# Can Someone Please Tell Me What This Is?



## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

These rust-colored spots began popping up on a "pirate shipwreck" ornament in my fancy goldfish tank, specifically on the white silk sails, and seems to have gotten progressively worse...someone on another site told me these are "Diatoms" or something like that, due to the final cycle stage of the tank, and that they are harmless to the fish and that they will "burn themselves off" over months...but what is this, exactly? Does anyone know? Are they in fact "Diatoms" or whatever?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Looks like diatom algae to me.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

Thanks for the confirmation, JR!

Are you sure that's what this is? It can just spread across an ornament like that in an outbreak fashion? And I just have to wait for this to go away...after a few months or so?


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## Martini2108 (Jul 23, 2010)

Yeah looks a lot like diatom to me. I believe there's a type of fish/crustacean that will eat it, but I'm not sure. You could limit the amount of time the lights are on (algae love light) or you can wait for it to go away you're choice


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Oto's and some snails will eat it. But wouldn't put oto's in till the tank is fully cycled.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

Martini2108 said:


> Yeah looks a lot like diatom to me. I believe there's a type of fish/crustacean that will eat it, but I'm not sure. You could limit the amount of time the lights are on (algae love light) or you can wait for it to go away you're choice


Thanks Martini...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

susankat said:


> Oto's and some snails will eat it. But wouldn't put oto's in till the tank is fully cycled.


I finished a complete regimen of Stability, so short of some tests, I may be fully cycled...

Either way, I don't think oto's would get along good with my goldies...unless I am mistaken...

Also, Susan -- it looks like our canopies and stands are similar! Here's mine, in a wide shot...


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Looks to be similar. What size is your tank?


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

Check my sig out...*w3


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## automatic-hydromatic (Oct 18, 2010)

hey if anything, I personally thing it makes the sails look more authentic  but yeah, definitely diatom


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

automatic-hydromatic said:


> hey if anything, I personally thing it makes the sails look more authentic  but yeah, definitely diatom


More authentic?

So, you definitely think this is a diatom outbreak? Have you ever seen it so bad?


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

You know, people, Martini had mentioned leaving my lights off more, but I was thinking...would my fluorescent strip really make a difference for these diatoms, especially that I'm not planted?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Yes, lights will make a difference in algae growth - all types. You can rub off the algae if you like.

Is your tank cycled? Have you tested to confirm?


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> Yes, lights will make a difference in algae growth - all types. You can rub off the algae if you like.


But it _should_ disappear on its own, right?



> Is your tank cycled? Have you tested to confirm?


Have not tested to confirm; didn't get the API kit yet -- maybe today. I finished a routine of Stability for the week, so I assumed it was cycled...


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Diatoms is basically normal for any new tank, no matter what your lighting is. Lowering the time the lights are on will help a little. You either let it run its course, get something that eats it or clean it off yourself.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Stability may help with the cycle, but it does not cycle your tank. You need to test it.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

susankat said:


> Diatoms is basically normal for any new tank, no matter what your lighting is. Lowering the time the lights are on will help a little. You either let it run its course, get something that eats it or clean it off yourself.


I'm being told now that these diatoms are actually devouring the cloth sails of my ornament, and that they will eventually disintegrate altogether (the sails) -- is this true? 

If so, that seems ridiculous to me...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> Stability may help with the cycle, but it does not cycle your tank. You need to test it.


I didn't know it didn't cycle it -- I thought Stability kind of kick started it to completion...

How does one cycle a tank then?

As a note, I bought the API test kit just now during some holiday shopping, and I will report back with the results because I'm absolutely sure I won't understand them or know how to read them -- G-d help me in attempting to even use these...


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

ClinicaTerra said:


> I'm being told now that these diatoms are actually devouring the cloth sails of my ornament, and that they will eventually disintegrate altogether (the sails) -- is this true?
> 
> If so, that seems ridiculous to me...


I've never heard this and have never had cloth in my tanks so I couldn't tell you one way or another. It would stand to reason though that the cloth will probably rot eventually in the water even without diatoms.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

susankat said:


> I've never heard this and have never had cloth in my tanks so I couldn't tell you one way or another. It would stand to reason though that the cloth will probably rot eventually in the water even without diatoms.


Dang...

Why would such ornaments be sold then, if they're not "guarded" from the elements of an aquarium?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

ClinicaTerra said:


> I didn't know it didn't cycle it -- I thought Stability kind of kick started it to completion...
> 
> How does one cycle a tank then?
> 
> As a note, I bought the API test kit just now during some holiday shopping, and I will report back with the results because I'm absolutely sure I won't understand them or know how to read them -- G-d help me in attempting to even use these...


