# Please help me make sense of all this; I'm a beginner:(



## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Hello. I am new to this site. I just got my first fish in April (barely 4 months ago). II'll explain my situation. My tanks are very small and I know most of you are very against anything undera 10 gallon. Hindsight is 20/20 but I wil eventually upgrade. 

I have a 1/2 gallon betta tank with the divider from Walmart. There is a female on both sides. They are by far my healthiest fish and I've had one of them 4 months. i figure most of you will say they need some later bigger? Is there a divided tank for bettas that bigger? 

2 weeks ago I got a little 3 gallon aquarium with 3 black skirt tetras. The little half moon aquarium from Walmart. I had taken in a sample of water after having it maybe 5 days bc one of the tetras died and was found stuck to the filter tube. Pet store said that only happens when they die. I have the paper with all the levels, but I think the ammonia was 1ppm and they said it high enough to have been the cause of death got a zeolite filter and came back 4 days later it was the same. So they told me to do complete water change, but to filter the water w my brita filter (I have well water). They said I don't need dechlorinator. So I changed water, added filtered water, added a bacteria supplement, added zeolite (rinsed first), and kept filter off for 4 hours... Can't remember why they said to do this. Anyway, it's been a week and I'm going to have levels rechecked tomorrow. After the water change I got another tetra bc i heard they need at least 3? Anyway, they look fabulous. Obviously the tank hasn't cycled, but no issues. I did cut feeding way back. I break up a large flake or 2 one a day, bc i hear is best to under feed until tank cycles. As far as the 1 1" fish per gallon, will 3 tetras be ok in there? I realize they would do better in a 20 gallon, but this is what I have to work with and don't think they need big changes now again so soon. Also i read that nitrate and ammonia is SUPPOSED to rise before cycle completes? I get contradicting info everywhere. If that's the case should pet store not have told me to do complete water change? They thought my well water was bad I think. 

Lastly, I have a 5 gallon tank. Yesterday I got 6 neon tetras. They were the tiniest fish I've ever seen so I thought 6 was ok. Brought them home and had already had water in tank with decor and bacteria supplement, filtered and all. I floated the bag, they acclimated to temp, I dropped them in. 2 hours later I already had a casualty. An hour later we lost another. Took both out immediately. Morning comes and the last 4 were dead! Devastating to my 7 year old. Got these from Walmart. Took back to store and asked for their last 2 tiger barbs and 3 albino barbs. I told them 5 total fish. They misunderstood bc once home I had 2 tiger barbs and 5albino barbs. Now I Have 7 fish in my five gal aquarium. Floated bag until bag and tank were at 77 degrees. 2 exhibited signs of swim bladder disorder within an hour. I read up and decided to dissolve 1 teaspoon of fw aquarium salt in a cup of tank water and add to tank. I kept my air conditioner off and tank temp is at 80.2 and not fluctuating. Heater is broken (what else could go wrong) but getting new one tomorrow to stabalize temp. After adding salt and temp seeming to stay at 80, the swim bladder symptoms seem to be going away! 

I know, shame on me for getting small tanks but can you tell me what I'm doing wrong and what to do next? I now have an over crowded tank. Do I take 2 fish back or more frequent partial water changes? Did I do wrong with the tsp of aq salt? Its incredible how much work goes into an aquarium. I'm an all for putting in the work. Not complaining. But there is so much to remember and I can't bear to lose more. Please be nice and remember I'm a beginner and looking for help. Thanks for reading this far!


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## Raymond S. (Jan 11, 2013)

