# Copepods/scuds/moina in tank/w guppies ?



## Raymond S.

Greetings invert fans,
I'm building my stock in my recently started 10 gal. I like the micro inverts crew likely just as much as the fish. Haven't located what I really
want just yet but used to have (I believe it was) live tubiflex worms. They would live in the gravel but stick anout 1/4" out the gravel till
a fish passed and pull down till he was gone. Also there are some creatures which I'm told are half plant and half animal. I know you are laughing
at my not knowing their names but it looks like a palm tree and is about 5/16th inch tall. Haven't found them yet either.
But my main interest today is do you think that I might have any decent survival rate if I was to put a portion of these into my tank that has two
fancy tail guppies in it ? The guppies can be moved either temp till the inverts get started or permanently.
Fresh Water Micro Feeders Scuds Moina Daphnia Starter Culture | eBay
I usually just go out and "collect" them but thinking on ordering some.


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## dalfed

Just wondering on how you are going to feed the micro inverts and keep water quality up?


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## tbub1221

I would probably use a sponge filter maybe since they are such small creatures. 
I find this enteresting because iv intertained this many time myself and was thinking that with a few feeder guppiwe males or endler males (smaller fish and wont breed) youd be safer these smaller fish typically dont even eat there babys which is un herd of for most live barers . there are a whole slew of cool micro pets out there to pick from . i really like some of the triops out there and like the spinetailferry shrimp are cool.
i think it will just have to be something we wont know until we try , so let me know what you decide so if i do one as well i can go another direction with it then later we can compare notes n pics. *w3
Good Luck with the tubi worms growing


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## susankat

> Also there are some creatures which I'm told are half plant and half animal. I know you are laughing
> at my not knowing their names but it looks like a palm tree and is about 5/16th inch tall. Haven't found them yet either.


By the sounds of your description it was hydra.


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## Raymond S.

First to dalfed I'll let you know that every body of water has these creatures and I'd think that the lowest count would be from cold flowing streams but water
clarity does play a part. I have no desire to create a breeding environment complete/w green pea soup water that they thrive in but have had them in most
any aquarium that I have had. I do remember that in any of them I had at least a portion of the tank thick/w vegitation even to the point that only minnow
and shrimp fry could enter. Makes a great place for those to live till grown enough to survive the main open aria anyway. Not in any way trying to create an
atmosphere of better than/hostility etc. between us. It's just been a revalation to me through these forums as of late that my knowledge of things is limited
to hear say/experience and though the experience part is credible by far it is still lacking. i.e. I heard a man on another forum say he didn't think you could
get freshwater clams to thrive in any tank less than 300 gallons. Said that they all just exist till starvation kills them in smaller tanks. Point being he just
doesn't have any experience in that aria so his knowledge is faulty but he believes it to be sound.
I seek input from others on any subject that interest me to help complete my info on same.
Hello tpub1221...I have eggs from Daphnia(water fleas) and Fairy shrimp but as yet have had no luck/w the fairy shrimp. The Daphnia seem very short lived
in my tank(s) and the main one being a "just started" may account for lack of sufficient nourishment for them. I'd love to have a co-conspiritor in this.
I've seen but one of the Triops in a for sale add. They seem interesting enough that I will seek them later after I graduate to a large tank as right now I'm
working out of ten gallon ones for economic reasons. My on-going experiment in built in bio-filters could bankrupt me were it in larger tanks. A 45 long/50 long
or just a 55 will be the "big" tank though I know from reading here and elsewhere that you guys think that is but just getting into the big size category.
I'm contemplating moving the guppies to the other tank. There is no room for a dense vegetation "hide out" aria in a ten gal. I have one now and will get
a few more when the "big tank" comes and can include that hide aria, but I really like my Banded Pigmy sunfish. His natural food is the very creatures we speak of.
I'm trying to set up a culture jar for that green pea soup algae so that I can supplement the food for my Daphnia etc. by putting some into the tanks from
time to time. That system would be preferred by me over raising the Daphnia etc. in the culture jar and just putting some of them into the tank occasionally.
I also have a couple of freshwater clams in there that would like it too. The first "dose" of that stuff being put into my tank will of course cause lots of 
apprehension as I fear it may bloom to uncontrolled amounts in there. We'll see...
The second week of March is the most likely date for ordering a couple of items like the live tubiflex and the mix of Daphnia etc. Was thinking about nerite
snails also but the cost makes me hold up on them for now. Just a thought for now but raising them might turn a profit.
Do you have any links to Triops ?
susankat...that is in fact the name. Long time periods between using the name makes it vanish from memory. Had lots of them in my brackish water tank I had when I
was about 17. Seems they do either fresh or brackish water. Thank You for the name.


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## dalfed

Sorry if my question came across wrong I was actually hoping that you had a way to do a breeding setup better then mine , my Daphnia culture is a disaster and stinks if I miss cleaning every third day, was just trying to learn thanks.


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## Raymond S.

Where I came from people talk rough to each other and when I moved where I'm now staying it jumped out at me. I sometimes talk without thinking about how it sounds so that is why I made that statement to cover myself just in case. Not you at all. 
I am just getting started in this Daphnia thing. I've always collected them by bringing home water from my collecting spots. My concept that I may use now is to still put
them in the tank but to culture a separate "jar" of the green algae stuff and add it periodically to the tank. Could end up/w a tank I can't see through...but we'll see.
Think it best to move the guppies if any Daphnia/copepods/scuds are going to survive. Still haven't found what you feed the algae culture though. Do have a good place for it.
I have a bakers rack 36" wide/w plants on it in a window. If a new tank gets "new tank syndrome" with the algae and such perhaps just the jar full of water with a pinch
of flake food will start it's own culture left in the sunlight.


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## dalfed

I grow my daphnia for my scarlet badis and celestial pearl danios in a thirty gallon tank facing a south window and can not get algae to grow in that tank so I feed them yeast, I harvest a tablespoon or so a day from this tank but the yeast clumps on the bottom making a brown sludge if I don't vac every day. Would like to get algae growing for them to eat because every site I read says they will multiply faster which would give treats to some of my other fish.


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## oscarbartoni

Yes it does sometimes take a bit of luck to get sme suspended algae growing. I now have a 2o gallon tank withit and have been changing out water in it with the smaller container that am growing daphnia in. I did an experiment and put one daphnia in it with pea soup thick green water and it only took less than a week for the daphnia to reprocuce and the young grow enough to "clean" out the green in that jar. I now have to do daily water changes in that jar so that they dco not starve. I am keeping a few jars going like that incase the main one crashes. It will be easy to start a new culture from an already established one.


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## Raymond S.

I can already see the cost of this aspect of the "natural food" issue starting to climb. For now I have but one 1/2 gal jar in a west facing window
hoping it catches enough sunlight to do for the algae but feel I'll need a plant bulb over it before it's over. BTW do you aerate them ?
In my original post I said that I wasn't interested in creating a "green pea soup environment" but I was actually referring to my tanks and not any
jars or other side issues in which they might breed. I just received my Daphnia culture and put most in the main 10 gal. Don't know why, other than
the fact that I'm getting rid of the second one to make room for the third generation tank of the built in bio-filter, that I didn't put any in that tank.
Put the balance of the culture bag in the jar which now has no algae in it. Just has about ten pieces of flake food in it. Came/w a few pieces of
"Duckweed" in it so I'm not too happy about that as it was seriously small and I was unable to get rid of all of it before using the culture.
I just hope they breed before my one fish gets them all..the Daphnia/scuds etc, that is.


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