# Cycling



## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Alright, I should have researched harder apparently before diving into this hobby. However, the past is behind me now. I have a 55 gallon aquarium with 5 zebra danios (I had 6, but one died a few days ago, no idea why). I used Tetra SafeStart (I know this is controversial, which is why I should have researched more, but anyhow) when I started the aquarium last Sunday (I added the fish on Monday). All of my water tests are normal according to my research. So my question is, how do I know when my tank is fully cycled? From what I've been reading, am I waiting now for my test to show some nitrates? This would mean my tank is cycled?

After this, I then do a partial water change and I'm good to get more fish? I just want to make sure I have conditions acceptable for more fish before adding them. The one I had die really upset me (I'm pregnant and way more emotional than normal).

Thanks for any help!

Water Parameters:
Ammonia: 0
Nitrates: 0
Nitrites: 0
Hardness: 75
Alkalinity: 80
pH: 7.2 or 7.8 (the colors are so close, I'm leaning toward 7.8 though)


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

I would say that you are not cycled yet. Are you using strips or liquid tests? And congratulations!!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Thanks! I'm using test strips right now for everything except the ammonia (I have the liquid test for it). I ordered a master test kit, but it won't be here until the beginning of next week probably.


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Ammonia should show first but with the safe start used I am wondering if those strips are just not showing nitrates. To error on the side of caution I would do a 50% water change every third day until your test kit arrives, and don't add any more fish until you are sure you are cycled.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Oh that does not sound fun. Will changing 50% of the water not get rid of what little bacteria the tank has developed so far? I'll have to wait until my husband gets home later today so he can help me deal with that much water. Thanks for your help!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Very little beneficial bacteria(BB)are in the water column.As long as you don't mess with the filter your fish will appreciate it.
Amazon.com: Aqueon Aquarium Water Changer - 25 Feet: Pet Supplies
These eliminate buckets and make water changes easier.You'll be changing water longer than you'll be changing diapers, so think about it!(diapers ;a couple years,water changes FOREVER!)


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Manage your freshwater aquarium, tropical fishes and plants: Nitrogen Cycle for Dummies


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Thanks everyone! You're very helpful!


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

Welcome to the forum. Don't get discouraged about the water changes. They aren't all that bad really. There are lots of threads in this forum about cycling too. 

Hope you have a great day.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

The tracking on my API Master Test kit says it will be here Monday. So I'll have more accurate information then. However, I've done water changes (twice now) and my test strips are still saying 0 nitrates and nitrites. My API Ammonia liquid test kit is showing 0 ammonia. The test strip for the nitrates seems to look a TAD bit pinkish, but not near as pink as the 20 on the label (the first result option above 0).

The reason I'm updating really (before my test kit arrives) is because my fish seem to act funny after water changes. I watch these fish a lot and they usually act fine, swimming around, chasing each other, etc. However, after a water change, they act like they're scared or something...like they're trying to get out of the aquarium. My biggest one was hanging out behind the filter for a while. Is this normal?


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

I would say yes, it is normal. Especially since the tank is going thru a cycle. Remember, they were moved around several times before you rescued them. Once your water tests ok and the cycle is complete, they will be fine. Also, Danio's are schooling fish. They prefer to be in a group of at least 6 or more. Don't add more though, until the cycle is complete. Danio's are tough little fish. You should be fine.

Hope you have a great day


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Alright...I got my master test kit in today and I've tested everything. It all seems to be pretty much the same. Although I did the "high range pH" test and it was really high, I'm not sure what that means...?

pH: 7.6
High Range pH: 8.2
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Ammonia: 0

On both nitrate and ammonia, the yellow color of the liquids are not as bright as what is on the color card, however, they are no where close to the orange or green for the next options. I guess my question now is....Now what do I do?


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

It doesn't sound like it is cycled yet because you should have some Nitrates. The ammonia will turn to nitrItes, and that into nitrAtes, and that can only be vanqueshed with Water Changes.


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Wait test tomorrow when ammonia gets above 1 ppm do a partial water change, unfortunately the cycle takes considerably more time fish in, please continue to post results so we can see at what point your cycle is at.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Should I do a water change today before I test again tomorrow or just leave it alone for now?


