# What is the Flipping deal?!?!??!



## thenewseverum (Nov 23, 2010)

I for whatever god awful reason can not for the life of me seem to keep fish alive. Now, don't get my wrong, I've owned fish since I was 11 year old, I have worked in several pet stores that sell fish, I have done countless hours of research and asked a lot of questions so I am not by any means a newbie. Now, I set my 29G up again, got new gravel and what not, set it up nicely. I put my Aquaclear 110 on as my regular filter, and a Cascade 300 as a biological housing. Got new filter media and the whole nine yards. The tank has been set up for 3 months, finally after 2 months of waiting it finished cycling. After battling the nitrates and nitrites forever. Now, over the course of maybe two to three weeks, I have lost a total of 8 out of 10 fish. 6 zebra danios, a BN pleco, and my other striped Pike. These were not added at the same time. This was over a span of time. I do my water changes once a week like I am supposed to. I feed only once a day, keeping the feeding at a minimum. Water quality shows everything is normal. I use the API master test kit when testing water quality. I always properly acclimate my fish not only by temperature but slowly adding water to the bag. As I have noticed a large decrease in fish fatalities. The question however still stands, why are my fish dying? I have never had this problem before. I honestly think its the terrible water here in Winter Springs. Considering I lived in Oviedo and I had some sensitive species of fish and had no issues. I lived in New York on Long Island for almost two years, same thing, no issues. Im not doing anything different as I was back then. I simply can not figure out the issues. Neither can the guys are my LFS. I leave the question with you guys. Whats going on? Because honestly, I am thinking about closing it up. I do not have a job so I cant keep replacing fish all the time. 

Also no comments in regard to my tank is to small for the pike. He's about 3 inches and will be fine for now.

All I have in the tank at this very moment is the pike and an L52. So its not like the bio load shot though the roof. As I will admit, for a pleco, that thing doesn't stop pooping.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Are you sure the pike isn't killing them?


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## meBNme (Oct 7, 2011)

City water? What do you use to treat it?
How long do your fish stay in the bag in total before release?
What are your water parameters, temp etc?


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## thenewseverum (Nov 23, 2010)

The 6 danios and pleco all died before I got the pikes


EDIT:

Yeah it is I believe.. 

Im using stress coat to treat it, and the bag remain in the back for up to an hour before being released.


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## meBNme (Oct 7, 2011)

Are you floating them for an hour or total time from being bagged in the LFS to release less than 1 hr?
Are they all from one LFS?
Before release, do you see any waste in the bag?

Here is a possible theory.
The LFS may not have the greatest water quality.
"IF" you are getting fish that were just fed that morning, and the water quality isnt all that good to start with, the fish are then put in the bag, their waste further reduces the water quality.
You float them in slightly warmer water, which increases the toxicity of ammonia already elevated in the bag, (Reduced oxygen and lower temps reduce toxicity of ammonia, so if the bag water has elevated ammo, an increase in temp and oxygen will increase the toxicity of the bagged water.) The fish is already stressed, now has horrible water conditions.

Gill burnout may be happening, and added stress could be causing the deaths.
You may want to consider treating the bag water with prime before transport.


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## HFGGHG (Aug 28, 2011)

I've had 6 Zebra Danios since July of this year in my 29 gallon.
Last Monday I transferred all of them into my new 20 gallon. Didn't 
phase them a bit. Tank was up and running for 72 hours. 
These fish are the hardiest little guys, as I'm sure you're aware of.
I'm wondering if your fish are getting enough to eat ? Danios are total
pigs and I've read that they require frequent feedings due to their high
energy levels. 
I also feed once daily, but found that I needed to increase the amount of flakes due to the danios being such gluttons ! These guys would consume all the food before their tankmates even knew that it was chow time.
I also use Stress Coat, StressZyme, and H2O conditioner after water changes. I let my tap water sit for at least 3 days in gallon milk containers before adding to the tank.
Could your city water be that bad to kill your fish ? Have you tried spring water instead ?


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## thenewseverum (Nov 23, 2010)

@meBNme – No I usually don’t see any waste in the bags. Its usually about an hour or so total time from the store to release point.

I know the manager at the LFS and shes very anal about her tanks. Maybe you are right, maybe their fish are bad..

The theory makes sense. Very possible.

Thank you.


@HFGGHG – At most at a time I had 3, so I know for a fact they were eating enough. The thing with Spring/RO water has come up. I cant afford that. 



@ jccaclimber- I agree, I have seen very few places where the danios are well fed and in good condition. I personally believe they are a less hardy fish, I mean look at their price tag. I got mine for 49 cents a piece.


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## meBNme (Oct 7, 2011)

Next time you buy a fish, take a water sample from the bag right when you release them. Test it for ammonia. (Before treating with anything of course.)

Also, if there IS something to this theory, it may not even be the LFS' fault. If they just got in a new shipment of fish, you may have gotten fish that had already been stressed from shipping, in who knows what water conditions, they sit in the LFS for a day or two, then go through it all over again to your tank.

If your LFS is very popular and has a quick turnover, this is even more likely.

One of my local LFS is such a mover, they recently got in 6 teacup stingrays that all sold within one week... at 90$ each.
It would have taken the other stores around here 6 months to do that.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Even if there was ammonia in the bag, I just don't see it killing a fish that fast. If you ever order any fish online, they ship them all in little individual bags, some very small ones compared to the lfs bags, and they are in there usually well over 24hrs.

I would just change the store first off. Find out what day the store you choose gets their fish and go there that day or the day after and pick fish. Stop floating the bag and start doing a drip acclimation...much better method. I would also let these fish you have left stay in there a while by themselves before adding anymore. Add 1-2 fish every 2-3 weeks....not just because of ammonia spikes.


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## thenewseverum (Nov 23, 2010)

Will do, thank you.


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