Yes as part of the cycle there is supposed to be ammonia but more than .5 can/will kill fish. These amounts are not meant to be taken 
litterally but say you have two tanks. One is a 5 gallon and the other a ten gallon. Putting one drop of ammonia in both results in the
5 gallon tank having a 1.0 level but the tank gallon only has a .5 level. That is why you have a hard time getting a smaller than 10
gallon tank to be a healthy environment with more than one or two fish.
I coppied this from an earlier reply, it had links but they don't come out as links when you copy it.
Tetra SafeStart Aquarium Bio Additives
Use the 100 ml size. But before you use the Safe Start use something like one of these, but only when you first put the
water in.
Weco DeChlor Water Conditioner Aquarium Water Conditioners
Seachem Prime Water Conditioner Aquarium Water Conditioners
After you use one of those and let it stand(with filter/heater on) for one day then add the Danios. No food the first day.
the next day add food and each day after also. Then not the next day after you first feed them but the next day test the water
to see if there is any ammonia. Keep testing each day till there is ammonia. Then when there is any put half the bottle
of Safe Start directly into your filter. Put the other half the next day.Wait one day and test for the ammonia again.
Test each day until you find nitrates. Your tank is mostly finished it's cycle when you get nitrates. If the ammonia gets
over .5 then you need to change about 16L of water each day it is over that till you get nitrates. When you get nitrates
the ammonia level should be dropping by then. Then follow the water change directions found on the Aqvisor I gave you.
After a week after you get nitrates you can add more fish but only 2-3 a week. 
The Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle
The reply was written to a person who had three Danoios in a ten gallon tank. You should not use more than two fish in a smaller tank.
This is very stressful on fish and is usually not recommended except when people already have the fish but have not cycled the tank.
This only takes a few days but a regular no fish cycle takes as much as 6 weeks.
Tips for Cycling Your New Aquarium - The First Tank Guide - Getting Your Fish Tank Up and Running with Minimal Headaches

Sorry that 16L was because I was thinking you had a 10G tank. It should be half...water change if the ammonia goes over .5


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

You need a test kit to keep track of levels .I recommend API master liquid test kit.Many here use them.In order to know how much water to change you need to know levels,especially when cycling "fish in".All your tanks soung new and therefore will be going through cycle process,and without water changes you will probly lose fish.
Next you need to acclimate your fish to more than just temp.They need to be adjusted to the variables that take place in peoples water(everyones is different{potentially alot different}).Since you're on well and fish come from stores with municipal supply your water and theirs is probly very different(pH in particular).Drip acclimating (slowly) is the best method to help fish make the transition.I'll guess beyond their generall sensativity the neons died due to your acclimation and the sudden change in water quality.
Here's site info on drip acclimation
http://www.aquariumforum.com/f2/drip-acclimating-fish-11327.html
Here's site info on cycling with "fish in"
http://www.aquariumforum.com/f66/fish-poop-you-primer-8310.html


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

krk81 said:


> I know, shame on me for getting small tanks but can you tell me what I'm doing wrong and what to do next? I now have an over crowded tank. Do I take 2 fish back or more frequent partial water changes? Did I do wrong with the tsp of aq salt? Its incredible how much work goes into an aquarium. I'm an all for putting in the work. Not complaining. But there is so much to remember and I can't bear to lose more. Please be nice and remember I'm a beginner and looking for help. Thanks for reading this far!


 Raymond gave you great advice and I see now that coralbandit did as well. Please show them and your fish some gratitude by studying the information they so kindly shared. That said...

You're clearly an intelligent individual. You've admitted that you were aware that your actions were wrong. Then you repeated them. And then you repeated them again. 

Respectfully, every single thing you did was poorly thought out...from the dollhouse aquariums you stuffed with fish, to not properly cycling those tiny aquatic prison cells therefore poisoning the fish, to accepting refunds/replacements for fish that died solely due to your actions...only to go on and poison the new fish too? And you invited your child to participate? 

Okay, so here's what I recommend you do... 

1.) Stop buying fish...at least for now. All your remaining fish are going to die if you keep them. 

2.) Kindly remove both bettas from their quarter-gallon nightmare and place them separately in your 2 larger tanks...which are still too small but will seem like the ocean to them. Then monitor those water parameters every single day and when doing so, learn the Nitrogen Cycle and manage the water appropriately. 

3.) Return whatever fish are still alive without asking for a refund or credit. IMO, that's stealing. 

4.) Invest in a proper size aquarium to house your future fish. Learn the needs of those fish before you buy them. 

5.) Teach your daughter how to do it right. That said, my kids have watched me screw up plenty and lived to tell about it...even learned from it. Families learn together.

6.) Be proud of yourself for having the integrity to tell the truth and ask for help...not sure I could have.

A divider for a 1/2 gallon tank? Is that like an actual invention?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Some good hard advice here. All though some may sound like it, nobody here is trying to be disrespectful I don't think. None of us that have been doing this for a while have without our own share of mistakes. You really have to learn from them though or things tend to bite you again until the point you do.

