# Proper Cycling



## DudeGuy65 (Mar 19, 2012)

Hi All,

So im brand new to all this aquarium stuff, and just started up a 55 gallon tank 2 and a half weeks ago. Unfortunately, I was told by alot of people who have aquariums that I should cycle by loading the tank with feeder fish (which luckily the local aquarium store provided free of charge). I loaded approximately 40 or so in there to start. Having done a bit of reading, particularly from Information on Setting Up Your New Aquarium - The First Tank Guide - Fish Tanks, Fish Bowls, Aquariums, Aquarium Filters, Aquarium Heaters, Choosing Fish, Aquarium Information , it seems like this is an outdated and generally crappy way of cycling. So naturally, today only about 6 of the original 40ish remain, and I dont believe Ive completed the cycling process, and more keep dying every day. I feel bad for the little dudes, and wish I hadnt done it this way. Well anyway, ultimately I want an African Cichlid tank (which I have special gravel for to raise the pH). Im wondering if I shoul completely start over, doing either fishless cycle or use a couple of proper hardy starter fish for a Cichlid tank (the website above recommends a couple pseudotropheus zebra). However I am also worried feeder goldfish may or may have contaminated my tank with disease, but I cant be sure. Any recommendations for how I should proceed? Should I just keep the remaining feeders in there until they all die out and put new ones in to finish cycling? Or should I put a couple of the above cichlids in soon? Or perhaps totally start over to prevent any future troubles?


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## Dridas (Jan 30, 2012)

wow..40? It only takes a small amount of ammonia to start your cycle. Most people start with one hardy fish, like a zebra Danio. Over time your bacteria will break the ammonia down. After your ammonia spikes then goes back to zero you're cycled, but you should still only add one or two fish at a time after then.


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## DudeGuy65 (Mar 19, 2012)

Dridas said:


> wow..40? It only takes a small amount of ammonia to start your cycle. Most people start with one hardy fish, like a zebra Danio. Over time your bacteria will break the ammonia down. After your ammonia spikes then goes back to zero you're cycled, but you should still only add one or two fish at a time after then.


40 of them put an ammonia spike through the roof, about 4.0 ppm for a while. I did a bunch of water changes and with all the fish dying off the ammonia went down to what it is now, about .50 ppm. I also have been using seachem Prime as of late (detoxifies ammonia and removes nitrate and nitrite) during water changes. Have not yet tested Nitrite levels, but im sure they are spiking right now.


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## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

I would recommend getting the API master freshwater test kit to check your water perimeters, plant the tank to help stabilize the water, ask your fish keeping buddies for a used filter to help boost bacteria growth, and some of their substrate for the same reason. These measures will help the tank speed up the cycle and make it safer for your current fish. Don't worry we all make mistakes when we start out, and that is how many of us learn.


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## Dridas (Jan 30, 2012)

When I set up I try to get as many used pieces as I can, including decor. What kind of fish did you get? Mosquito fish and normal guppies shouldn't keel over as fast as other fish. I'm no expert by any means, but you might want to keep an eye on possible diseases in the long run. I definitely wouldn't add a cichlid until you're stable. Again, I'm no expert, but just be careful.


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## DudeGuy65 (Mar 19, 2012)

All I got to start were feeder goldfish, not very hardy and probably not fit for the high pH environment


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## NeonShark666 (Dec 13, 2010)

A 55G tank is a large tank to cycle so you need several fish. I would recommend 1 fish per 5G and use either White Mountain Clouds or Danios. You can also use Female Bettas (high temp) or Guppies (high ph). Stay away from Goldfish or Feeders, they are too dirty. I also reccommend using plants during cycling.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

You only need 4-5 fish for a tank that size to cycle. My kid only had 4 fish in his 75g and it cycled in 4wks, same for my 75g 2yrs ago. You need a complete test kit to see what is going on. I would think nitrites could be seen at this point, but who knows.


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## LaurenK (Mar 18, 2012)

Wow 40 is a lot of fish!!! What makes you worried that the feeder fish added disease to the tank?


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## hanky (Jan 18, 2012)

dont add chemicals to eliminate the nitrites and nitrates you want them present to get the cycle going, 40 was way to many fish I'm sure they died off from ammonia spike keep that below 1 ppm, how are you testing your water? API master kit?


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## clep.berry (Mar 4, 2012)

I'd suggest you take a trip into the chat room as you're looking at a single aspect of fish-keeping here where there could be a whole host of problems.
Some examples:
Are you treating the tap water? Do you have chloramines?
Is the tap water the same temperature as the tank?
How are you adding it?
Are there any symptoms in the fish - with this many dying off, you've got a good chance of whitespot from all the stress the fish are under
Don't you want to take the feeders back to the store?
How are you washing your filter media?
Are you using a heater? You'll be needing one.
Do you switch off your filter (It might sound like a good idea to give the fish a rest but you mustn't)..
- and this list is in no way exhaustive.
Not saying that you don't have everything covered - it's the case of a little knowledge and experience being dangerous because the one thing you don't know is often the thing that kills the fish.
cb


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## corrinla (Mar 16, 2012)

yes, you'd better stay away from Goldfish or Feeders, they are too dirty. I also reccommend using plants during cycling.


