# will damsels and clowns get along...



## mpskittles (Aug 18, 2009)

in a 55 gal. doing a little after x-mas fish shopping and i have my eye on a school of a/b 5 damsels.... and then theres a fellow fish friend of mine wanting to sell me 2 clowns for $40 (good price?) 

are they totally gonna hate each other or am i safe?


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## fishguy2727 (Sep 5, 2011)

Damsels are cool, but only if you want a rough and tumble tank with other rough fish. They aren't good in a reef, they aren't good with most other fish, they are just too aggressive. I wouldn't do them because most people go to reef at some point, or at the very least want other fish that are not as aggressive.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Its not so much as the Damsels hating the Clowns as much as the Damsels will chase each other out of the tank, and to the point of death. Trust me when I say, no matter how many Damsels you buy, in the end you will have only one.


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## mpskittles (Aug 18, 2009)

thanks ... so i have my one blue damsel that i got to cycle my tank with... is he going to be ok to keep in my reef/nice fish tank? or am i going to need to rehome him


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Well, they are kinda mean. You'll have to watch it. If he starts chasing the others, well, at that point its up to you. Each fish is different, he may get along, he probably will not.


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## fishguy2727 (Sep 5, 2011)

Just get it over with now and take it back to the LFS. It is better to get rid of it before it causes problems for you.


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## Skeeter91 (Dec 28, 2011)

Nope they won't. Damsels are cheap and aggressive towards ANY fish. If your damsels cycled your tank, plan on getting some tangs or triggers or a good sized angel that will bite back the damsel and make a statement... Damsels are ugly fish....consider having some maroon clowns with like a tomini tang...now that's a great combination


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## fishguy2727 (Sep 5, 2011)

I consider maroons just as bad as damsels. I consider all clowns just as bad as damsels except for percula and ocellaris.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Skeeter91 said:


> Nope they won't. Damsels are cheap and aggressive towards ANY fish. If your damsels cycled your tank, plan on getting some tangs or triggers or a good sized angel that will bite back the damsel and make a statement... Damsels are ugly fish....consider having some maroon clowns with like a tomini tang...now that's a great combination


A Tomini Tang in a 55g tank??? I wouldn't. Not rated for 55g.
*pc


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## phil_n_fish (Nov 19, 2011)

damsels are the worst fish to cycle with. They are extremely territorial and you will only be able to have one in the tank so it will take forever to cycle. And when you start getting your tank together with alot of live rock, the damsel will be real hard to catch and you will have to remove all the rock to catch it.

I would just recommend having the clown fish in there because they are also hardy and i would only have two fish in a cycling tank


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

phil_n_fish said:


> damsels are the worst fish to cycle with. They are extremely territorial and you will only be able to have one in the tank so it will take forever to cycle. And when you start getting your tank together with alot of live rock, the damsel will be real hard to catch and you will have to remove all the rock to catch it.
> 
> I would just recommend having the clown fish in there because they are also hardy and i would only have two fish in a cycling tank


Sorry bout this Phil, but I wouldn't cycle a tank with fish, Ammonia is very harmful to them and a CUC.


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## phil_n_fish (Nov 19, 2011)

lol i never said cycling with fish was a good thing. I would cycle with live rock and hermit crabs.

And doing a cycle with no fish will take forever. expect to add 4 more weeks to your cycling. You can get ammonia from your LFS if they have it. There is nitrite/Nitrate cycling bottles you can buy but you will still need to add ammonia to help it cycle. Its pointless buying a fish tank and having it sit there for a month empty. You will just be draining money on your electric bill and water changes. You got to add something that can produce ammonia.


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## Skeeter91 (Dec 28, 2011)

phil_n_fish said:


> lol i never said cycling with fish was a good thing. I would cycle with live rock and hermit crabs.
> 
> And doing a cycle with no fish will take forever. expect to add 4 more weeks to your cycling. You can get ammonia from your LFS if they have it. There is nitrite/Nitrate cycling bottles you can buy but you will still need to add ammonia to help it cycle. Its pointless buying a fish tank and having it sit there for a month empty. You will just be draining money on your electric bill and water changes. You got to add something that can produce ammonia.


Good point lol. There's bottles with bacteria that you can add to a cycling tank too I believe.

But overall, damsels are the worse option of fish to add to a tank.


