father who swore to me he would take care of the tank while i was away. I showed him everything from simple water changes every week or so to changing filter medium every month, feeding, heck i gave him the number to the local fish store in case things got out of hand. Now i figured there would be losses. It happens, but wow.... He literally didn't try. When i walked through the door to the house i turned and saw the tank. All i could say was "what the f$&@"

The tank once had about 10 tetra, 3 panda cats, 2 zebra loaches, 3 guppies, 3 platys 2 otos, and 1 rubber lipped pleco. You might say it was over crowded but i had two 30 gallon filters working on max and everything was dandy for months before i left for korea. All thats left is 2 tetra, 1 panda cat, (at least 1) zebra loache, a oto and my instead of water changes he just added water when it got too low (thank god he used declorinatir at least) and he changed the filter medium almost Every month.... Almost. He is now banned from the fish tank.

I have been home less than 24 hours and havn't slept in over that much time. And i don't know how or where to rebuild....
The tank is running two vita-life m200 filters, a appropriate heater. The hood is gone with some new light just sitting on top i dont know the model or wattage or power yet. I would tell you its temp but the thermometer, which i found floating around the top broke in my hand like i had snapped it but the heater was set to i believe 80. The tank did have a air stone whichs motor was worn and the piping for it was coveredd. Upon taking the airstone out it crumbled in my hand As soon as i tried to seperate the tubing from the actual stone. And the icing one the cake is that the tank is being hit with direct sunlight everymorning. As soon as i find my water testing kit ill give y'all amonia, nitrite and nitrate numbers

What ahould i do to fix this tank and make it the coolness it once was?

My other thought was to just transfer them to a old 28g biocube i owned and had planned to make into a saltwater tank prior to leaving the states. At this point i would perfer that as their tank but im not sure what to do.....

I have pictures uploaded of the abyss that was my 30g tank. Please tell me what this stuff is and how i can remedy all of this...


Please help


PicGarage - Open For You!
PicGarage - Open For You!
PicGarage - Open For You!
PicGarage - Open For You!
PicGarage - Open For You!


----------



## Manafel (Sep 4, 2011)

Well, the first thing is to slowly change out all of the water for a few days. I'm sure the nitrates atre through the roof. With your fish being in it for so long, they probably are used to the "Heavy water", and if you change too much at once, it will stress them out or put them into shock from the pH. to clean your algae problem, you can scrape off the algae on the walls of the tank before a water change and gravel vac, and take out all of the decor and soak it in a vinegar and water solution, then take an abrasive brush and clean out the algae. When the algae floats from scraping, I alwas grab my fishnet and net the floaties out of the water as best as I can. It works pretty well. Let us know when you get your Params. Sorry to hear about your poor coming home


----------



## Brian757 (Sep 24, 2012)

Well, it appears your tanking had/is having an algae bloom:

The problem won't go away if you do not correct the cause, you may use algaecide over and over again and the problem will come back, it´s like trying to cover the sun with a finger.

The cause of algae blooms are: 

Too much light and too much free nitrogen in your tank. Light can be corrected by shading the place where the tank is located or by reducing the hours of light (by turning off the lamp). "Free nitrogen" on the other hand is a little bit more tricky. The most common causes if increased nitrogen levels are: too many animals(a large biomass), or too much food. Food that decomposes and turns into ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Reducing the biomass, increasing water changes and reducing the amount of food restores the balance to the system. You need to use both approaches, reducing the light levels and reducing the amount of free nitrogen, that way the algae will not have two of the elements it needs in order to grow.

But you have quite a build-up. I would do what Manafel says with the cleaning, and I would almost say to keep water from that tank and put it in a bucket with your "survivors" and then recycle your tank with new water(Clean, appropriate amm., nitrate, nitrite, pH levels) and do a drip line acclimation to their new water source once the tank is corrected.


----------



## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

What's happened is that the algae is starving the fish of oxygen. It shouldn't be too bad to get rid of.
First of all, daylight is bad news for the nutrients that you have in there. Filters are also likely to be pretty useless in their traditional form for the amount of gunk in your tank.
To have your fish survive in there, you need LOADS of oxygen. 2 or 3 airstones would probably be your best filtration option (read circulation)
I doubt that your plants will be in very good condition but we'll get there eventually.
Drop your temp by 2 degrees/day for 2 days to slow down metabolism a little and increase oxygen in the water.
At the same time, greatly reduce light in the tank - blackout would be good but a short 4 hour burst will keep things stable.
Get some Seachem Excel and dose the stated amount daily after a small 10% water change - don't worry about the media in your filters just yet - or cover the intakes with a pair of new nylons.
What's going to happen is that the algae is going to get starved and then syphoned out with the water changes. The oxygen will help the fish breathe and certainly stir things up but don't worry about cloudiness just yet.
After about 3 days you should see a difference. With a reduced fish bio-load things should start improving quite quickly.
An important thing to do though is check for ammonia to give you an indication of a lost tank-mate that you haven't spotted.
There hasn't been a bad algae problem in my tank for which the cure has been more than 3 days - so if your tank is cycled - rather stick with the maturity.
One thing might help a LOT though would be a plant such as frogbit to soak up the nutrients on the surface and also dim the light.
cb