All it does is try to kickstart the process and get some beneficial bacteria in the tank. You should read up on the nitrogen cycle. It will help you understand what your tank is going through.


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## Martini2108 (Jul 23, 2010)

Well the cycle is the growing of the proper amount of bacteria to eat the ammonia first then the by product of that is nitrites, then nitrates are the by product of the nitrites. You start this by adding fish or doing the fishless cycle,I've never done it that way so I wouldn't know much about that but someone here will. As far as I know bacteria will not consume nitrates, that must be taken care of with water changes or enough live plants.


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## probe1957 (Jul 2, 2010)

Definitely diatoms. I am, unfortunately, all too familiar with them. What I have read however indicates low light tends to cause diatoms to grow more aggressively.

I took all the decorations out of my tank due to the diatom situation, except for a large piece of fake driftwood. I left that because the Silver Dollars like to hide in it.

My diatom outbreak seems to be getting better. I have been vacuuming the gravel and cleaning the glass with my weekly water changes. I am told a diatom outbreak will cure itself over time. That seems to be happening in my case.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> All it does is try to kickstart the process and get some beneficial bacteria in the tank. You should read up on the nitrogen cycle. It will help you understand what your tank is going through.


I've read about the nitrogen cycle and have a semi-comfortable understanding of it, but what I don't get is how a tank cycles if there aren't any fish in it (which really wasn't my situation) and something like Stability doesn't actually cycle it -- is it just a waiting game?


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

probe1957 said:


> Definitely diatoms. I am, unfortunately, all too familiar with them. What I have read however indicates low light tends to cause diatoms to grow more aggressively.


Thanks for your input here, Probe. I had _thought_ that I read somewhere that these algae are actually _fed_ by _lower_ lighting, not excessive exposure...

Weird...

So, is it better then to leave my fluorescent lights on over the tank more often? 



> I took all the decorations out of my tank due to the diatom situation, except for a large piece of fake driftwood. I left that because the Silver Dollars like to hide in it.


I remember keeping silver dollars! They were cool...

How bad was your diatom situation? Were they consuming everything? 



> My diatom outbreak seems to be getting better. I have been vacuuming the gravel and cleaning the glass with my weekly water changes. I am told a diatom outbreak will cure itself over time. That seems to be happening in my case.


Thanks for some peace of mind here!

Can it be assumed that if I leave it alone, these spots should disappear from the sails?


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

Definately Diatoms. Messing with your lighting unfortunately will have no effect on these guys. They feed on silica in the tank. It can come from any source but mainly through the silicone holding the tank together. Other sources include decorations and substrate.

They are a normal occurance in aquariums and yes, they will eventually eat themselves out of house and home. ;o) They are very easily removed with a simple wipe down. As for eating the sails on the ship, that would be a falsey. The cloth will eventually rot away under water on its own. Have you ever noticed those cheap cloth plants after a while in a tank? Horrible looking. It's a marketing thing ... Looks good at first, but doesn't last long.

Oto's and Briggs snails love this stuff. Briggs won't do well in a Goldie tank and Otos should only be introduced to well established tanks.

I'll leave the cycling part alone for another thread to keep this one on topic.


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## probe1957 (Jul 2, 2010)

>>How bad was your diatom situation? Were they consuming everything? <<

Yeah, the diatoms pretty much took over for awhile. The tank became easier to clean with fewer decorations.

>>So, is it better then to leave my fluorescent lights on over the tank more often? <<

That's what I read but to be honest, it really didn't seem to make any difference at all when I tried leaving the light on longer.

>>Can it be assumed that if I leave it alone, these spots should disappear from the sails?<< 

I think so, yes. However, I would just clean them as part of my weekly maintenance. Either that or remove the decoration until the diatom situation straightens itself out. Again, that is what I have done. I don't especially enjoy tank maintenance. 

I am pretty sure I remember reading that diatoms really aren't an algae at all.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Actually the sails may last longer than projected, if they are synthetic. Cotton and natural fibers will get eaten by the diatoms, but many synthetic fibers will be around long after you and I are gone, in land fills, in compost heaps and under water. 