The first thing you did that was 100% right was coming here and asking advice. Hopefully, you can gain control of the situation through use of the site. What you have gone through is why many new aquarist quit before they get to the part where this can be a very enjoyable experience in the care of the animals and plants. Your own little eco-system that you manage...sort of.

Hope things get better for you soon and hope you take the advice given.


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

I would like to welcome you to our forum, and thank you for being honest in your mistakes. 

That said I cannot suggest a band aid for an amputated leg. As Goby pointed out it would do you well to return the fish and those small setups to the store, and invest in something that can be maintained stable. Let me touch on the bettas as the others were covered very well.Let me explain why the little betta tanks are trash.

So you have two female bettas, right beside each other. The tank being divided they can see each other. They will flare. Neither has the room to flee to any real decor so its a constant flare off until one or both have broken spirits. This leads to a bored sad fish without the will to live. There is no possible way to heat or filter the little device. No heat means cold water, or at the very least easy temperature instability. Fluctuating temps can cause diseases. No filter means no bacteria save the small amount that is in the substrate. This means the fish are living in their own waste without a way to detoxify it.

Bettas are smart and thrive on things to do. Having caves and other such hides gives them security and a place to guard. Plants help them with the same thing. Warmth lets their natural metabolism be in tune to how it should be and clean waters helps them thrive. If you have two females now, then you need at least three more and at least a ten gallon tank for the five of them, if you plan to keep more than one. Otherwise three gallons for one would be fine but no less because the stability issue. While they come from shallow waters it is very expansive! Rice paddies or shallow slow moving streams are where they hail from. 

Also toss the one inch per gallon rule out with your next water change it doesnt really apply.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Hello. Thank you all for the advice. Especially those that managed to do so respectfully. I already feel badly and want to make this right. I was hoping for advice and not to be shamed. I had a feeling that would happen though, just by reading other forums. A lot of ppl get scolded here. I have tried putting my oldest betta in the tank with the tetras (per petsmart advice). She was bullying the tetras and nipping their fins so I had to put her back. The divider is black and they can't see each other. So is getting a 20 gallon aquarium and putting my 7 barbs and my 3 tetras even a possibility? Or since the barbs are listed as semi aggressive and tetras are peaceful, should I not do that? I could buy a 20 gallon and give one betta the 3 gal and one the 5 gallon? Definitely not getting anymore fish, I promise that. I want to fix this. I didn't want my tanks to go to waste and all I knew was the 1 1" per gallon rule. So I have 3 gal so 3 tetras. Then I tried to get 5 barbs for my 5 gal but the man misunderstood and gave 5 albino and 2 tigers. What if I get a 10 gallon for my barbs, put my tetras in the 5 gallon, and 1 betta in the 3 gallon, and 1 betta keeps the 1/2 gal until I find better accommodations? I want to make this right. I've unknowingly bitten off more than I can chew and I want to fix it. 

I'm trying to upload photos but can't figure out how. I'm on my phone. 

Ok i'm going to go to petsmart today and possibly buy a 10 gallon. I've heard the term drip acclimating before. I'll read on that. Will it be too stressful for them to move to a new tank?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

If you can manage the 20, get it. The bigger the better for having a stable environment. Is taking back any of the fish a possibility?


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Well, I'll be honest. I bought all these fish (except a couple) from Walmart. I bought a fiddler Crab there and a few days later went to Walmart and literally saw a fiddler Crab eatinga tetra. So I asked if they will take it back and told them I don't need a refund, just want it to be ok and their response was they can't (per health department) bc it would contaminate their tanks. I found the crab a suitable home and learned from that experience. So my point is, Walmart will not take back fish unless I talked to someone that gave me false information. petsmart said they have a 14 day return policy, so had I bought it from them I could have returned them. I think realistically I could get a 10 gallon for my 7 fish and put my 3 tetras in the 5 gallon. It would be an upgrade for all fish. Thoughts? I don't have too much more money to invest in this and don't have many places to put more aquariums.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Attempting to upload. The top is my 5 gal that is overcrowded w 2 tiger barbs and 5 albino barbs. Middle is my bettas in their '1/4 gallon prison'. Not being too sarcastic here, bc i feel sorry for them and want them to have more space. I will fix this. Bottom is sideways but it's my 3 gal w 3 black skirt tetras. Let me know what you see wrong, pls be nice. I realize they're overcrowded, but after do I have tank set up appropriately? Is there to much decor?