----------



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

Ok after some sleep and a little food I am a bit recharged. I have found used my api freshwater test kit. When I have some time I plan to get the levels double checked at my old stomping grounds because I am kinda surprised by the levels.
there as follows using a API Freshwater test kit. unfortunately the card that came with it (as helpful as that was) is missing so i did it based on a picture of one online.
PH: higher then labeled
High PH: 8.4 (in tank) 8 from the faucet
Ammonia: .5ppm - 1ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm (funny story about this when I got time)
Nitrate:5ppm-10ppm

Now the water source is the kitchen tap and served me well when I was around to do the work, never had a issue with it in the past and did not see any relation to fish dying as a result of it. still I don't remember ever needing the High PH tester to check the PH.

I want to thank you guys for your speedy responses and solutions at the moment I have yet to clean anything save what I can with the magnet scrubber because alot of my old cleaning supplies were either thrown out, or in my gravel vacs case used to siphon out the fountain outside and otherwise being broken. So when I have some time (most likely tomorrow) I will be getting a new supplies. I had a few questions first about your responses

The first being from Manafel. About how much should I be changing Daily in terms of percentage? reason I ask is because whats alot to some is not enough for others. should I do a 5% or 10% water change? or even less than 5? As for the the vinegar solution. how many parts vinegar and water should I use? I have heard people using bleach and such but vinegar sounds safer.

Brian757 I totally agree and from what I have been told they were fed only once in a while. I have yet to put food in because I didn't want to make things worse. For the lighting I have it set on a 8 hour timer and can easily reduce that to whatever is needed but it should be noted that I can't move the tank as now there is no place else to put it and with its location it is subjected to morning sunlight blasting through the window. fortunately it is not close to the window and during the rest of the day out of the way of sunlight but still sunlight does reach it daily.
as for "I would almost say to keep water from that tank and put it in a bucket with your "survivors" and then recycle your tank with new water(Clean, appropriate amm., nitrate, nitrite, pH levels) and do a drip line acclimation to their new water source once the tank is corrected. " could you please elaborate on this for me? how long should I place my survivors in a bucket for? how would I go about recycling the tank? and what is drip line acclimation? one last question...what kind of algae is it? (curiosity)

cleb.berry I had one large pump working on a airstone and was working (the pump is worn but still functioning) upon my arrival home but the airstone is crumbled and useless now. right now the best I can do is just stick the pump back on with the tube in the tank and go without a airstone. The tank isn't a planeted tank. it had plants originally at one point but for the sake of my father I removed them before I left to Korea so currently there are no live plants in the tank. I do have access to anacharis and a marimo (moss ball) if that were to help in anyway. Is a black out as simple as putting a blanket or something over the tank and preventing any light in? is 4 hours the minimum or should I go longer? I will see about buying the chemical looking at the filter medium it looks like it was changed about a week or so ago and I don't plan on changing or cleaning either filter (especially the bacteria traps) until after the tank is back to working condition and the tank has good levels in the substrate and decor to sustain the fish while it acclimates. The frogbit is worth a try as for dimming the light I'm not sure how to dim the light on the lamp. any quick ways of doing so?

I know I am asking alot of questions but the littlest details can make the biggest difference and I want to thank everyone who has helped so far with their input and advice


----------



## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

You can always use a piece of cardboard to keep the tank in shade - not pretty but it will work.
The pipe in the tank will greatly increase aeration by mixing the water in the tank more. (Gas exchange happens at the top)
A blanket over the tank for a few days will kill most of the algae - but run that pump.
Honestly, the fish would prefer the algae water in that tank than life in a bucket that may have been used for something else.
I'd say getting a bottle of Seachem Prime and a new airstone (Curtain?) is going to be your first order of the day. 10% PWC twice/day or even 3x will get that ammonia in check sooner. 1ppm will kill the fish especially with a high pH.
Dim the lights = switch them off or remove a tube.
cb


----------



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

Thanks for the info Cleb.berry I'll definitely see about card boarding the side at least until after the mornings. The old man will probably flip out about a piece of cardboard on the tank being out of place or dirty but clearly a dirty tank is ok to have -_-. anyway I'll stick the air pump back in there and pick up at least a cheap airstone (never heard of curtain) to get things going again.