Because you've got goldfish, you're going to see more algae than a lot of the other freshwater people. Lovely, delightful goldfish just contribute more richly to their water, and your nitrate and phosphate levels will be higher as a result. You'll want to make sure you're doing your regular partial water changes at whatever rate the folks on the goldfish forum suggest (I'd imagine 30% or so weekly but its been awhile since I kept goldies tho I love 'em) and I'd actually suggest adding some java moss. Its tougher than an old boot, and too hard for the goldfish to eat, and it will survive at the temps the goldfish like, plus it doesn't need to be rooted, so it doesn't care if they dig. I've had it in with goldfish myself. Another option would be to add some duckweed, which floats on the surface, and which may reproduce quickly enough to stay ahead of the goldfish who will eat it. Live plants will compete with the algae for food, and help suppress its growth. See what there is that will do the cold water thing, and that you like the look of, that isn't toxic for your fish, 'cause they will nibble (can't fault them for trying) you want something fast growing to keep ahead of the algae and your fishies. You may even want to look at snails. Lots of snails that are good for algae can live in the cold with your goldfish, unlike plecos and such. (whatever you do, don't get a chinese algae eater, no matter what they tell you.)


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## melplusanimals (Nov 30, 2010)

because the companies want you to go back and buy another..


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

IME any "decorations" in any tank eventually become covered with various algaes unless you clean then every week. Like remove them and do a bleach soak and rinse.
With no live plants you will have algae, nitrates, phosphates, co2 (low pH) and/or all the above. Unless you have an open system where you have several (100%) water changes per day with perfect water.

just my .02


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

James0816 said:


> Definately Diatoms. Messing with your lighting unfortunately will have no effect on these guys. They feed on silica in the tank. It can come from any source but mainly through the silicone holding the tank together. Other sources include decorations and substrate.
> 
> They are a normal occurance in aquariums and yes, they will eventually eat themselves out of house and home. ;o) They are very easily removed with a simple wipe down. As for eating the sails on the ship, that would be a falsey. The cloth will eventually rot away under water on its own. Have you ever noticed those cheap cloth plants after a while in a tank? Horrible looking. It's a marketing thing ... Looks good at first, but doesn't last long.
> 
> ...


Thank you...

I will try and wipe these down...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

probe1957 said:


> >>How bad was your diatom situation? Were they consuming everything? <<
> 
> Yeah, the diatoms pretty much took over for awhile. The tank became easier to clean with fewer decorations.
> 
> ...


Thanks, Probe.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

chris oe said:


> Actually the sails may last longer than projected, if they are synthetic. Cotton and natural fibers will get eaten by the diatoms, but many synthetic fibers will be around long after you and I are gone, in land fills, in compost heaps and under water.


Thanks, Chris...

Actually, I am uncertain exactly what these sails are made out of; I thought they were silk kind of material, but they may in fact be cloth... 



> Because you've got goldfish, you're going to see more algae than a lot of the other freshwater people. Lovely, delightful goldfish just contribute more richly to their water, and your nitrate and phosphate levels will be higher as a result. You'll want to make sure you're doing your regular partial water changes at whatever rate the folks on the goldfish forum suggest (I'd imagine 30% or so weekly but its been awhile since I kept goldies tho I love 'em) and I'd actually suggest adding some java moss. Its tougher than an old boot, and too hard for the goldfish to eat, and it will survive at the temps the goldfish like, plus it doesn't need to be rooted, so it doesn't care if they dig. I've had it in with goldfish myself. Another option would be to add some duckweed, which floats on the surface, and which may reproduce quickly enough to stay ahead of the goldfish who will eat it. Live plants will compete with the algae for food, and help suppress its growth. See what there is that will do the cold water thing, and that you like the look of, that isn't toxic for your fish, 'cause they will nibble (can't fault them for trying) you want something fast growing to keep ahead of the algae and your fishies. You may even want to look at snails. Lots of snails that are good for algae can live in the cold with your goldfish, unlike plecos and such. (whatever you do, don't get a chinese algae eater, no matter what they tell you.)


Indeed, I'm aware of how dirty these little critters make a tank...I just love 'em, as you said you did at one point; I just want this current diatom problem to go away, because those sails are tough to look at...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> IME any "decorations" in any tank eventually become covered with various algaes unless you clean then every week. Like remove them and do a bleach soak and rinse.
> With no live plants you will have algae, nitrates, phosphates, co2 (low pH) and/or all the above. Unless you have an open system where you have several (100%) water changes per day with perfect water.
> 
> just my .02


Well, there's no way I'm doing a 100 percent change daily, so...


