# fishhag



## fishhag (Jan 28, 2011)

ah back in the aquarium forum, I forgot password and it was so frustrating trying to get back in. Anyway, I have no filter right now , my fluval was more than 10 yrs old and leaking. so poor couldnt buy new one. Just found one on ebay hasnt arrived yet. Have big problem with algae everywhere, been relying on water changes to keep fish healthy. Want to get CO2 set-up but dont know how to start. What do I need for a workable setup nothing extravagant. I have a VHO, diy lighting leaving lights on about 8 hrs. I have kept fish for a long time but have always been unable to get all the chemistry part of keeping a tank. I dream of an Amano like environment but it's kind of a slum right now. Our water is hard here, very hard. Help please. Liz


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

is the tank planted?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I would hope its planted if CO2 is a plan.

How big is the tank? What type of lights do you have? What type of algae is it? Reduce lighting for algae.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

jrman83 said:


> I would hope its planted if CO2 is a plan.
> 
> How big is the tank? What type of lights do you have? What type of algae is it? Reduce lighting for algae.


woopsies. Mised that LOL

Why do you feel your water is hard. KH values or pH?

If pH it could be from the plants action.

I use peat moss in the substrate which keep KH at 4 degrees for over two years. but kH with a sand substrate rises to high values.

my .02


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Plants don't cause a high ph, so that's not it. "Plant action" causes very little changes and the ph goes back to where it was shortly after the light goes out.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> Why do you feel your water is hard. KH values or pH?
> 
> If pH it could be from the plants action.
> 
> ...


GH is a measure of water hardness, not KH. KH is carbonate hardness.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

jrman83 said:


> GH is a measure of water hardness, not KH. KH is carbonate hardness.


I'll give you a chance to recover from this statement. Obviously you can't possibly think that hardness is totally independant of KH.


to the original poster: the reason I asked is because there is a relationship between carbon dioxide, carbonate, and pH. I my systems I use peat moss to limit kH, thriving plants to lower carbon dioxide. the end result is that I have kH of 4 degrees and a pH of over 8.4. But even with that high pH fish reportedly needing a pH of under 7 thrive and live for years and years.


Therefore I was curious as to why you wanted to make changes. Sometimes "wrong" parameters are acutally just fine. For instance in my case it was not the actual pH values but why the values were what they are.

Still Just my .02


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I realize the term has hardness in it and both GH and KH refer to total hardness. But, KH is a measure of the buffering capacity of the water and GH is a measure of calcium and magnesium or hardness.

To the OP: His tanks "suffer" a high ph due to a lack of water movement and possibly low oxygen. A high ph is NOT a symptom of a planted tank. Most fish can do well in an environment they have adpated to and since the ph of his tanks doesn't change overnight, they slowly adapt to the change. 

My non-CO2 planted tank has stayed at a steady 7.5ph ever since I started it 5 months ago. Yours will do the same thing as long as you don't use the mentioned methods.


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## fishhag (Jan 28, 2011)

Thanks for your reply everyone. My tank is planted but everything is quickly covered with black or dk green algae. I have 2 vHO bulbs and have been leaving lights on 10to 12 hrs. I have cut this back,change 1/4 water every 2 weeks. I want to get my filter started and then start with a co2 system. I just need advice on the bare basics to get me started. I looked at the various components on EBAY and dont have any idea what to get or what to do with it when I get it. Thankyou so much. so nice to have the feedback. Liz


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Need to start with reducing your light times to 6-7hrs to kill the algae. If it is really bad then maybe a total blackout of 4-5 days is necessary. Only needed in extreme cases. Once you get it under control, then you can start to add more light time to the point the plants still do well but the algae stays away.

Increase your water change to weekly. Excessive nutrients do not cause algae, but it can contribute. Water changes will get that under control.

If you're referring to CO2, you should read an article on how to set it up. CO2 is nothing to play with if you don't at least know a little bit about some of the pieces and what they do. Too much CO2 can gas your fish, so you will also need to know how to monitor and adjust it.

I would suggest getting everything else under control first. I don't think your algae is the result of a lack of CO2.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

fishhag said:


> Thanks for your reply everyone. My tank is planted but everything is quickly covered with black or dk green algae. I have 2 vHO bulbs and have been leaving lights on 10to 12 hrs. I have cut this back,change 1/4 water every 2 weeks. I want to get my filter started and then start with a co2 system. I just need advice on the bare basics to get me started. I looked at the various components on EBAY and dont have any idea what to get or what to do with it when I get it. Thankyou so much. so nice to have the feedback. Liz


IMHO what you need to do is completely kill the lights and suspend all feeding until the algae dies off. Usually a few days. Then resume with less lighting and feeding. If the algae comes back reduce both. If not then try longer lights.

This initial "shock" of a blackout is important IMHO to kill off the algae and return nutrients in the proper balance for the plants. Occasionally you have to do the balckout again but not usually.

then by adjusting the lights and feeding you reach a point there the plants thrive but not the algae. And that point is actually very easy to reach.

my .02


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## fishhag (Jan 28, 2011)

Once again thanks for the conversation. I have fish in this tank. I think extra water changes and leaving lights of for 4 days or so will be helpful but I don't want the fish to starve. You guys brought up some good points. My water here is hard. My husband was a plumber. he tested the water.(He used to sell water softeners) and said the hardness was like 14 . The thing is that the fish are very long lived. One , a metallic shark is 12 yrs old. I look at photos of tanks on internet , amazing tanks, I want to try to make my tank like that. It's a dream, I dont have that much knowledge, and my tank is not outstanding at its' best. Right now it is terrible and so I will try the lights out thing, pray that my fluval comes soon, and do some water changes.. And thanks again, its hard having a fish tank in a place where no one seems that serious about keeping a tank. Liz


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

What are your feeding practices? Fish should be fed no more than once per day and 6 days a week....works for most fish. 

Extra food (if you are overfeeding) likely isn't causing your algae, just some lack of control on the lighting is. Algae can live no problem without the nutrients food can leave, but not without light. Total blackouts are only necessary with extreme situations or green water and I think your plan will work just fine. You'll need to do this for about 7-10 days. If that doesn't work then do a blackout.


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