# Advice for starting a tank with live plants



## Deng09 (Apr 28, 2012)

So I have a completely empty 55 gallon aquarium right now that I plan on making a cichlid tank with live plants. I know, most people say it is hard/impossible to keep cichlids with live plants, but I have found a few different live plants that people say will be ok with cichlids. A few examples are amazon swords, java ferns, anubias, and a few others. 

I dont plan on having it super heavily planted, just enough to make it look more natural than using fake plants. My question is whether I should use a specific plant substrate like eco-complete for this type of set up. I have also never done live plants before, so what type of maintenance will I have to do to keep these types of plants alive?


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Most cichlids prefer a sand substrate, most will tolerate some plants but not all. With swords, I would put root tabs under the substrate near the plant roots. Then build some rockwork around it but leaving some space for it to grow. Anubia and ferns do well tied onto rock and in crevices and can benefit from some liquid dosing once in awhile.


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## BBradbury (Apr 22, 2011)

Hello Den...

You can have a nicely planted tank with more destructive type fish. You just need really tough plants. The taller Amazon swords, Java fern, Peace lily, some Anubias varieties and the Onion plant are some good choices. Do some research on them.

B


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## Deng09 (Apr 28, 2012)

Thanks for the ideas guys!

As far as the sand goes, will there be any problems for the plants growing in sand? I have read that sand gets too compacted for plants? Also harmful gases getting trapped in the sand?


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## denson (Jun 5, 2012)

According to me, there are following steps, which you can use for starting a tank with live plants-:

1.Find a place to put the tank
2.Put a thick bed of eco-complete on the bottom of the tank
3.Next put a 2-3 inch layer of fine gravel OR sand over the eco-complete and peat
4.Gently remove the plants from the containers they came in
5.Place the plant in the substrate
6.Make sure to cover all the roots of the plant
7.Install the filter and the heater and put the hood on the tank
8.Set up the Co2 system if you want to use


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I would skip the Eco part. I hear there is bad info out there that Eco will provide enough nutrients to do away with the need for fertilization....depending on light of course. It offers very little and is mostly inert. If you place a plant that has a lot of roots don't try to plant them all. Cut the roots to about 1 inch and then plant. Trying to plant them all will just result in damaged roots.


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## Hawk1018 (Apr 12, 2012)

good tip about the roots jrman...would make them a lot easier to plant as well.


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

If possible, try setting up the tank and plants well before adding the cichlids. If the plants are given time to settle and take root before the cichlids start ripping on them they'll have a higher survival rate. Putting rocks around the base to further anchor it down is a good idea too for the non-driftwood/rock clinger plants. Anything that clings to the rocks/driftwood like Anubias is going to be tougher to kill as well since the only way to kill it once it takes root is to rip off all the leaves (still doable, but harder).


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## Chandavi (Jun 12, 2012)

You can also consider fast-growing floating plants like hornwort and duckweed. If the plant grows faster than your chichlids can tear them up, you will end up with a sustainable system. You would have to clean out the dead plant matter, of course, but this is a fact of life when keeping live plants. Floating plants are also easier to keep because you don't need to re-plant them if they become uprooted. Not to say you shouldn't use any substrate plants, but a mix could save you some trouble. Floating plants are also notoriously good oxygenators and waste-consumers.


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## Deng09 (Apr 28, 2012)

Thanks for all the help guys, a few more questions now. 

I have had the tank running for a few weeks.The tank is 55 gallons, and I have 9 cichlids about 1-1.5 inches in length each. I started with 2 java ferns, 2 jungle val, 3 corkscrew val, 1 apongeton crispus, 1 amazon sword, 1 anubias barteris, and 1 anubias congensis. I am using the eco complete substrate. So far there has been no eating of the plants by the cichlids, but I have noticed them skimming the surfaces of the rocks and plant leaves with their mouths, apparently eating the algae?

Anyway, my first question is what type of fertilizer would you guys recommend, and how often to use it? 

Also, I know anubias and java ferns are supposed to be attached to drift wood/rocks. I have all of mine planted in the substrate right now. The java ferns look basically exactly the same as when I first purchased them, but both anubias' have grown a couple new leaves each. How important is it that I eventually take them out of the ground? Is it bad for the growth of the plants?

Also, if I wanted to find my own piece of driftwood outside, how would I go about sterilizing it before putting it in my tank? 

One of the corkscrews sent off a shoot which is now slowly growing, probably only a half inch tall right now. The rest of the jungle and corkscrew val is not doing so great, with most of the taller leaves melting off. I'm guessing because I cycled the tank with some giant tinfoil barbs which swam very violently and constantly uprooted those plants for the first 10 days or so? Or maybe I should have added some ferts already? 