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

That's the thing, if you keep these dirty darlings, they will set your tank up for algae growth, so you have to set up strategies to control your algae. I agree, 100% water changes would be way to hard on your goldies. And bleaching this ornament constantly would be a drag, too. Bleach will eat cloth just as surely as diatoms will, if the cloth is capable of being eaten. Bleach can also fade paint and wood and so on, and leave a residue in anything absorbent. 

But this ornament is really only the start - there's going to be algae all over everything as time goes on unless you work out a plan for it. Its just starting on the sails, but it will end up on the glass, on the gravel, on everything. The goldfish are making algae food constantly. So you can remove the algae food, you can set up plants to eat the algae food before the algae get to it, or you can get somebody in to eat up the algae as it grows so you don't have to look at it. 

There's also a tiny chance you are overfeeding. I would take a look at how much food you're giving your babies and see if they're really eating it all in 2 - 3 minutes. Goldfish will give off algae food, but decaying fish food will be much worse than fish waste. 

Plus I'd look at your filtration, is it possible you could add another filter, maybe a sponge filter in addition to what you already have? Sponge filters are kind of great because they polish the water, and filter out anything free floating, add additional biofiltration, and big ones can hold a lot of just goo that you can then rinse out when you do your partial water changes (you squeeze them out in the water you take out of the tank). They can be hard to find, but Aquatic Eco Systems is online and they have some pretty nice ones for pretty reasonable prices. 

Bottom line though, you are going to have to work out an algae strategy at some point, 'cause this isn't going to stop at your sails.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Get some driftwood and plants and you'll be much happier in the long run. Although, not quite as cool as what you have.


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

chris oe said:


> Bleach will eat cloth just as surely as diatoms will


Just want to clear this up so as not to confuse the OP. The diatoms will not eat the cloth of the sails. They are not caused by excess fish poo or any excess nutrients such as nitrAtes.

If we are dealing with other algae (BBA, GSA, hair, etc), then we would start looking at such things as photoperiod, excess nutrients, etc.

Don't confuse Diatoms with other types of algae. Diatoms are a microalgae and in a completely different class.

We can leave this for another discussion so as to not derail the OP's topic if you'd like.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

James0816 said:


> Just want to clear this up so as not to confuse the OP. The diatoms will not eat the cloth of the sails. They are not caused by excess fish poo or any excess nutrients such as nitrAtes.
> 
> If we are dealing with other algae (BBA, GSA, hair, etc), then we would start looking at such things as photoperiod, excess nutrients, etc.
> 
> ...


From what I hear diatoms are algae but use silica for their cell strcutures.

therefore they do use ammonia, nitrates, phosphates, potassium, co2, etc for growth.

In a new setup especially with silica sand (overwheliming the most common type of sand) there are nutrients and more importantly for the diatoms silica. But silica is not added to the tank through food, water changes and so on. So as the diatoms expand they eventually use up the silica in the tank then die off.

I sometimes will get some but with my planted , low feeding, no water changes, no filters, and so on setups,I just kill the lights for a few days and the tank clears up. After that point I adjust the lighting and feeding so the plants thrive and these types of algae don't come back.

I also don't use decorations so perhaps I just don't get upset with a small amount of algae.


my .02


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

chris oe said:


> That's the thing, if you keep these dirty darlings, they will set your tank up for algae growth, so you have to set up strategies to control your algae. I agree, 100% water changes would be way to hard on your goldies. And bleaching this ornament constantly would be a drag, too. Bleach will eat cloth just as surely as diatoms will, if the cloth is capable of being eaten. Bleach can also fade paint and wood and so on, and leave a residue in anything absorbent.


I'm not going to commit to a 100 percent change each day, or bother taking each decoration out and bleaching it; I was hoping these diatoms would disappear on their own. 



> But this ornament is really only the start - there's going to be algae all over everything as time goes on unless you work out a plan for it. Its just starting on the sails, but it will end up on the glass, on the gravel, on everything. The goldfish are making algae food constantly. So you can remove the algae food, you can set up plants to eat the algae food before the algae get to it, or you can get somebody in to eat up the algae as it grows so you don't have to look at it.
> 
> There's also a tiny chance you are overfeeding. I would take a look at how much food you're giving your babies and see if they're really eating it all in 2 - 3 minutes. Goldfish will give off algae food, but decaying fish food will be much worse than fish waste.


The overfeeding is remotely possible -- I give them enough for three to consume, but it takes them longer than two to three minutes; at two or three minutes, the flakes are still on the surface and at that point floating all over the tank from the filter current...should I be feeding less then? 