Now that all being said getting Seachem Prime looks like its a regular declorinator and conditioner so why would it help in this specific instance? or is it just what you prefer when you do your water changes? Also just to clarify are you saying do two 10% water changes a day until everything is in order or just add the seachem two -three times a day?

so along with the black out (simple enough) I will do the water changes. Should I go ahead and still remove all the rocks from the tank and do the whole vinegar/water solution scrub down on the rocks in the tank or will that be taken care of as part of the water changes and black out?

A new question has come up for me though. The current light I have is a single tube lamp with a on or off I can't really dim it so what should I do? get a bulb for it that gives off a dimmer glow? suggestions please


----------



## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

I wouldn't touch the rocks for the moment. They may be unsightly but are also surfaces on which nitrifying bacteria thrive. 
Your main risk at the moment is hypoxia - oxygen starvation from the algae in the tank and ammonia/nitrite poisoning.
Prime is a water conditioner but it also has the ability to reduce ammonia's toxicity. When you have high ammonia levels such as in your tank at present, changing the water may cause a drop in pH which makes it more toxic for your fish. Prime should alleviate that to some degree.
For the moment, just leave the lights off, shade the tank and fight the water conditions that could kill your fish. Lots of small water changes.
If you're slightly mathematically inclined, you'd understand the following:
2.5% pwc - after 27 water changes you've changed 50% of the water
5% PWC - after 14 water changes, you've changed 50% of the water
10% PWC - after 7 water changes, you've changed 50% of the water.
After all of the above you will have changed 87.5% of the water.

You can follow this regime - 27 water changes may be a bit much though so start with 2.5% changes 10x/ 1st day, 5% changes 5x 2nd day and 10% changes 3x 3rd day to get on your way - not dissimilar to drip acclimating. This will give you a 60% overall water change and allow you to move up to 15% or even 20%.
cb


----------



## navigator black (Jan 3, 2012)

I would do it differently. I would do 20% daily for a week of so, after scraping off the algae and cleaning up the ornaments. I'd gravel vacuum, to turn it all over. Keep the same light - once the tank is clean, it will not matter. The tank got completely out of whack, and once you bring it back, you'll be fine.
A good steady clean up will be fine. With each water change, I would do a couple of rocks. It won't be easy with that type of algae. Try vinegar, but I'm not sure it'll work - a 5-10% bleach solution may be necessary. I hope not. 

Then again, depending on where you live, the ground is covered in rocks and you could rinse a few off under the hose and replace the lot.

I never use Prime or anything but dechloramination products (if you have chloramine). Just chlorine at 25% changes isn't a big worry. 

You will likely be reducing the water hardness and nutrient load over a week or two, and it should go fine. The algae will counter-attack for a couple of weeks - but no algicides. IMHO they have no place in a fishtank.

I wouldn't cover the tank until all the scraping and at least 4 or 5 water changes were done. It doesn't look like a green algae mess to me. Once you achieve a certain stability, then try covering. As for the cardboard - if the algae wasn't a problem before you left for Korea, why would it become one now? Proper maintence should do it. I have tanks that get direct sunlight, and if I left them for a few months, it would get ugly. But with regular maintenance there is absolutely no problem.

And hey, I hope you enjoyed Korea!


----------



## Manafel (Sep 4, 2011)

As long ad the tank is properly maintained (like navigator black said) the algae shouldn't be an issue. You can use a bleach solution, but I use that as a last resort, and be sure to soak what you cleaned in double dechlorinated water for 24-48 hours before putting them into your tank.


----------



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

Everyone thank you so much for the advice. using a mix of your opinions I have started with the water changes and removing the algae. Somethings I have done so far. I have temporarily removed the light from the fish tank and blocked where the sun comes in. that all being said I will start cleaning the individual rocks in a vinegar solution and doing daily 20% water changes. in a few days if things are going well and the algae is still going I'll do I plan to do a two day complete black out. I will of course be checking the chem levels twice a day. 