Any help you guys can give me would be greatly appreciated!!


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## Samuel Stone (Jul 4, 2012)

So excited!


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## BBradbury (Apr 22, 2011)

Deng09 said:


> Thanks for all the help guys, a few more questions now.
> 
> I have had the tank running for a few weeks.The tank is 55 gallons, and I have 9 cichlids about 1-1.5 inches in length each. I started with 2 java ferns, 2 jungle val, 3 corkscrew val, 1 apongeton crispus, 1 amazon sword, 1 anubias barteris, and 1 anubias congensis. I am using the eco complete substrate. So far there has been no eating of the plants by the cichlids, but I have noticed them skimming the surfaces of the rocks and plant leaves with their mouths, apparently eating the algae?
> 
> ...


Hello D...

Good luck sifting through all the different answers you'll get, but you'll get them from experienced people.

I use hydroponics liquid ferts, dosed once a week when I do my water change. It's just a source of the "trace elements", most of the bulk ferts are from the fish, so I don't worry about those.

Anubias and Java fern are generally slow growers. I just plant the roots of the Anubias in the gravel and it grows fine. Java fern, I attach to floating driftwood or lava rock with black sewing thread.

I've never had good luck with Vallisneria. I have harder water and understand this plant likes a neutral pH or a bit more acidic water. 

Driftwood is nice. I find my pieces locally. I just rinse them off and leave them out in the sun for a few hours and they're tank ready. The commercial kind will sometimes leak tannic acid into the tank water and turn it an amber color. If you have light sensitive plants this might create a problem. A couple of large water changes will clear it.

Hopefully, I covered everything. If not, someone else surely will.

B


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## Cadiedid (Oct 26, 2011)

As far as substrate goes, I agree with Susan on the sand suggestion. I would avoid anything that is going to cause murkiness when agitated, such as Flourite. Almost all cichlids like to move substrate around. Because of this, I don't think a layered substrate is going to work. If you use a slightly coarse sand or very fine gravel, you should have no problem with compacting sand, and it will still be small enough for the cichlids to move around. 

If you have just the roots of the anubias buried, it may be okay, but in general I find that mine does best when rooted on a piece of driftwood. It will do okay tied to a rock, but I find that it really sinks its roots into wood. The same goes for java fern. Also, in one of my tanks I have java fern attached to rocks and wood and the growth of the one on the wood is incredible as compared to that of the ones on rocks. Either plant may die if buried in substrate too long. Also, one of the ways cichlids cause plant damage is uprooting them because they like to dig and sift through the substrate (which is why they love sand) and having most of your plants attached to items in the tank circumvents this problem. 

I haven't tried vals with my cichlid yet, but in the tank I do have them in, they looked great for a couple days, then every leaf melted. A few days later they began sending up new leaves though, and grew back nicely and quickly. I have very hard water, so I think it was a combination of new water parameters and recovery from transplantation.

I'll leave the fert info for others. I'm a newb at creating the right balance of ferts...

As for the driftwood, I have only used purchased Malaysian driftwood so far, so I do not speak from experience, but most of what I have read online suggests boiling "found" driftwood if possible. It's best if you know what kind of wood you are working with. Many hardwoods are fine. Pine and other sappy woods are not. 

Did you mention what type of cichlids you have? African? South American?


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

I would take a look at the link in my signature.

my .02


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## BBradbury (Apr 22, 2011)

beaslbob said:


> I would take a look at the link in my signature.
> 
> my .02


Hello bob...

Will see if I can squeeze this post into this thread. Maybe should be a PM, but here goes. Hopefully, it will fly, because we're discussing aquarium plants. Technically, the "Chinese Evergreen" is a land plant, but emersing it will help maintain a stable water chemistry without water changes, if that's your aim.

I've been showing the attached pic of a "biotope" tank with a little interest from others. But, this 45 G is pretty self sufficient. Aside from removing and replacing a couple of gallons a week to rinse the standard filter media, the emersed plants remove the bulk of the water pollutants and the standard filtration works at night, when the plants rest. I suppose for your purposes, you omit the mechanical filtration.

Without putting too much information out here, this would be a good plant for anyone interested in keeping the water changes to a minimum. I change out less than a 5 gallon bucket of water per week and the fish are fine. The tank has been running with the land plants for about six weeks, give or take some days. I tested the water a couple of weeks ago, and ammonia and nitrites were "0" and nitrates were at 10 ppm.

B


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

And I thought suggestions from experienced people is what the OP wanted? I would be glad that we didn't all have the same response, if I was the OP.


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