> Plus I'd look at your filtration, is it possible you could add another filter, maybe a sponge filter in addition to what you already have? Sponge filters are kind of great because they polish the water, and filter out anything free floating, add additional biofiltration, and big ones can hold a lot of just goo that you can then rinse out when you do your partial water changes (you squeeze them out in the water you take out of the tank). They can be hard to find, but Aquatic Eco Systems is online and they have some pretty nice ones for pretty reasonable prices.


I'm not really in a financial situation to shell out for a third filter -- I'm running the Aqueon plus the AquaClear, and the AquaClear was a stretch for us to buy at nearly 100 bucks; plus, with regard to a "sponge filter," the AquaClear has a sponge block at the bottom of its media basket -- would this not qualify as sponge filtration? 



> Bottom line though, you are going to have to work out an algae strategy at some point, 'cause this isn't going to stop at your sails.


Not good news...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> Get some driftwood and plants and you'll be much happier in the long run. Although, not quite as cool as what you have.


I don't want to commit to live plants, but the driftwood idea seems cool -- that would make the tank seem more like a natural habitat, which is what I toyed with before we went with the pirate/shipwreck theme...

Did you really think the tank was cool looking? If so, thanks! I appreciate that...

I hadn't gotten any feedback on the tank from anyone...*frown


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

ClinicaTerra said:


> I don't want to commit to live plants, but the driftwood idea seems cool -- that would make the tank seem more like a natural habitat, which is what I toyed with before we went with the pirate/shipwreck theme...
> 
> Did you really think the tank was cool looking? If so, thanks! I appreciate that...
> 
> I hadn't gotten any feedback on the tank from anyone...*frown


Hey I like your tank.

but then I'm probably noone


*old dude


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> Hey I like your tank.
> 
> but then I'm probably noone
> 
> ...


No, come on Bob...I was being serious...


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Shoot...Bob is like rockstar status on here.

Yeah, I like your tank. Heck, I'm in the Navy so anything nautical is cool to me.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

ClinicaTerra said:


> No, come on Bob...I was being serious...


So was I.

Us old plant heads do tend to make fun of our original plastic ornements before we went totally planted.

We also forget how good those tanks originally looked.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

I stand corrected on the fabric, no, diatoms will not eat it, likely nothing will eat it, Based on the tank owner's description (silk like) the fabric is very likely synthetic and not even the most voracious bacteria will be able to make a meal there. it may become frayed, but that's par for the course, any unfinished fabric edge will fray (which is usually what happens to those fake fabric plants as far as I've seen - fraying due to an unfinished edge and fading due to light and water exposure. Bleach will hurry the fading and if there is anything organic in the fabric composition bleach will eat it, more likely to be organic content in the rigging than in the fabric itself though. 

Found a great article on diatoms. 



Short story: they are algae, do not eat silica, but do need dissolved silica for their shells, do have the usual relationship with the nutrients in the water, so yes, nitrates and phosphates do matter. Since their shells do not dissolve well there's no recycling factor. Other articles mentioned the natural cycle of diatoms in the wild is one of bloom and bust, the diatoms producing dormant versions that drop to the bottom and wait for the reoccurance of ideal conditions, not likely to happen in your average tank. Another article suggested that diatoms may effect carbonate hardness positively, but that's a different topic entirely. I do think as the diatoms die back other forms of algae will pop up to fill the niches they leave open. 

Oh, and I have had P. bridgesii living happily with goldfish. The trick is to get the water just right, 'cause brigs care a lot about water. Goldfish like good water as much as the next guy, but it takes some doing.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> Us old plant heads do tend to make fun of our original plastic ornements before we went totally planted.


That's _precisely_ why I didn't think you were serious...:animated_fish_swimm


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> Shoot...Bob is like rockstar status on here.


Really?



> Yeah, I like your tank. Heck, I'm in the Navy so anything nautical is cool to me.


Thanks.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

chris oe said:


> I stand corrected on the fabric, no, diatoms will not eat it, likely nothing will eat it, Based on the tank owner's description (silk like) the fabric is very likely synthetic and not even the most voracious bacteria will be able to make a meal there. it may become frayed, but that's par for the course, any unfinished fabric edge will fray (which is usually what happens to those fake fabric plants as far as I've seen - fraying due to an unfinished edge and fading due to light and water exposure. Bleach will hurry the fading and if there is anything organic in the fabric composition bleach will eat it, more likely to be organic content in the rigging than in the fabric itself though.
> 
> Found a great article on diatoms.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the research.