Now for the rocks. in general i put them in and I look back to when the tank look right, i have to say I am not a fan of the amount of rocks in there and I was wondering on your guys opinion on the amount of rocks that are in the aquarium. Now these aren't live rocks and I know they have beneficial bacteria in them but I plan to most likely add some more substrate instead. I honestly want to get rid of as many rocks as I can but i do know the fish like to hide around them but they seem to cause trouble in the past for me (still water and trapping waste and difficult areas to clean on casual cleanings)

This is where I would love decorating ideas and feedback because I also do plan to as soon as I can transfer to that biocube I mentioned. it has a easier to use filtration system and overall has a much nicer look....and a hood which is a bonus. plus the stand I have for it means I can easily move it around if needed.

That all being said....how do you get a tank ready for a transfer like this? Since I won't be using the same filters and the filter cleaning has me replace the active charcoal, and 4 sponge filters that means the beneficial bacteria is kept within the substrate and decor. To get things started and properly acclimated does anyone have any tips on that?

I figured a used filter medium from one of the current filters dropped in the water might help?


----------



## Brian757 (Sep 24, 2012)

Go for a Planted tank. Are your surviving fish in the same water that you came home and they were in? If so, keep them in there. Get your newly cleaned tank cycled for a couple of days. Periodically test your water quality. Do some homework on your fish and see what water qualities they prefer. Get your tank to what they want and then do a drip line acclimation to their new home. Put them in a bucket with their current water. Get a small tube and put them on the floor in their bucket. Place one side of the tube into your tank and get suction(sort of like a gravel vac). Place the other side into the bucket. This will slowly mix their water into the tank quality. Or do the 30% tank water addition every 10 minutes for 30 minutes with the fish in a bag sitting in your tank for temp adjustment. Wow, if that was confusing, Just ask!!


----------



## navigator black (Jan 3, 2012)

Replacing all the inserts was a serious mistake that will cost you - it will be weeks before the filtration rebounds. Filters with inserts are always cheaper and I do buy them, but the first thing I do is modify them to be biological filters (I used sponges inside, cut to replace the inserts) and scrap any carbon use. It is a waste of money with little return.

if you already had sponges, there is no reason to have pitched them - rinsing them in water removed from the tank is 100 times better than using new ones. Now you have to wait til they get like the ones you threw out would have been rinsed out ;-(
Floating media does nothing. media transfered into the new filter will jump start the system.

You don't need any rocks with those fish - just make it look good and you are covered. With the fish you were keeping, they were purely decorative. You do need some cover, but not so much that food gets trapped.

I don't know how the filtration is set up in the cube. Remember though, the stocking of the cube is determined by its surface area. Measure that and compare it to a rectangular tank. A tall 30 gallon cube can hold fewer fish than many 15 gallon standards. Depth is not good unless the base is large.


----------



## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

a bit of a simplistic interpretation of the oxygen exchange model. This would be accurate in a stagnant tank but with a filter pumping water from the bottom to the boundary layer at the top the ratio of surface are/volume becomes meaningless.
Tall tanks are worse *for total oxygen exchange with the same boundary layer conditions for a given volume of tank* - but no 2 tanks are ever the same...
With the same pump aiding surface exchange on both tanks, there will be a far smaller difference than what you're making out.
In fact, with the same spray bar operating in a "portrait oriented" tank of the same dimensions as a landscape oriented tank, more oxygenation will take place per square centimeter.
Juwel is a manufacturer that I respect and sells tanks with filters (internal but with large media and 2 levels of flow through the media) and sizes their filters based on desired surface exchange, surface area and tank volume. The sizing is quite carefully done too. Tall tanks have bigger pumps than their larger footprint brethren would suggest - but not too much so as to expel too much CO2. Balance is key.

cb


----------



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

Update!

Hey guys I have been following what you have been saying and so far its working....or was until I was called away and the algae bloom resurfaced somewhat so I am back to work getting rid of the algae though it has far improved from where it once was. The fish seem quite fine with the changes so far but looks can be deceiving so I am keeping a eye on them.

As I mentioned before I plan to move them in to a 28 gallon tank a 28 gallon Biocube. After reading some of the latest comments I should probably clarify what I have and havn't done to both of the tanks so you understand where I am at as there seems to be a miscommunication.

This Biocube once housed the starts of a saltwater tank, it was being cycled at the time then I stopped it and put it away in the garage because of my leaving. As of today it is in the Garage loaded with fresh water no sand or substrate (i cleared as much out as I could) as my goal is to get as much of the salinity and minerals out of the tank and make it a fresh water tank. I figured just daily water changes and cleaning out the filtration which is actually three sponges (has room for a fourth which I will definitely do) and a slot for activated charcoal, I need to do a full rinse of the housing and of both pumps and currently the salinity is at 1.004 Remember I'm not preparing it for freshwater fishes until I know its safe for them while I know that amount of salinity is ok for some fish im more worried about other residual minerals left behind. so advice is appreciated. 

