# dante's cycle log



## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

This is basically for my own tracking purposes, but please feel free to comment if you have something to suggest and or criticize.

1/14/12
Repaired tank, filled and started filters, heaters and air pump. Missing a few items.

1/16/12
Temp stable at 75*. Stopped at one of the LFS and purchased a new thermometer, aquasafe, a Brazilian Pennywart, a Brazilian Sword, and 4 Twinbar Platys. Acclimated the fish to the tank by drip and floating the bag. Planted the plants and introduced the platy's. Kinda cool little critters, 1 male, 3 female. Hope they survive the cycle.

1/17/12
Stopped at another LFS and purchased 2 bunches oof spiral val, and 1 cobamba (sp?). Came home to find the water clouded. Temp still holding at 75*. When I introduced the new plants all 4 platys came out of hiding. Sweet, they are still kickin.*w3 Not only are they still alive but they came to the surface of the tank and acted as though they were hungry. HHMMM... was'nt planning on feeding till tomorrow but lets give it a try. I added 2 flakes each, being prepared to take it back out if they werent eating. All 4 fish ate.
Performed first water tests. 
water perameters:
Temp - 75*
ammonia - 6.5 PPM
Ph - 7.2
Nitrite - for some reason I already have a trace. possibly due to the live plants? never cycled with plants before
Nitrate - None

Will do a 25% water change to bring the ammonia levels down a little.


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## KG4mxv (Oct 25, 2011)

All sounds good to me. 

and I can't resist feeding begging fish either unless the tank is really high ammonia. 

I miss my molly babies. :-( I am on a job until thursday but I have a beach front room ;-) and the temp is 65F so I have the door open and listening to the surf.


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## drzoom (Dec 10, 2011)

You have a bit of an emergency with such high ammonia levels. You should do a larger water change or until ammonia measures 1ppm or less. Also, the fish are starved for oxygen due to the bacterial bloom (I'm guess that's the cause of cloudiness), so if you have another air stone to add, please do until this is over. Check the levels daily until the ammonia is under control. Then, the real fun (and in my case, much longer) phase of the nitrite spike will begin. I had to do almost daily large changes to avoid any loss of fish. If you don't mind spending $10, get some Tetra SafeStart. It helped me and a few others get over the hump. Good luck!


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

> You have a bit of an emergency with such high ammonia levels. You should do a larger water change or until ammonia measures 1ppm or less.


really? I was always told that you need to keep ammonia in the 5 PPM range during the cycle. More than that is to hard on the fish, and too little makes it take longer to establish the bacteria.



> If you don't mind spending $10, get some Tetra SafeStart. It helped me and a few others get over the hump. Good luck!


I'll check into it. i guess I'm a little "old school" I dont like to add chemicals to the water. I use aqua safe to dissapate the chlorime from my tap water and occasionaly some meds if needed

Thanks for the input.

so i opted to hold off on the water change until i got home from work today since I had just handled some kerosene last night and didnt want to put my hands in the tank.
When i got home today I found that the water wasnt as cloudy, the fish were all still alive and a little more active than yesterday. I tested the water and found the ammonia levels the same as yesterday and the nitrites a little higher. the fish were hungry again so i gave a very light feeding. when they were finished i did a 30% water change, (15 gallons).

will check levels again tomorrow.


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## drzoom (Dec 10, 2011)

As long as you're keeping an eye on the levels and doing water changes as needed, that's great. I understand that you need some amount of ammonia to get the bacteria established, and you will still have some despite water changes, especially since you're still feeding. The fact that you have nitrites tells me that you're close to the end of the first phase and you already have some bacteria at work. BTW, it's the nitrite phase that was long and stressful in my experience so that's when my stress level was highest. Understand your stance on chemicals, but I and the fish were suffering with frequent water changes and SafeStart brought me to 0ppm nitrites in 24hrs.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

tested water today after work:

ammonia 6 PPM
Nitrites .25 PPM

All other parameters are the same

Will have to start a second post in general freshwater. There is a complication. I now have at least 3 fry in the tank. I've never had Young in a tank before, much less one that is in the begining stages of a cycle. I'm viewing this as a challenge to keep the little ones alive, but I'm gonna need some help.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Have you been adding a dechlor or ammonia lock?

If so there is a possibility the ammonia is locked and therefore safe(r).

Before doing water changes and the like make sure the ammonia is the free dangerous type. Seachem (I think) has an ammonia test kit the measured both types.

If you plants are thriving they should reduce ammonia in 24 hours or less.

my .02


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

> Have you been adding a dechlor or ammonia lock?
> 
> If so there is a possibility the ammonia is locked and therefore safe(r).
> 
> ...


yes dechlor, no ammonia lock.

I wouldnt say the plants are neccessarily "thriving" They have only been in the tank a week. They are alive, dont see any dead foliage and nothing stuck to the filter.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

current water parameters, after 30% water change yesterday.
ammonia - 5 PPM
nitrites - trace

Another new development, the top frame broke again. i think it is the weight of the glass lids pushing down on it. This is the third time. have a temporary fix on it right now, will order another new frame and a different lid tomorrow. Then to figure out how to replace it without having to drain the tank and start the cycle over.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Stop the water changes and see what happens


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

> Stop the water changes and see what happens


Never thought i would hear someone tell me to do this, but OK. havent done a water change since the 19th. parameters are now; 
ammonia - 7 PPM
nitrite - 2 PPM
nitrate - 5 PPM

Will be draining half the water from this tank tomorrow evening to repair the top frame. perfect time to do a 50% water change.