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

I think it's interesting somebody would use the word 'respectfully' in the same sentence that they tell me I poisoned my fish to death and invited my child to play in some sort of fish torture game. I wasn't raised with fish, I had no idea what to do. Someone like me w no prior knowledge of fish, thought there was nothing to it...you put fish in a bowl w some decor and boom, you have an aquarium. Someone who grew up raising fish does not understand that maybe other ppl aren't as experienced or knowledgeable. I lost a fish and had levels checked (petsmart asked me to bring sample in...I would have never guessed water testing was a part of having fish... Now that I DO know, it's hard to believe it had never occurred to me, but that just goes to show that raising fish isn't something we innately know how to do). Once I realized I was probably over feeding my fish and that likely contributed to the ammonia spike, I started reading. I started over w complete water change, got new tank. Lost all my fish in that tank I assumed it was bc the fish were unhealthy. I never would have guessed I did anything wrong. You have to understand that when you don't realize there is anything to know about keeping fish, than you don't know you made a mistake. I called Walmart and told them all the fish died and they told me to come get more and go to customer service desk. They replaced them free. I didn't ask. That night (which was last night) I spent HOURS reading up on things. I learned tons of mistakes I made (including letting my kids hold the bag of fish on the way home... Which I learned is super stressful for them). I would have never guessed you were supposed to cycle a tank w something called 'live rock' first. I did know to float the bag and add bacteria supplement w this new tank... Petsmart never told me about cycling BEFORE adding fish. Now I'm over here constantly reading about what I should have done and is impossible to turn back time. So before you shame someone with no experience of keeping fish, maybe you can realize that some ppl, unlike you, weren't around fish their whole lives and had no idea that so much was involved. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one that lost fish in order to learn from their mistakes. Had those sweet little fish not died, I wouldn't have known I did anything wrong and I wouldn't be here now trying to make things right. I'm really trying to do what needs done. I'm considering a 20 gallon tank. I will do my best to undo the mistakes I have made without anymore casualties. I appreciate the ppl who have an open mind and know they have been where I am and know I'm trying to make things better. Thanks! 

So what is next step? Bigger tank and drip acclimating? I still need to read up on that.


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## Avraptorhal (Jan 24, 2013)

I made similar mistakes when I started a year ago. People were not shaming you but simply telling you what to do. I'm sorry you took it as shaming. We all had to have someone help us at some point. Wipe out any feelings on your part that you are being attacked, guilted or shamed. The replies which made you feel that way are from guys who have probably done similar things but have learned from those experiences. You also have to understand that they really care about the fish and can be a little frustrated when they see someone hurting their friends.

I don't understand where you are with the number of fish, but that is my problem. However, I think your next step is to stop buying any more fish or equipment. Sit down with a decent book on fish keeping and study it until you understand what it is telling you. If you then have more questions come back here and ask them and I'm sure the experts will help and they are experts who have learned by research, experience and asking for help. They have many years of experience.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

I'm confused. I was told I was wrong by having to many fish in a small tank and when I suggest buying a 20 gallon I'm told not to? Not sure which advice to take. I'm just looking for clarification if you all don't mind 

One person and one person only was extremely rude in the delivery of their message to me. And said I knew I was wrong and repeated the same mistakes over and over, knowingly. I didn't know I had done anything wrong until last night when I registered w this site and read old forums . And suggesting that I'm killing fish as a hobby and having my daughter join in on some killing spree was over the line. My point was, some ppl need to realize there are people that do not understand they've made a mistake until it's too late. So your advice would be taken more seriously without the condescending tone. I don't intend to dwell on that, just pointing it out. But I thank everyone for taking the time to help me! And my fish. But now I've been given 2 different pieces of advice and I'm confused. Do I leave all my fish where they are, or do I buy them a 20 gallon? Thanks in advance


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## Jenniferinfl (May 3, 2013)

Most of your questions are fairly well covered, so I'll leave most of it alone. It is pretty rough to find out you've been doing everything wrong especially when it involves a living thing. 

Before you run off to Walmart or Petco or Petsmart or some similar establishment and pay $100 and up for a small 20 gallon tank, check craigslist. 

I'm not sure where you're at, but, around here good deals can be had all the time for 40 gallon on up tanks. People tend to overcharge for the little tanks, so those aren't usually worth getting used. 