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

No need, only water change when ammonia or nitrites get too high


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I forgot a question. I was attempting to show my three year old daughter how to take a small pinch of fish food because she takes very large pinches. However, I should have done this with the aquarium lid closed because as I was saying, "That's too much, put some back...," she threw her large pinch into the aquarium. The fish ate it all really fast and their bellies were really bloated for the rest of the day. Needless to say, she isn't allowed to help feed the fish for a while. I've read where everyone says to feed the fish a small amount in order to keep the ammonia levels from spiking. Shouldn't her putting that great amount of food in there made me show some ammonia when I tested the water later that day and the next day and so on?

I guess I just don't understand why ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates are still zero at this point.


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## Merc Dr. (Jun 4, 2013)

I'm doing almost the thing right now. I used ATM Colony which is pretty much the same thing. I wouldn't do any more water changes until you see some change in chemistry. I haven't touched mine in a week and a half. I just started seeing nitrates. You have 5 very small fish in a very large tank. The water is going to dilute a lot of the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. I have a 90gal. with 7 fish about 2-3" each. Another thing is, you may not see the ammonia or nitrites if the bacteria are doing their job and converting them. Remember, that's food for the bacteria. I would wait until you see the nitrates get to 30-40 before doing a water change unless you see one of the other 2 start to get too high.
Here is a link to ATM. It's a similar product. Scroll down to the bottom to the downloads and read those. They may help a little.
http://acrylictankmanufacturing.com/products/water-treatment/biologicals/colony/


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

How does it test now?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I just tested, everything is the same. I guess I just don't understand why that Tetra SafeStart doesn't seem to be cycling the tank effectively. From what I've read, it's supposed to cycle within two weeks.

Nitrate: 0
Nitrite: 0
Ammonia: 0
pH: 7.6
High Range pH: 8.2


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

I would say by now(timming and the amount of waterchanges you've done) that the TSS is no longer present in your tank.Your readings are zeros IMO because you have 5 small danios in a 55G tank and almost any inferior filter could keep that water clean.In time (your bio load is very light) you will have readings that indicate the cycle has begun,possibly you could add a few more fish you were thinking about.
Back to your fish not being happy with water changes;are you dechlorinating and getting replacement water as close to your tank temp as possible? If so don't sweat it ,if either is a no then change how you are doing waterchanges.


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

Could you possibly get filter media from a different source? Maybe set up a filter in someone else's tank. Anything to get your bacteria growing. Wish I could help more.

Hope you have a great day


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

So it has been going for 2 or 3 weeks?

Your low bio-load is hampering the process, but as long as you have the patience to endure it, it will still complete with that many fish. Back about 3.5yrs ago I cycled my 75g with only 4 Guppies and 2 Platies. The odd thing about that was when the ammonia and nitrite spikes came, they came hard (5+ ppm) and went away pretty quick. My cycle lasted 5wks.

I would hesitate in saying to add fish as it could come at you very fast once it starts. If you decide to do this I would do no more than two and keep it at that number until complete no matter what.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Thanks for your help everyone. I don't mind the cycling process taking weeks, I just wanted to be sure that it actually will complete and I'm not just spinning my wheels. I've been so busy this last week, but I've still been testing my water about every day to every other day and everything is still the same. I'll definitely post when anything changes. Thanks again!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I felt like my fish were acting funny this morning so I tested their water and it appears the Ammonia is at .25 and the nitrates are at 5.0. Nitrites are still 0. I'm guessing I need to do a water change quickly?

I did a 25% water change late Friday night (after getting yelled at by coralbandit to do so) because I had a fish acting a bit funny. My water was still at 0s before that. I also have added 5 glowlight tetras to my 5 danios because a friend is moving and she was going to flush them alive! So that brings my fish total to 10 small fish.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

As long as ammonia and nitrites are under 1ppm and your fish seem ok you don't need to change water.
Sorry if you thought I yelled at you!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Lol! It's quite ok. If ammonia is at .25ppm right now, does that mean it will go to 1ppm fairly quickly? Would it be better (and easier on myself) to do a smaller water change right now than a huge one when it gets to 1ppm or more?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Ty said:


> Lol! It's quite ok. If ammonia is at .25ppm right now, does that mean it will go to 1ppm fairly quickly? Would it be better (and easier on myself) to do a smaller water change right now than a huge one when it gets to 1ppm or more?