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## DudeGuy65 (Mar 19, 2012)

clep.berry said:


> I'd suggest you take a trip into the chat room as you're looking at a single aspect of fish-keeping here where there could be a whole host of problems.
> Some examples:
> Are you treating the tap water? Do you have chloramines?
> Is the tap water the same temperature as the tank?
> ...


I always use water conditioner (I've been using Seachem Prime as of late that "Removes Chlorine, Chloramine, Ammonia, Detoxifies Nitrite & Nitrate, Provides Slime Coat") at startup and when doing water changes. Ive kind of gone for feel as far as temp of the water I put in rather than a precise measurement...maybe this is a bad idea. I dont yet have a heater but the internal thermometer has read a stable 70-74 F, I plan to install one to raise and stabilize a bit for Cichlids. I dont turn off the filter and all the filter media is about 2 and a half weeks old so I havent touched it yet. Sometimes the fish become lazy and sit at the bottom for a while before dying and some just die suddenly. Ive noticed a white spot on some of their tails but it doesnt look like the pics ive looked up of ich, but maybe thats just because they are so tiny.


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## LaurenK (Mar 18, 2012)

DudeGuy65 said:


> Sometimes the fish become lazy and sit at the bottom for a while before dying and some just die suddenly. Ive noticed a white spot on some of their tails but it doesnt look like the pics ive looked up of ich, but maybe thats just because they are so tiny.


Sometimes fish like to try and bury themselves in the gravel when they are about to die. In my opinion, it's natural. 

It could be ich. Can you upload a picture of it? If it's ich you'll want to make sure it is gone from your tank completely before adding anymore fish. That stuff is nasty but it is a common disease. I had my first out break of ich when I was just starting too. Got bad advice from the fish store manager. She told me that snails can't carry ich so we got a snail from a tank under observation (it was actually a Goldfish tank) and yes my son's whole tank ended up with ich so I did research on snails having it. Oh I was so pissed. I went back and chewed the manager's head off. She replaced every fish that died.  That was the last time I ever took advice from an employee.


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## hanky (Jan 18, 2012)

laurenks story makes a good point too, Always look for a local owned fish store for quality fish and good advice, for the most part and with a few exceptions the people at Walmart or big box pet stores dont know enough to give out advice or check here before you do something always some people on here to help you.

test your water and post the results so we can see.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

My vote is for fishless cycle. If your doing cichlids in the end plants won't help.


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## LaurenK (Mar 18, 2012)

hanky said:


> laurenks story makes a good point too, Always look for a local owned fish store for quality fish and good advice, for the most part and with a few exceptions the people at Walmart or big box pet stores dont know enough to give out advice or check here before you do something always some people on here to help you.
> 
> test your water and post the results so we can see.


Correct!! My post earlier might have made it seem like any employee at a FS doesn't know what they're talking about. Sorry. I just meant the big chain stores; Wal-Mart, PetSmart, Petco, etc. Buy hanky is right, if you can find a locally owned FS I'd go there. There is a reason why they opened their own fish store...they're into fish keeping and probably 99% of the time know what they're talking about and they'll have a better selection for fish and plants.


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## DudeGuy65 (Mar 19, 2012)

Ultimately I think I've decided to restart using a fishless cycle. Problem is Im kind of worried about disease because I used feeder fish to cycle, so I think Im going to have to clean the tank and gravel (someone suggested using a diluted bleach) and start over. Going to be a pain but probably better for the long term.


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## LaurenK (Mar 18, 2012)

DudeGuy65 said:


> Ultimately I think I've decided to restart using a fishless cycle. Problem is Im kind of worried about disease because I used feeder fish to cycle, so I think Im going to have to clean the tank and gravel (someone suggested using a diluted bleach) and start over. Going to be a pain but probably better for the long term.


If you're going to use bleach...use a mild bleach and only about 1/4 teaspoon per gallon. Then rinse really good. You should be able to boil your gravel or any decor in water. Whatever you do...do NOT use soap. It's hard to remove and will harm your fish.

I've also read that ich can't survive for more than 2 weeks without fish and you turn the temperature up to 77+ degrees so if you don't want to tear your tank apart and kill all the bacteria you've already built you could do that. But I'd see if someone can confirm this to be true about ich.


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## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

Lauren I have found 84-86F to be an ideal temp for 10-14 days to clear Ick. However I suggest starting over, we do not know if these fish were carriers of some illness other than Ick so I would recommend sterilizing the tank. To the OP, you can usually go to your LFS and ask them to give you a gallon or so of their established water and some established substrate to help cycle a tank quicker and they are usually happy to do it.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Established tank water does not help with cycling, It holds very little bacteria for that. If you can borrow, beg, steal some media or gravel from an established tank that would help shorten the cycle.

To sterilize with bleach its normally 1 part bleach to 19 parts water. Rinse real well, then fill and add a triple does of dechlor, let sit for a couple of hours, drain rinse and repeat a couple of times and you should be fine.


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