I would pick up something more fun like a 40 gallon tank for your tetras. For most tetras, you want at least 5 of the same kind and they do even better in schools of ten. 

Though, I would buy whatever was a good deal on Craigslist and larger than 20 gallons. 

For the next 4 weeks, plan on doing 50% water changes daily to keep ammonia and nitrites in check so that you don't kill your fish. In an uncycled tank, those levels rise almost continually which gives plenty to feed the bacteria even with a 50% water change. 

You can also use something called Prime that will help make the ammonia and nitrites not as dangerous. If it was me, I would be dosing prime at say 6 am, then doing your 50% water change at 6 pm. Of course, pick whichever time, just about 12 hours apart. It will be a tedious next 4 weeks or so, but, cycling a tank with fish in is always a lot of work.

Edited to add: Of course, don't add more tetras to meet the minimum school of 5 until at last 4 weeks from now when the cycle has pretty much completed.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Petsmart has a 20 gal aquarium kit for 30 bucks in store. I definitely don't want bigger than 20 gallon. I don't want an aquarium stand. I have an enormous kitchen with tons of counter space and I would like to keep it on the counter. Plus I have 2 cats so I like that my aquarium is below the cabinets, and I have a dog that I would be nervous would knock into an aquarium stand. They are very safe on my counter from commotion. I wanted a 10 gal but if 20 is better I'll do that. Thank you for suggesting 50% water changes. I'll do that.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

And Jennifer you are absolutely right. It was very hard for me to find out that I messed up I love each and every creature on this earth. I take spiders outside instead of killing them (I live in the country on 3.5 acres), I do not want to hurt anything. So yes it has broken my spirit. I never intended to get these fish and do something so wrong that they die. That's why getting ridiculed for it earlier broke my spirit even more. I want to correct my mistakes. Thank you for your empathy and advice


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

The internet offers new hobbyists more than just a window into this hobby...it offers a complete aerial view. I gather information from numerous resources, and my favorite online resource is Wetwebmedia, Aquarium, Pond, Marine and Freshwater Fish, reef tanks, and Aquatics Information . You will find the answers to just about everything there. The site represents the life work of Robert Fenner who is both a FW and SW enthusiast. The homepage will appear baron, and IMO a the site is somewhat confusing to navigate...but it's been well worth my effort and there's lots of good stuff behind that homepage. My favorite thing about that site is that it offers not just expert advice, but differing expert points of view. Intellectually I appreciate that, cuz no matter what some people will want you to believe...no one person has all the right answers; I don't care how long they've been doing this or to what extent. When you stumble upon those individuals, and you will because these forums are magnets to that personality type, don't get sucked in. 

Beyond that, a reasonable next step would be to learn how to set-up a planted aquarium...nothing extravagant...no CO2 cylinders...just something that can nourish fairly dense plant life.  The species you're currently keeping will require that for optimal health. Always keep your barbs in a group of no less than 6 individuals. This is the rule of thumb for keeping most fish of that nature...tetras, barbs, danios etc...and not an optional rule either. Gobs is written about the behaviors of those fish and why several individuals is necessary, on wetwebmedia and numerous other sites. The foundation you've already laid with regards to fish community members, is barb. Learn what other species of fish can live in harmony with them. Harmony is the secret to successfully keeping all aquatic life. That may seem logical but many aquarists, both new and seasoned, find it difficult to live within the boundaries of any one species...myself included. It's important none the less. If you don't think you can keep things barb-friendly...rehome them and build the community foundation with another species appropriate for your size tank. 

Tank size...

20 gallons is good but IMO, 40 gallons is way better. It's better than twice as better. A 40-gallon long tank is easier to manage than a 20 and doesn't cost much more to set up or maintain. I strongly encourage you to get the largest tank your budget and environment can handle. If you can do a 55, get a 55. Bigger tanks mean more harmony and have proven to be a key factor in the long-term success of many. There's so many advantages to more space...more water, healthier water, more territory, less aggression, less stress, less disease, less disappointment and best of all...more stocking options. Did I mention more stocking options?

Fortunately, this particular forum is rich with expert planted aquarium expertise...more so than even some of the larger forums. Seek that knowledge and for inspiration I'd encourage you to go to youtube and search _40-gallon planted aquarium_. The options for a simple planted tank are endless and if you're resourceful, quite affordable too. I can get lost in the aquariums on youtube for hours.