With the showing of nitrAtes there is a chance you could be comming to the end of cycling?I would wait and see.The additional fish may change the rate of any of the nutrients showing so keep an eye on it.If it seems to be climbing quickly then by all means do what is easiest for you.
I didn't mean to sound like I was yelling at you,I am sorry!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Alright, I'll keep an eye on it. Should I test it everyday? 

And I was just kidding about the yelling, if I thought you were serious, I would have yelled back.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

I would test daily as until you're are cycled it's about more than just the nutrients,it's about the health of your fish.


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

The best results you could hope for tomorrow would be 0 ammonia 0 nitrites and some nitrates that would tell you that your tank has cycled and you can continue to add fish slowly!!
And the Bandit yells at me too sometimes he can be a bully


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Is it possible the ammonia will just go down on it's own? I'm guessing that's the "cycle" part? Lol.


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Ty said:


> Is it possible the ammonia will just go down on it's own? I'm guessing that's the "cycle" part? Lol.


Exactly correct once you have both bacteria established in your tank they will reproduce as needed for your tank load. The reproduction of established bacteria is fairly fast but not instant that is why you should continue to stock slowly.

And please next time don't let up on the Bandit so easily lol, Tom is such a nice guy that your comment would of bothered him for awhile (when you got a fish on the hook you have to play him a little *r2*w3*r2)


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Yes,as the proper bacteria grow in the ammonia will be converted(to nitrites,and then to nitrates) without any help from you.Eventually you will only have to deal with nitrates which are far less toxic and can be kept at greater levels safely.Many feel anywhere between 20-40ppm nitrate is all good for fresh water.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

dalfed said:


> Exactly correct once you have both bacteria established in your tank they will reproduce as needed for your tank load. The reproduction of established bacteria is fairly fast but not instant that is why you should continue to stock slowly.
> 
> And please next time don't let up on the Bandit so easily lol, Tom is such a nice guy that your comment would of bothered him for awhile (when you got a fish on the hook you have to play him a little *r2*w3*r2)


BRUTAL,BUT TRUE!
I'm getting used to being called names,I must be something right?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

dalfed said:


> Exactly correct once you have both bacteria established in your tank they will reproduce as needed for your tank load. The reproduction of established bacteria is fairly fast but not instant that is why you should continue to stock slowly.
> 
> And please next time don't let up on the Bandit so easily lol, Tom is such a nice guy that your comment would of bothered him for awhile (when you got a fish on the hook you have to play him a little *r2*w3*r2)



Lol. I saw that his profile showed he was my dad's age so I was afraid of being too mean to him!


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Ty said:


> Lol. I saw that his profile showed he was my dad's age so I was afraid of being too mean to him!


roflmao thank you, thank you, thank you.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

dalfed said:


> roflmao thank you, thank you, thank you.


I thought that might do the trick


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

FYI, you may never see nitrites. If you test for ammonia and it has gone to 0 and nitrites never showed anything, then more than likely the cycle has completed.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

jrman83 said:


> FYI, you may never see nitrites. If you test for ammonia and it has gone to 0 and nitrites never showed anything, then more than likely the cycle has completed.


Great, thanks! Let's hope this is the case.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Hopefully my tank is about cycled, so I have a few more questions. 

I've read that when many of you do water changes, you say that you wipe down the inside of the tank at the same time. What are you wiping it with?

Also, from what I've read, my recommended pH is 6.0 to 7.5. The pH of my tank shows up a bit darker than the blue for 7.6 and when I do the High Range pH test, it shows 8.2. I don't understand the difference in the two tests but isn't my pH a bit high? I tested my tap water after leaving it in a glass for 24 hours and it is the same.