The fish are quite lively showing no outward signs of distress. still seeing at least one of the fry occasionally as well.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Its like this, you can fight the cycle as just the cycle, or you can fight the cycle to save your fish. Forget all about your parameters and just use it as a basis to decide whether or not it is bad for your fish. Leaving everything with inaction does nothing but put your fish in more danger. "If" the imporatnt thing here is that you keep your fish alive, then do the water change that you know you must do and don't listen to anyone telling you different. It should not end up being a pain test and seeing just how much your fish can take of it. If it doesn't matter, then let everything ride as if it were a fishless cycle. Your choice. Doing water changes with fish druing the cycle.....possibly.....delays the normal transistion (no water changes) of the cycle by about one week. But, you come out on the other end with fish that haven't had to endure something that will probably end up killing them down the road some time due to all of the stress they have had to endure. If ammonia or nitrite reach higher than 1ppm, do a water change of 25% at least. Higher the reading, higher the water change and may require successive days of water changes to get the values down. I would do no more than 50% at one time and it is okay to do one that size everyday until your values are at a safe level.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

dante322 said:


> Never thought i would hear someone tell me to do this, but OK. havent done a water change since the 19th. parameters are now;
> ammonia - 7 PPM
> nitrite - 2 PPM
> nitrate - 5 PPM
> ...




If you have ammonia at 7ppm and the fish are fine the ammonia must be "locked" or (even less likely) the test was way way wrong.

my .02


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> If you have ammonia at 7ppm and the fish are fine the ammonia must be "locked" or (even less likely) the test was way way wrong.
> 
> my .02


Inaction will kill your fish. Don't make these assumptions. Deciding whether it is locked or unlocked is just a plain stupid mistake that your fish may pay for.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

It's not like I've never cycled a tank before. I've done both fish in and fishless. I have been without a tank for a few years and was understandably eager to see some fish in here. The decision to do a fish in cycle was mine as well as the choice of a hardy fish like the platys to do the cycle.
I had no chojce however in my top frame breaking. If I didnt care about the fish I would have got rid of them, empyied the tank, fixed it properly and started the cycle over. This week has been hard on them for sure, but It will pale in comparison to what they are going to endure in the next couple days with the repair happening this morning. 
My decision to delay water changes till this weekend may not have been the correct one but I also didnt want to risk putting more stress on the tank itself from the contraction and expansion of the walls of the tank by taking out and refilling water.
I'm aware I may lose the fish, then again I may not. will know more tomorrow after the repair is complete and the tank can be refilled.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

The tank repair is complete. The repair process facilitated a 50% water change. Parameters are still quite high but lower than yesterday. I am going to allow the sealant to cure till tomorrow night and will do another 50% water change at that time. Will retest water afterwards for a better idea of what the levels will be.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

after another 50% water change today the levels are 
ammonia - 1 PPM
nitrite - .5 PPM


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

cycle is coming along nicely. ammonia is down to 
1 PPM nitrite is at .5 PPm and nitrates are at 10 PPM

I added a filter ped to the penguin 170 on this tank. I started a fishless cycle on the 150 gallon today and plan on swiping a seeded pad from this tank to help jump start the 150.


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## drzoom (Dec 10, 2011)

Looks like your making great progress. Don't take too much bacteria out of the still cycling tank to see the new one though.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

> Looks like your making great progress. Don't take too much bacteria out of the still cycling tank to see the new one though.


i dont plan on removing anything for a couple weeks. give the cycle time to finish up and to get the new filter pad seeded.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

Cycle is at that frustrating point where it seems to be "stuck" Ammonia has been at zero or just a trace for a couple days. Nitrites are stuck at 2 PPM. havent gone up or down. nitrates are at .5 PPM and go up a little every day.

Stopped by the LFS today. He recieved his new stock the other day and I wanted to see what he got. He has a nice batch of pearl gouramis which is what I was hoping to add to the tank first as soon as its done cycling. I asked him to save a couple for me for a couple weeks and he asked me why. I told him I'm still waitng for the tank to finish it's cycle before I add anything. He gave me an odd look and asked "didnt I give you a bucket of water?" I said no and asked why. He said "dude, next time you come in, bring a bucket with you. I'll set you up with some water and media out of one of my tanks and you'll be cycled in no time." 

He thought he had already done that, and was wondering why my tank wasnt ready yet. Needless to say I went home, grabbed a bucket and went straight back.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

Nitrites are FINALLY coming down! Ammonia - 0 PPM Nitrite - 4 PPM Nitrate 40 PPM. just drew 20 gallons out. am typing this as the tank is refilling. Will let it circulate for an hour or so and retest.

going to the LFS tomorrow to pick up some things I ordered last week, would be nice to get a new fish but I'll probably wait till next week.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

BTW... There is a discrepancy between my last post and this one I was getting inacurate test results because my test solutions were old. I got a new test kit the other day and am now getting much more accurate results.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

That's cool. Once you see nitrites drop they will go down fast.


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## dante322 (Jan 15, 2012)

got home from work yesterday and tested my water 0 ammonia 0 nitrite 20 PPM nitrate. Went to the LFS to get a part I had ordered for the 150 gallon and took a water sample with me. His tests showed the same thing mine did. So I came home with a new impeller for my filter and a pearl gourami and 2 "seargent major loaches" will post a new thread with pics of my new fish.


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