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## fishguy2727 (Sep 5, 2011)

The nitrifying bacteria are in the air. You don't have to buy magical bottles of bacteria (that don't work) to get your tank cycled. Don't cycle with any livestock (fish, corals, inverts including snails and hermits, etc.). With saltwater you cycle the tank by adding live rock and letting it cure, that's it. Once cycled do a large water change and start stocking.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

phil_n_fish said:


> lol i never said cycling with fish was a good thing. I would cycle with live rock and hermit crabs.
> 
> And doing a cycle with no fish will take forever. expect to add 4 more weeks to your cycling. You can get ammonia from your LFS if they have it. There is nitrite/Nitrate cycling bottles you can buy but you will still need to add ammonia to help it cycle. Its pointless buying a fish tank and having it sit there for a month empty. You will just be draining money on your electric bill and water changes. You got to add something that can produce ammonia.


Well, if your going that far.
Just use Fully Cured Live Rock, your tank will be cycled in a weeks time frame.


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## Aquatic Castle (Jan 11, 2012)

I have 6 damsels in a 30 gal tank. I have a two black, two convict, and two blue with yellow tails. The two blue ones where in there for about 9 months. Then about a month ago, I added 6 more damsels. If you are doing math and keeping up, the two missing are two more blue with yellow tails. They didn't make it. Damsels can be very nice fish to have and come in a variety of pretty and some not so pretty colors. If this wasn't the case, they wouldn't have them in every LFS. Yes, they are very aggressively territorial however, they get used to sharing territory after a while. Their first response to putting new fish in is to attack the new fish. This is the reason I added 6 at once. The new fish were all attacked but two on 6 meant 4 were safe at any given time. The 2 old fish could not keep up with 6 fish. After a week or so, the tank settled into a harmony. There is an occasional chase but it doesn't amount to much of anything. Although the fish like to hide, sometimes I can look and see all 6 fish swimming about at the same time. It's fun to watch them duck into tiny caves and pop back out. 

For a short while, I had a blue surgeon and a foxface in the tank. They attacked the blue surgeon for a week or so. He was scared but he could take it. Then they got over it. It probably helped that the blue surgeon stopped hiding in their dugouts and found a place to hide behind the overflow box. They completely left the foxface alone. I suspect they knew better than to mess with a foxface, somehow.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Aquatic Castle said:


> I have 6 damsels in a 30 gal tank. I have a two black, two convict, and two blue with yellow tails. The two blue ones where in there for about 9 months. Then about a month ago, I added 6 more damsels. If you are doing math and keeping up, the two missing are two more blue with yellow tails. They didn't make it. Damsels can be very nice fish to have and come in a variety of pretty and some not so pretty colors. If this wasn't the case, they wouldn't have them in every LFS. Yes, they are very aggressively territorial however, they get used to sharing territory after a while. Their first response to putting new fish in is to attack the new fish. This is the reason I added 6 at once. The new fish were all attacked but two on 6 meant 4 were safe at any given time. The 2 old fish could not keep up with 6 fish. After a week or so, the tank settled into a harmony. There is an occasional chase but it doesn't amount to much of anything. Although the fish like to hide, sometimes I can look and see all 6 fish swimming about at the same time. It's fun to watch them duck into tiny caves and pop back out.
> 
> For a short while, I had a blue surgeon and a foxface in the tank. They attacked the blue surgeon for a week or so. He was scared but he could take it. Then they got over it. It probably helped that the blue surgeon stopped hiding in their dugouts and found a place to hide behind the overflow box. They completely left the foxface alone. I suspect they knew better than to mess with a foxface, somehow.


In a 30g tank?????*tut tut


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## Aquatic Castle (Jan 11, 2012)

The 6 damsels are tiny little fish so that's no biggie. The foxface and surgeon are small and were just passing through. They were in there for a few months. Even so, I've had both fish for at least a year. They were both in a biocube for a while. They were very small fish then. When they are kept in a smaller tank, from little, they stay small. It's not like a panther grouper that just grows no matter what. At one time I had a bala shark in the tank. I've had that bala shark since at least 2009 and it now lives in a 45 gal tank. 

If a fish ever gets too big for a tank, it can be traded with a local fish store or sold but if I can enjoy a fish for two+ years and trade it, that's better than not being able to enjoy the fish at all. One day, I'll probably have to get rid of the the blue surgeon and the bala shark. For now, all three fish are happy. Oh, the foxface and surgeon now live in an 87 gal tank. I suspect they will be happy in there for at least another year.

I think I got the surgeon in October 2010. I have a receipt for the approximate right amount from then and pics of him in November.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Some, most LFS will not trade out fish. And, your stressing the crap out of the fish when you do move it, and then survival of that fish comes into question.
jmo


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