So, where does that leave me with the diatoms?


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

diatoms will bloom then die off and be replaced by green type algaes.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> diatoms will bloom then die off and be replaced by green type algaes.


Do you know how long this takes, about?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

How long will your tank have water and light.....?


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

jrman83 said:


> How long will your tank have water and light.....?


No, I mean how long will it take for the diatoms to burn off eventually?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Potentially...never. Just depends on what they are attaching to. Some of the ornaments I used to have never stopped getting it.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

Oh Jesus...don't tell me that...*flaming


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Everything I read said the slimy types of diatoms were easy just to wipe off. Assuming you don't have didymo, just take it out, wipe it off, or scrub it a little, and put it back in, see what happens. Its an investment of a couple minutes. (I seriously doubt you have didymo, that was kind of a joke) assuming you're not using well water or water from a stream or river, you will probably run out of dissolved silica at some point. What that point will be will depend on how much silica is in your tank, and nobody can know that, not even a freshwater biologist with the exact figures on your dissolved silicate level could give you more than the roughest estimate, and we're not that. In the article I think it mentions an additive that can remove silicates if you want to hurry things up. But even if the diatoms hurry up and leave, that still leaves you with a niche that is just going to get filled by some other surface hugger, so I'm not sure its worth your while to go out and buy a bottle of whatever.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

ClinicaTerra said:


> Do you know how long this takes, about?


4-6 weeks


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

'course JR's never cleared up entirely, but if I remember correctly JR is on well water - is that right? If so, well water is high in dissolved silicates, so the tank will get a new shot of them every time you add water. Except you're on a no water change regime, is that right? (Entirely possible I'm confusing you with somebody else, I should really take notes instead of trying to hold everything in my head).


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Yes, I'm on well water. I only have plants and driftwood in my tanks now. No problem with diatoms.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

ClinicaTerra said:


> Oh Jesus...don't tell me that...*flaming


Didn't mean to affend.

and don't call us Jesus 

Or shirley *old dude


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

chris oe said:


> Everything I read said the slimy types of diatoms were easy just to wipe off. Assuming you don't have didymo, just take it out, wipe it off, or scrub it a little, and put it back in, see what happens. Its an investment of a couple minutes. (I seriously doubt you have didymo, that was kind of a joke) assuming you're not using well water or water from a stream or river, you will probably run out of dissolved silica at some point. What that point will be will depend on how much silica is in your tank, and nobody can know that, not even a freshwater biologist with the exact figures on your dissolved silicate level could give you more than the roughest estimate, and we're not that. In the article I think it mentions an additive that can remove silicates if you want to hurry things up. But even if the diatoms hurry up and leave, that still leaves you with a niche that is just going to get filled by some other surface hugger, so I'm not sure its worth your while to go out and buy a bottle of whatever.


When I dipped my hand into the tank during the water change, I tried rubbing vigorously at the sails, and the stains/diatoms would not budge...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> 4-6 weeks


Thanks.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

chris oe said:


> 'course JR's never cleared up entirely, but if I remember correctly JR is on well water - is that right? If so, well water is high in dissolved silicates, so the tank will get a new shot of them every time you add water. Except you're on a no water change regime, is that right? (Entirely possible I'm confusing you with somebody else, I should really take notes instead of trying to hold everything in my head).


Me? Well, I was on a no water change regime -- but I just did one two days ago and must test the water again tonight to see if anything changed...


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> Didn' mean to affend.
> 
> and don't call us Jesus
> 
> Or shirley *old dude


Poor Leslie Nielsen...


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Here's what I know: there's an invasive called dydimo (spelling?) showing up in odd places that feels like wool cloth or cotton, not slimy like most diatoms, and it prefers super clean water (so I kind of doubt this is what it is) but that stuff is hard to scrub off. You may just be having trouble with these because of the weave of the cloth, try taking the thing out and giving it a little scrub with an old toothbrush or something similar that is soap free (you were about to get a new toothbrush anyway, right?) it shouldn't be hard to remove. If it is hard to remove, scrubbing with a toothbrush under running water in the sink, with your hand behind the fabric and the brush brushing from the top, then I'm impressed with this stuff. Flabbergasted in fact.


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## ClinicaTerra (Nov 12, 2010)

Right now, I think I am just going to see what time brings, and if it "burns out" on its own...if we're even dealing with diatoms...


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