Last question (for now)...I read my temperature should be 75 to 78 degrees and mine is 82. I'm cheap so I keep the thermostat in my house at 78 and the 82 is "room temperature" apparently because I'm not using a heater right now. Is this too warm?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Don't sweat your ph.If the fish have been acclimated properly they will be fine.It is better to get them used to the water you have then try to adjust it.
as for glass cleaning I use mag floats Amazon.com: Gulfstream Tropical AGU030SM Mag-Float Glass Aquarium Cleaner, Small: Pet Supplies
Don't get sand or gravel caught inbetween it and glass or you'll scratch your glass.Check your glass thickness as this how they size them or just get medium as they handle everything up to the big boys!
The temp is a little high but if the fish don't seem stressed than don't sweat that either.A fan blowing across the surface(causing evaporation) will be the best thing and most consistent.Some freeze 1 gallon jugs and float them to lower temp but be careful if you choose this not to swing temp up and down alot.Sure fire way to get ich.
AS OLD AS YOUR DAD!I'M FEELING PRETTY OLD LATELY(PROBLY THE HEAT?)ha!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

The guy I bought the aquarium from had a magnetic thing similar to that but the part that goes inside the tank doesn't float....So it is a bit of pain when you go to take it out or go around a corner, considering to stick my arm into the bottom of my tank, I have water up to my shoulder. I'll have to look into the floating one.

I haven't drip acclimated any of the fish, but I go very slow with floating the bag in the tank and slowly switching their water with mine before dipping them out and putting them into my tank. Both times, they all seemed a bit scared for a bit but then start acting fine within an hour. Maybe I should start the drip acclimation thing just in case (I saw a post on here about it that I think I can pull off).

My dad was born in 1965...I'm 25 and married with a 3 year old daughter and another on the way....NOT to make you feel old or anything.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

The magnet thing you got may have a "eye hole" for a string so you don't have to reach in when it falls.They were the first before the mag floats.
My son is 22 so There is no denying where I'm at.But I'm in pretty good shape ,for the shape I'm in!
BEAST OF THE EAST!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Ooooh, it does.  I didn't think of that....

You'll have to stay in shape...You'll have grandkids to chase around before you know it!


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

I ain't chasing nothing!I got 5 dogs and even they chase me!They catch me ,but I'm almost 50,maybe not faster,PROBLY SMARTER!
Enjoy and good luck with the kids!
It's kind of sad I'm old enough to know what that stupid little thing on the end is for!
The string may slow it down a little in the water so just don't go flying with the thing and you should be fine(sound like your dad now?).


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Haha! The more I look at that thing now, the dumber I feel for not thinking of what it was for! It kind of has a rust color around the edges of the plastic on the part that goes in the tank. I scrubbed it with a tooth brush and it doesn't come off. The felt also looks dark like there is rust behind it. Will this hurt my fish? If so, I'll just wait until I buy a new one.

I'm a serious clean freak...I keep my water line above the black trim so you don't see any of the glass because that bugs me. So it isn't noticeably dirty or anything, but I would prefer it didn't get that way either.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Just don't leave it in the tank and the short time it is in there will have no effect.All metals rust(except copper{and other non ferrous}) so I wouldn't worry about it unless you leave it in tank.
The part that goes in tank should be like the hard part of velcro.The part on the outside could have new felt peel and stick pad put on it.They have all been exposed to water so their appearance is normal wear and tear.Use it until you want the mag float,the mags are pretty cool,but they float away to middle of tank(or wherever the current takes them)when they break away.
YOU KIDS NOW A DAYS!


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Both sides are green felt stuff. Like softer that the SOFT part of Velcro. If I get one that is like the rough part of Velcro, is that not going to scratch my glass? Because that would really bug me....I'm kind of a freak perfectionist...


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

No it won't scratch your glass,they even make different models for acrylic.As long as one has the eye hole that is the one that goes in the water.Go slow and see how it works.If you question or worry get new.
I really can't stand scratches on my glass(kept tanks for 30+ years) and have scratched more than 1(I have 20 tanks now),but my 180(main DT 4 years old) only has to 2 small scratches(got to watch moving rocks and stuff around to)!


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## silvergourami1 (Jun 20, 2013)

A true healthy cycling is a fishless-cycling that will take about 2 weeks minimum. This is so the bacteria can propagate and all the substrate and plants can acclimate perfectly into the environment. 