Best of luck to you and yours.


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## chipmunk1210 (Jul 3, 2012)

I definitely suggest you get at the least a 20 gallon tank so that you can fix (at least to some extent) what started out so bad. You can put all your schooling fish (tetras and barbs) in the 20 gallon and split your bettas up between the two smaller tanks. In all reality if you do not get at least a 20 gallon, you are still going to be pretty overstocked since the barbs will need a bigger tank than a 10 gallon and leaving the bettas (or even one of them) in the 1/2 gallon is not a good idea. 

I am sorry that you took at least one of the posts as anything but helpful. You will come across some people on here who are very blunt. To the point of sounding mean even. They don't mean to be disrespectful but they also expect you to do research before getting a living creature. Kind of like planning for a cat or dog before running out and getting one to find out that you can't keep it because it got to large ect. The fish's well being is the number 1 thought for most of us on here and we all try to help out as much as we can. Also there is such a difference in written word VS spoken word and much of what is written can be taken wrong by a lot of people. So please keep that in mind when you start getting responses you really don't like.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

First,I apologize if I sounded rude."The fish will die" has nothing to do with you it is all about the cycle.I know many enter without being given good info on the nitrogen cycle and wake up to the rude suprise(with dead fish).Nothing you can do if you don't know,so no harm as far as I'm concerned.Many before and after you will lose fish to stores that only sell and don't inform.
Go with the 20gl if that's your max(for now) as it help get fish deserving more space their place.
You have done well to admit your mistakes,we have all made them{it is true}) and seeking a remedie as quickly as you have is courageous to say the least.
The bad news is you'll get through this if you give it time and (some how I know) become addicted(welcome to the club) and wish you only had larger(than can fit in house) tanks!
I'll add (and this may be advanced but that's where you came too) that tiger barbs are a diffacult fish to house with others to say the least and many house them in species only tanks,meaning with no others besides other tiger barbs.Some have managed them with others ,but you will search long and hard to find it.
I'll end with go as big as you can(afford) and move the fish you like BEST TO THAT TANK!It is a hobby and most of all who responded are obessed(I am),but in the long run it is supposed to be fun for you and your children also!
Good luck, I'm sure much more advice will come ;THIS IS A GREAT SITE!


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

krk81 said:


> I'm confused. I was told I was wrong by having to many fish in a small tank and when I suggest buying a 20 gallon I'm told not to? Not sure which advice to take. I'm just looking for clarification if you all don't mind
> 
> One person and one person only was extremely rude in the delivery of their message to me. And said I knew I was wrong and repeated the same mistakes over and over, knowingly. I didn't know I had done anything wrong until last night when I registered w this site and read old forums . And suggesting that I'm killing fish as a hobby and having my daughter join in on some killing spree was over the line. My point was, some ppl need to realize there are people that do not understand they've made a mistake until it's too late. So your advice would be taken more seriously without the condescending tone. I don't intend to dwell on that, just pointing it out. But I thank everyone for taking the time to help me! And my fish. But now I've been given 2 different pieces of advice and I'm confused. Do I leave all my fish where they are, or do I buy them a 20 gallon? Thanks in advance


IMO, another thing to consider would be accepting full responsibility for your lack of knowledge and everything it's been and will be responsible for with regards to the pets you keep. What's done is done...we all live and learn, myself included. But I don't personally embrace the school of thought that ignorance is an excuse when it comes to the welfare of people or animals, even fish...especially when it repeats itself numerous times over a 4-month period. That's where I'm at...and if you think I've never been on the shaming end of a fish-care related discussion, you're wrong. And yeah, it sucked...but it needed to happen and I'm thankful it did. And yeah, there's not a doubt in my mind it will again. 

Beyond that, you'll often not get a unanimous vote on the advice you seek in these forums. The nature of this hobby and the eclectically eccentric group of people who embrace it, don't allow for that. Ultimately, it's up to you to empower yourself with the information you need to make the right choices for your pets, and as I stated before, that information is vast and readily available. 

You'll be hard pressed to find a more critical yet helpful group of people, than fish people. I'm glad you came to this forum, even though you're not glad I responded to your post. This is where you need to be. And because it's vital that this thread be a nonthreatening place for you to learn, I'll back away from it. But if you ever have a question you'd like a second opinion on, I'd be happy to respond via PM. I'm usually around late nights and early mornings...mostly on the weekends.