The Filtration on the biocube works as such: a vent in the center at the waterline takes the water in to the back of the tank which houses the filtration system. This makes the water pour and travel through a sponge, a bag of activated carbon, (soon to be another sponge that I will put in) and another sponge then to a pump on each side of the initial vent to circulate the water (total of 4 sponges and 1 bag of carbon). I have tested the circulation of the tank and things at the bottom of the tank do make their way up to the vent and through the system very impressively. I believe that each pump moves water from the back to the main tank (through the filtration) at something of 266 GPH (two pumps one on each side).

I will share pics ASAP on the old and new tank.

To Navigator Black:
The tank with the fish and the algae blooms filter medium has not been changed in several weeks as per regular maintenance so when I started to clean the algae there should have been plenty of beneficial bacteria (as well as the bacteria traps in the filters which I do not clean out) to keep the tank going with little impact to the overall environment. There were no sponge filters in this tank and I have not pitched the sponges from the bio-cube. Now around the 14th is when I plan to replace the cartridges as per-usual it is then that my thought was to take the now used cartridge(s) and place them in the bio-cube to help jump start the bacteria and get things rocking once I have it ready to be properly cycled. 

I did take a majority of the rocks out cleaning the ones I wanted to keep so the loaches have a hiding place as they seem to want it the most. thanks for the heads up on that 

I will measure the cubes surface area but guessing its size in comparison to the current rectangular tank I would say a little over half length wise and 1/4 the width more. Though it might not be able to hold as many fish that is not a problem to me as I don't plan to house even the max it can stand with current filtration which I honestly don't know how to measure that ^_^;;

to cleb.berry

The Current tank has a new larger airstone with a pump going on full making the oxygen exchange work well (and looks cool  ) I plan to jury rig that same pump in to the biocube so we can continue the same oxygen exchange or even more if needed. I really don't plan to buy any new filters and definitely not tanks ^_^;;

Brain 757

uhh please elaborate? ^_^ also I do plan to put plants in the new tank. a Marimo (Moss Ball) and most likely Anacaris because I have them available but as for plants to add I am not sure since I am not sure what fish I will put in the new tank with the current fish I have now, more of the same. most likely but I have a friend who may have some nice fish needing a good home...(seriously they know nothing about fish tanks and it boggles my mind how their fish are alive)


----------



## navigator black (Jan 3, 2012)

Sounds good. To me, the key with cubes is to recognize they are a stylish shape not exactly designed for a lot of of fish, and just enjoy them with fewer fish. 
It's a lot more common in these forums for people to want ten times as many fish as will fit in a tank than to have them take your practical approach, so I think sometimes we write like we expect people to plan disasters - you'll see when you start trying to respond to newcomers' questions...

Salt comes out fairly quickly, and depending on what fish you want, may be beneficial in small quantities - my livebearers love a pinch of salt.


----------



## Kyo121 (Sep 25, 2012)

navigator black said:


> Sounds good. To me, the key with cubes is to recognize they are a stylish shape not exactly designed for a lot of of fish, and just enjoy them with fewer fish.
> It's a lot more common in these forums for people to want ten times as many fish as will fit in a tank than to have them take your practical approach, so I think sometimes we write like we expect people to plan disasters - you'll see when you start trying to respond to newcomers' questions...
> 
> Salt comes out fairly quickly, and depending on what fish you want, may be beneficial in small quantities - my livebearers love a pinch of salt.


Ain't that the truth. When I bred Guppies when I first started I always added a tad of aquarium salt. actually at the tanks current salinity levels if I wasn't sure on other minerals that have been left from the sale water (which may just be me over worrying) I would start cycling the tank.

Leads to a new question. does anyone here do a live tank cycle? IE get hardier fish and help cycle the tank that way. I have heard the pros and cons but would love to heard your guys experience and input on it


----------



## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

The key here is to remember that pumping air into the tank isn't the main cause of oxygenation/gas exchange. Those air bubbles draw depleted water up from the bottom to the surface and thin the boundary layer of oxygen rich surface water.
Thus, a bubble curtain will move more water than a single stone and churn the water in the tank up nicely.
Oddly enough, this is the same mechanism that reduces CO2 levels in the water and therefore makes it less suitable for plants as you will have bigger pH/CO2 swings as a result.
Balance.....
cb


----------