Some say less time and a quick slow injection of flora and fauna is more than adequate. However your filter, the plant system and even the substrate is not "tuned" yet and created that established ecological equilibrium that will maintain a healthy balance.

If at all add a couple small fish to generate "fish feces", but nothing more. 

"My two cents!"


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I just tested the ammonia and it is either .25 or .5 ppm. I'm terrible with this color thing. It's definitely not 0 though. So I still just wait? Should I test the nitrites and nitrates again also?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I had a spare minute so I tested the nitrates and nitrites again also. Nitrites are 0 and nitrates are 5.0...I guess. The color definitely has an orange tint to it but I don't feel like it is quite as dark as the 5.0 ppm on the color card.

Gosh, these colors drive me crazy. I have such a hard time deciding which one I think it matches.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I would not worry about nitrates, except maybe a once per week test just prior to your water change. Let it be the guide that tells you how much water you need to change. The amount of water changed should be close to equal how much your lowered your result (ex 60ppm - 50% (water and nitrates) = 30ppm). Or, you can do like many of us and set to a % that you know will always take care of everything, no matter what (ex 40-50%). This method requires zero testing.

Hard to say where your cycle is at, although sort of appears on its way out. Did you ever get more fish?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I started with 5 zebra danios for a few weeks then last week, I got 5 glowlight tetras in order to keep them from being flushed by a friend who was going through a move.

So my plan for now is to continue to check the ammonia and nitrites daily in the hopes my cycle finishes soon...in which I will show 0 ammonia and nitrites...Correct?

I'm getting so impatient. I'm terrified the ammonia is going to go crazy and hurt my fish.


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

The great thing about having a 55 gallon rather then say a ten gallon is the room for error. With those 10 small fish nothing is going to explode problem wise.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Good, that puts my mind at ease a bit.

But I just checked my ammonia and I feel like it is at .5 today....Doesn't seem to be going down. I still just wait until it goes above 1ppm right?


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Correct


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

So my ammonia is still at .5 ppm. 

My husband noticed it a while back but I guess I've been so concerned with watching the fish and testing the water, I haven't noticed...On the strainer thing of my filter and on my decorations, there is this brown stuff growing. Is this bad?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Sounds like diatoms and is very common in new tanks. It should go away over time.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

1^ with Ben.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

This morning, the ammonia looked close enough to 1 ppm that it scared me so I did a water change. It's been a week since my last water change any how.

I changed about 50% of the water and now the ammonia looks to be at .5 ppm. Should I leave it and continue to test it every day in the hopes the ammonia will start going down?

When I started showing ammonia I got excited that the cycle was about finished....now it's stressing me out. I feel like it's never going to be cycled.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Keep testing daily,but wait to see how fast the ammonia climbs.It always seems like forever(watched pots never boil),but you will cycle.Don't stress as you're doing it right changing at 1ppm and your reading was probly correct since 50% should have cut ammonia(and everything else) in half(.5ppm).


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I did a water change Saturday and I feel like my ammonia is getting awfully close to 1 ppm already. Again, I'm terrible at deciding between these colors...my husband thinks it is at 1 ppm now. But I sort of think it isn't quite 1, but getting a bit darker than .5. Either way, it will probably be at 1 ppm within the next day or so.

Isn't this kind of fast?


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Not in my opinion. I have been at 1ppm, did the water change to get down to about .5ppm, went to bed and got up and tested and it was at 4ppm.

I'm surprised it doesn't get back to 1ppm everyday. Even that doesn't seem too terrible.

I also wouldn't sweat "exactly" 1ppm. If it shows more than 1ppm but not that far off you could wait and see if it goes higher. Plus, my change point is when it gets above 1ppm. I've never had trouble with letting it stay at 1ppm.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

So if I continue to do water changes when the ammonia gets above 1 ppm...How long does it usually take for the bacteria to build up, completely cycle the tank, and show 0 ammonia?

I guess I'm trying to make sure I'm still on my way to a cycled tank...that I haven't messed something up.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Different for every tank.