Again, I wish you well!


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

chipmunk1210 said:


> I definitely suggest you get at the least a 20 gallon tank so that you can fix (at least to some extent) what started out so bad. You can put all your schooling fish (tetras and barbs) in the 20 gallon and split your bettas up between the two smaller tanks. In all reality if you do not get at least a 20 gallon, you are still going to be pretty overstocked since the barbs will need a bigger tank than a 10 gallon and leaving the bettas (or even one of them) in the 1/2 gallon is not a good idea.
> 
> I am sorry that you took at least one of the posts as anything but helpful. You will come across some people on here who are very blunt. To the point of sounding mean even. They don't mean to be disrespectful but they also expect you to do research before getting a living creature. Kind of like planning for a cat or dog before running out and getting one to find out that you can't keep it because it got to large ect. The fish's well being is the number 1 thought for most of us on here and we all try to help out as much as we can. Also there is such a difference in written word VS spoken word and much of what is written can be taken wrong by a lot of people. So please keep that in mind when you start getting responses you really don't like.


Beautifully said.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Goby, please tell me where I didn't take full responsibility for my mistakes? I am not trying to absolve myself of any responsibility. If you didn't notice, I admitted all my mistakes in my OP bc i know how ppl talk to ppl like me (beginners) so I was full on admitting my mistakes to prevent the condescending tones, and the shame on you speeches, etc bc i thought I saved you all the trouble by shaming myself! Lol...yes, I screwed up and lost 7 fish...SIX at once, none the less! I love all earthly creatures and feel awful that some died at the expense of my ignorance. If I was unwilling to accept full responsibility I wouldn't be here. And goby I DO appreciate the amazing advice you and the others gave me. You guys are amazingly knowledgeable and most importantly experienced and I DO want to say one day that I know even half as much about keeping an aquarium as you do. I will take the judgements and the negativity from here out with a grain of salt because you guys helped me! Thanks! 

So from what I understand I need to:

-get a 20 gal aquarium (minimum) 
-stock it with my barbs (bc i have 7 of them) 
-do something called drip acclimating (will read about it) 
-add something to keep bad stuff out of water (it's listed above iforget name)
-do 50%water changes until cycle completes 
-don't overfeed 

How will I know cycle is complete? Is it when test kit starts giving perfect readings? 

TiA!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

This thread is long (http://www.aquariumforum.com/f66/cycling-49242.html), but it was mine as I was trying to get help getting my tank cycled. I think the advice I got on there might help you. I wouldn't exactly recommend the Tetra SafeStart step I took because apparently it didn't do anything to help my tank.

But as far as water parameter questions and such, I think I covered a lot of them on there and they were all answered. Good luck!


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## Raymond S. (Jan 11, 2013)

When you come to the forum, across the top are different categories like "Forums" and "Chatroom" and "New Posts".
Lots of the people who regularly go to the forum on every day or almost on every day go straight to New Post. And I'll
bet you can sometimes get the impression that they just read one reply before they answered you. I'll not give an example
but you can see how they also only have some of the info on this thread. Therefor the confusing answers...see...
The sad thing here is that the shop which sold you fish without asking if your tank was cycled is the most responsible
entity for this to begin/w. How many people walk into a store knowing nothing about fish/aquariums and buy both at
the same time without being asked any questions by the store employees ? And if you never had fish before I guess
they think everyone came born with this knowledge.
Any way the majority of it amounts to the idea that you might stop, and read for a while on the subject of the cycle
especially (and I think I remember you threw one in about "live rock"...that is for salt water) but just aquarium keeping
in general by taking a look at a few of the threads on a couple of the forum topics like "General questions" and there is one for 
plants and for Betta's so just look through any of those and pick a thread that seems to be about something that you feel you
would like to know more about (for example which fish get along/w Betta's) and by reading other replies you can find
out things you would not have known had you not seen that thread. Reading what other people suggested to someone else about
a problem I also had has taught me a lot. Before I joined this forum I never knew that Pleco's needed wood to chew on for their 
digestive systems to work properly for example. I have two ten gallon tanks with three fish in one and six fish in the other.
Plus a couple of Red Cherry Shrimp in that one also. It is not difficult to manage a ten if you keep down on the number and
size of the fish. All mine are less than 1.5"...two fancy tailed guppies are the longest fish I have. My lease limits the size tank
that I can have so I needed to learn how to stay within the limits of what those tanks can be expected to handle.
I almost forgot...if there is a single store "mom and pop" type fish store around(as opposed to a chain like Petsmart) and
you bring them fish they will usually take them. I'm mostly talking about the barbs as they are the most likely to get
too big for a ten G tank and/or get along/w other fish. Then to if your doing all this off of a smartphone instead of a
desktop/w a decently large screen I can see why it may be difficult for you to read all the links that we have sent you.
Hang in there because the best is yet to come. I love my ten's(even though I secretly drool over a planted 55) and feel
the time I spend with them is better spent than how I spent the time before I got them.