Have you started testing for nitrites yet? When ammonia starts to drop that will be an indication you have moved to a different phase. The bacteria processing the ammonia usually drives up your nitrites. Once that starts going down you are nearly finished.

Most fish cycles take 6-8wks.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I just checked...This is the start of week 6, so hopefully I'm on the home stretch. I just have another quick question...

When doing water changes, should I be vacuuming the gravel or just syphoning the water?


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## dalfed (Apr 8, 2012)

Ty said:


> I just checked...This is the start of week 6, so hopefully I'm on the home stretch. I just have another quick question...
> 
> When doing water changes, should I be vacuuming the gravel or just syphoning the water?


For now just syphon the water, vacuuming will remove some bacteria and while cycling you do not want to disturb this at all.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Go planted and never have to worry about vacuuming anything ever again.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I've thought about plants, but I've only been to Petco and I think the few plants they have are ugly. We have a fish store I found out about recently that I need to go look at to see what they have. Also, I can barely keep my landscaping outside alive....not sure how I'd do with aquarium plants. I don't want to have to get new lights or anything either.

If I could find some plants that I could just put in and hope for the best, I'd try it. Not sure I could go without vacuuming though because I can tell there is nasty stuff in the rocks and it bugs me. I did a water change this morning (actually, I watched my husband do it) and I told him not to vacuum the gravel and it bugged me so bad because I know there is fish poop in it and I want to vacuum it out. I'm kind of a clean freak.

On a second note...The ammonia was getting a little dark for 1 ppm so I decided to go ahead and do a water change this morning because I need my husbands helps to carry the buckets (we need a new system, I know) and I didn't want to take a chance in it getting even higher before he got off work. We changed 30 gallons and it looks like the ammonia is at .25 ppm now. Sooooo, I'll continue to keep an eye on it.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Annacharis ,hornwort and java fern are easy low light plants that grow well with minimal maintenance.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

coralbandit said:


> Annacharis ,hornwort and java fern are easy low light plants that grow well with minimal maintenance.


Alright, I'll write those down and see what I can find! Thanks so much!

I just looked them up, I'll have to go with the java fern...I do not like the looks of the other two. Do I just put their roots under the rocks and let them go? Are they going to make my water cloudy? I don't like the looks of cloudy water....


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

The java fern grows above the substrate.Keeping the rhizome above substrate is most important for them.The can be tied to drift wood or rocks.My LFS gets driftwood with java ferns on them every now and then.They are the best as you get wood and plants for decent price and they are already attached.The hornwort can be messy as the needle like leaves fall off and go all over the place or clog filter intake.The anacharis is not that bad and super cheap/easy.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I had to run some errands so I ran by Petco to see what they had. I found some anacharis and they weren't too bad. But how do you plant them? They didn't really have roots, they had them in a bundle with like a small piece of paper towel or something wrapped around the end. They had them laid in an aquarium, floating on the top.










I also found another plant that was like a sword type plant but it was in a tube and it didn't say what it was, but I liked the looks of it.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

the anacharis can be just stuck in the gravel(take paper towel off and seperate stems).It can also float freely and may eventually do so.It will grow roots from anywhere on the stem(not just bottom).
The other plant I don't know,but if it is a sword than just plant it in the gravel(remove whatever is around the bottom.)
A word of caution on petco plants;The anacharis is good,but many of the plants they sell(especially the one in the tubes) are not "true aquatics".Plants go through acclimation that can take weeks,and leaves dying or turning brown are not the end of the world,as the best way to judge is new growth(new leaves not the old ones).


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Will my (getting somewhat annoying) ammonia level kill the anacharis? I think that sword plant was like $6, if it is most likely going to die, I don't want to waste the money.

They didn't have prices on the anacharis, I just happened to see them floating on the top before I walked off. I read they are usually a couple dollars? I don't want them to try charging me $10 for a $3 plant.

Also, with the anacharis, do I put each individual piece in a different spot or can I plant it in a bundle about half the size of the bundle in the picture?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I just decided to go ahead and test nitrites and nitrates because I haven't in a while. Nitrite is 0, nitrate is more orange than 0, but not 5. I checked the ammonia again for the heck of it (was .25 this morning) and it is back up to .5 ppm! At this rate, I'm going to be changing water every two days. *Trying to be patient*


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Plant the plants as you like.They do fine individually or in groups.The "sword" plant does look like a sword plant from firtst pic(a true aquatic).The anacharis should have been pretty cheap(simple plant{the kind I'm good with}).
The plants will actually feed on your ammonia,nitrite and nitrates ,so have no fear of water quality effecting them.


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

The one in the tube, on the other side of it, it should say if it is semi-aquatic or fully aquatic and what kind of sword it is.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

If the plant has lighter colored edges on the leaves than the rest of the leaf (plant in the tube) the plant is a ribbon plant and not a true aquatic. Hard to tell from the pic. If fully submerged will eventually rot. It is semi-aquatic.

I never could get Anacharis to stay planted in my substrate. The roots that it grows are not enough to hold it like many stem plants. Anacharis roots are especially weak. I think most people just let it float. Interestingly enough, down at the river where I fish most of it is floating in bundles.


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

I have the same plant you have in the tube. Planted it in the gravel, but kept all the green of the plant above the gravel. It has grown rather well. For some reason I thought I would try the fertilizer tabs. This plant really took off. Getting fuller and greener by the day. Hang in there and don't let the ammonia stress you so much. It will all happen in it's own time. 

Hope you have a blessed day


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

jrman83 said:


> If the plant has lighter colored edges on the leaves than the rest of the leaf (plant in the tube) the plant is a ribbon plant and not a true aquatic. Hard to tell from the pic. If fully submerged will eventually rot. It is semi-aquatic.
> 
> I never could get Anacharis to stay planted in my substrate. The roots that it grows are not enough to hold it like many stem plants. Anacharis roots are especially weak. I think most people just let it float. Interestingly enough, down at the river where I fish most of it is floating in bundles.


I don't think I can handle the chaotic look of plants just floating every where. I think I'll get a bundle, try to plant it, and see what happens. If it works out, I'll get more.

The only information the plant in the tube had was that it was called AquaPlant or something and it said it was a "terrarium" plant, so I would imagine it isn't a true aquatic...not sure if I'll give it a try or not. If it dies, will it hurt anything? Other than the plant of course.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Well, I guess we'll see how it goes.......


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## jamnigh (Apr 24, 2013)

If it says its a terrarium plant then it would not be fully aquatic. It will die, and in doing so, if you don't pull it right away, it will rot and could cause your levels to get wacky (possibly screw up the cycle but I am not sure there)


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

The rotting would probably take quite a while. Some report growth in their tanks, but it eventually the plant will die if kept completely submerged. It is inevitable.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I think I may be nearing the finish line..... I checked the ammonia this morning and it looked awfully close to 0 ppm (was previously .25). So I just tested everything and the ammonia is definitely 0 ppm, nitrites are at 0 ppm, and nitrates look about like 5 ppm (it doesn't look quite orange enough to me to be right at 5 ppm).

I would say that I believe the cycle is complete, but shouldn't the nitrates be higher? I did a 50% water change Sunday.


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Congrats on all your hard work.Most would think nitrates should be higher,but all that really matters is 0 ammonia and nitrites.You changed alot of water almost constantly throughout your fish in cycle so I'll geuss your home now!
Enjoy and test regulary just to be sure.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

So I am clear for more fish? I guess my plan is to have a community tank of smaller fish, like about the size of my danios. I know I shouldn't add too many at once, so is about 5 small fish a week fine? Until I get the number I want, or wait two weeks?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

You can probly add 5 fish ,but keep testing to make sure your filter is growing with the load.If it spikes(mini cycle) just wait it out and/or change water as necessary.Watch your feeding(with new fish),make sure you get healthy appearing fish with no sick or dead tankmates,and keep track of the levels.The filter needs to grow with the fish population so you may see some ammonia,or nitrites show back up,hopefully not.
As far as how often you can add more (1 week or 2) let your test levels be the guide as how fast your filter grows is unpredictable.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Glad its finally over for you. Now it's just maintaining a healthy bio filter in your tank.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Thanks!! My husband and I have come up with a much easier water change method than buckets so I'm pretty excited about that. It makes water changes fun instead of dreadful.