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Thank you! I appreciate everything! I do need to check other forums. I need to get on from my mac and learn how to navigate the site. Didn't get a tank yet but got my new heater. Its keeping it at 78.0 precisely. my temp stays around 78 to 79 by itself, but hopefully the heater keeps it from fluctuating up or down. They need stable water temp. They are doing good. I thought for sure I'd lose 2 last night. Probably due to the temp variations from store to tank (although I did my best to acclimate), but 2 had swim bladder symptoms BADLY...i I gave them a teaspoon of dissolved fw aquarium salt (read that from this site) and the temp stabalize despite my broken heater. Now all my adorable barbs are doing wonderfully. I did a 50% water change earlier (slowly and carefully). I'll do it everyday. I give you all my word that I will do my best to keep these fish alive, happy, and healthy. Thanks!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

To know where you are at in the cycle you will need a test kit.API master liquid test kit will have all the test you need; ammonia,nitrite,nitrate and pH.
While cyling your ammonia will be first to show and grow quickly.It is also the most dangerous to the well being of fish.Don't let it go over 1ppm.Next and possibly along with the ammonia will be nitrIte.Also damaging to fish ,but a little less than ammonia.Don't let nitrIte go over 1ppm either.Eventually you will get nitrAte(the end result of having the proper bacteria and nowhere near as dangerous to fish.Your ammonia and nitrItes should both read 0 when your filter is cycled and nitrAtes should be kept under 40ppm.All tanks with cycled filters will have nitrAtes and this is why we all change water.Most who have done this for a while change water on a schedule(weekly,2x aweek,everyother week).The test for nitrAte will help guide you to know how often you will need to change water.
The amount of water you change is the amount the nutrients(ammonia,nitrite,and nitrate) will be reduced.An example is if your 20gl tank has 1ppm ammonia changing 10gl of water(50%) will reduce the ammonia to .5ppm(50% of original).This formula works for all the nutrients so knowing "ideal" levels will help you know how much water to change.
Use dechlorinator ALWAYS as most good ones detoxify heavy metals(probly in your well)along with crap in municipal water(I know you said well water).Prime is a very good product and last a long time when measured out properly.
Good luck and believe me we have ALL had to start somewhere and made many mistakes.No one here is trying to beat you up,but many of us really count fish lives right up there with other more common pets(dogs/cats).Once your tank /filter is cycled it gets much easier and more enjoyable so please stick with it ,aquariums are a great hobby.


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## snowghost45 (May 13, 2013)

Welcome! Don't let some of the posters here get to you. Everyone has an opinion and you know what that means. I wouldn't buy fish from places like Walmart etc. Do you have a smaller fish/pet store in your town? As far as learning about fish keeping google! and post your questions here. Another good place to find tanks is the newspaper under give a ways and check yard sales. Two of my large tanks, 33 and 55 were given to me. Lots of folks think they want fish and find out they don't or just get tired of them, who knows. Keep posting and good luck with your fish!


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## Mr. Wood (Aug 3, 2013)

*Am I overstocked??*

Aquarium Gallery - All Images
I went to a site named aqavisor.com and typed in my specs as follows:
6.6 bookshelf 
Tetra whisper pf10
3 neon tetras 
2 albino Cory's 
1 ghost shrimp

Amazon sword (petco label read it as argentine sword)
Money wort 

I would like to find out if my tank is overstocked? 
I had it running for a little over 2 months now and my amazon sword has grown rapidly... Starting of as on pod and now I have close to six.. 
I figured the plants along with weekly 30% water changes would suffice or am I just delaying the inevitable???


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## krk81 (Aug 1, 2013)

Thank you all!


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