I tried adding fish last night but had some issues and had to return them. Although I did keep two guppies. Tested 30 minutes ago and ammonia still looks to be 0 ppm.

Now I'm being a crazy fish lady and looking into a couple smaller tanks. I have a newborn coming in a month....I need to just quit, but I'm addicted. Lol!


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

Congratulations on the upcoming new addition. Wishing you and baby a safe and happy delivery. 

Have a blessed day


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I'm looking to get a 10 gallon tank as kind of a quarantine tank. I know a 10 gallon is small (it's all I have room for at the moment), it will just simply be for a sick fish, bringing new fish home, or any other issue I may encounter.

It will just run empty in the mean time. I want to do a fishless cycle on it...I've read a ton of information, including the fishless cycle thread here. So I feel like I can tackle this, however... I was wondering if there was a different method I should do since I have a cycled tank already? Or is the ammonia dosing the best route to take regardless?


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## SeanMcC (Jul 5, 2013)

One way to do it that I have done in the past is that if you have an established tank, get a sponge bubble filter and place it in your main tank for a few weeks... then put it in your hospital tank when you are about to bring in new fish. If you leave the bottom bare, the sponge should have enough bacteria to handle a fish or two and once you are done, clean the heck out of the filter and put it back in the main tank for next time. Back years ago I did this and it worked really well.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

This diatom issue is not going away yet...All of my gravel has brown on it now and it's driving me crazy. Is there anything I can do? It was all over my filter and since it's black, it looked terrible so I wiped it off. It was also all over the glass in the back (I have a black background) and that looked terrible so I wiped that off also. I don't know if wiping it off is bad but it seriously looks like I don't clean anything....which is probably why it annoys me so badly.

Also, I'm afraid to vacuum my gravel during water changes because I don't want to get rid of any beneficial bacteria and end up causing a problem. However, I would feel like my tank was cleaner if I vacuumed it...So is it okay to do now?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Vacumm away!Your filter houses most beneficial bacteria so just don't mess with filter.If filter needs "rinsing" then "clean it"(rinse & ring) in the bucket of tank water you remove.
If it is brown it is diatoms and really should exhaust its food supply and die,BUT if it is BBA(black beard algae) then that is a whole different game!Was what you wiped off "slimmy"?


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Well I wasn't really interested in playing with the stuff when I wiped it off  Lol (jk). I just touched a spot on the filter and no, it doesn't really seem slimy.

There is nasty stuff on my clear air tubes and that stuff seems slimy.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I have a question about my 10 gallon that I started fishless cycling today with ammonia. I just put 1/2 tsp ammonia in and it is at 4 ppm. On the Fishless Cycle thread, it says after this to stop testing for ammonia, just dose it every day at the same time. Am I supposed to dose the same amount as the original dose (1/2 tsp)? Then after 5 days, start testing nitrites...?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Correct!Don't even bother testing for ammonia.just test for nitrates in 4-5 days.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

I got a 5 gallon for a betta... I'm currently treating my 55 gallon for ich and my 10 gallon isn't cycled yet. If the filter for the 5 gallon doesn't have any carbon in it, is it ok to put it in my 55 gallon for a few weeks to cycle it? I didn't know if the ich medication would hurt it if there was no carbon.

Also, should 2 weeks be long enough to leave the filter in a cycled tank?


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

I don't believe it would be wise to put the filter into an infected tank. At least not until the ich is gone for a couple weeks. How are you treating the ich? I used something called kordon, but it didn't help, so I went back to the tried and true salt and heat method. Maybe some of the others that are better versed in these things will chime in. How are you coming along with your pregnancy. Still praying for a safe delivery for you.

have a blessed day


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

It is okay to put it in your 55g, but I would wait until the ich issues have been cleared.


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## Ty (Jun 21, 2013)

Thanks!

Thanks for your prayers also. I feel like I'm about to pop....any day now.


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## vreugy (May 1, 2013)

I think I am as anxious for you to have the baby as if I were your mother. Keep us posted.

Have a blessed day


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