# 5 year old goldfish sitting on tank bottom?



## jenneelk (Oct 11, 2011)

My son's goldfish 'Dorothy' is 5 years and 9 in. long, she's never had any problems but yesterday we realized she had been jumping out of the tank more often then normal. Then we saw her just sitting on the bottom which she's never done before. At midnight I did a good water change like usual and added aquarium salt. She is in a 30 or 35 gallon tank, I can't recall which as we've sized up many times as she's grown. There is nothing on her at all and she looks healthy, it's just her behavior. Also she won't eat.
Is it likely just that there was a water issue and she can come out of this? Or maybe the tank is now too small again? 
Any help is appreciated. My son got her at age 3 and he's almost 9 so h'es quite attached and afraid of her dying. Not to mention she's like family to the rest of us.

Thank You,
Jennifer


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

Sometimes bad water quality will cause a fish to jump. Something could have caused an ammonia spike or nitrates can build up in older aquariums. At first glance it sounds like you have a suitable tank and have been doing the basics right. Some more specific questions would be: Have you tested for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates? Do you have a good filter? Also how much and how often on the water changes?


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## jenneelk (Oct 11, 2011)

Surprisingly I don't do test strips (used to when I had tropical fish) only because there hasn't been a need and she has done well the past 5 years until now. I will go out today and get some though. 
Water changes aren't as often as they probably should be but again, she has grown well and thrived so IMO I didn't need to do them as often. When I do do the changes I do complete changes where I drop the level to just above her body and refill, then drop to 25% full and refill, then 50% and refill again so I really get it good and clean, including suction on the rocks. 
The filter is descent I think (penguin bio-wheel 200), it's about 7 years old but I change out the cartridges often. It seems to run fine, just noisy.
Thanks for your help.


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## snail (Aug 6, 2010)

The liquid test kits are supposed to be much better than the strips. Most people recommend against water changes of more than 50% at one time as it can be stressful on the fish.


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## glassbird (Feb 2, 2011)

First, do not waste your money on strips. They are inaccurate, and expensive. Get a Master API kit. Much more economical in the long run, and it will give you accurate results that can really be of use.

Second, regular water changes are essential to healthy fish. Fish can "seem" fine, but not be healthy. Goldfish are hardy little critters, but years of poor water quality WILL shorten a fish's life, and keep them uncomfortable...even if it is not obvious to your eye. Doing occaisional massive changes are also stressfull. Big swings in water parameters are never a good thing.

And thirdly, changing the cartridge in your filter is not really the best way to go. The manufacturers will tell you to throw out the old cartridge after a certain number of weeks and put in a new one, but they only tell you to do this so that you have to buy more cartridges from them. Most of the beneficial bacteria in your tank is in the old filter cartridge...when you throw it out the tank (and your fish) has to go thru another mini-cycle (which involves increased ammonia in the water), and this is yet another source of stress for your fish. 

The better way to do this is to swish and squish your old cartridge in dirty tank water removed during a water change. This will get the surface crud out of the cartridge, but leave plenty of good bacteria to remove the ammonia. Then pop the cartridge back in. Do not throw out a cartridge until it is falling apart.

I think getting solid test results will be a good start toward finding out what is wrong with your fish, but better tank maintanance will go a long way toward giving him a healthier and happier life.


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## jenneelk (Oct 11, 2011)

Thank you for all the great help! 
I clean off the cartridges about every few weeks and throw them away about every 2-3 months or so. They are pretty gross and don't clean up well at that point but should I wait even longer? 
I was told today that it's pointless to even test the water since I just did a water change.  They said it takes a month for the chemicals to find a balance and the readings will change daily so don't even bother trying to test since it will be inaccurate. I did do one anyways and the PH was a bit high along with the alkalinity.. but the nitrates and nitrites were fine. The strips were used but only because they were actually out of the liquid ones they said were good. I'll go back for those later if my poor fish makes it. She is moving better but still sits too often and hasn't eaten in 2.5 days now. I was told it could just be her age. 
If she is ok I'll be sure to do changes more often and I purchased a better hose for cleaning that will make it much easier for me.
Thanks again.
Jennifer


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

I don't think its age as goldfish will live up to 15 to 20 years, depending on the care and such.

You should test your water at least once a week for awhile and do your water change after. What kind of water conditioner do you use?

I have done 90% water changes on my tanks a lot, but the tanks are used to it and done on weekly basis. Until your goldi gets used to more water changes I wouldn't change more than 30% a week along with vacumning. 

I have filters that the cartridges hasn't been changed out over a year and still going good. You really don't need to clean them but maybe once a month unless they are restricting water flow. Some filters I have gotten rid of the cartridges and just use sponges in them, easier to clean, as you can squeeze them out pretty good.


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## glassbird (Feb 2, 2011)

jenneelk said:


> Thank you for all the great help!
> I clean off the cartridges about every few weeks and throw them away about every 2-3 months or so. They are pretty gross and don't clean up well at that point but should I wait even longer? This sounds like an ok schedule. From your original post, I thought you were tossing them more often. When you say you clean them, does that mean that you clean them in old tank water, or with water from the sink? Sink water usually contains chlorine, which will kill off a large portion of the beneficial bacteria.
> I was told today that it's pointless to even test the water since I just did a water change.Ugh...I hate hearing this type of advice. Yes, testing the water after a water change will not tell you what the results might have been BEFORE the water change, but it will tell you what it is right now....and that is just as important because the fish is in the water now.  They said it takes a month for the chemicals to find a balance and the readings will change daily so don't even bother trying to test since it will be inaccurate. Aaargh! Please! Info about the enviroment where the fish is right now is VERY important! Why would a correctly run test not be accurate? This is nuts! I did do one anyways and the PH was a bit high along with the alkalinity.. but the nitrates and nitrites were fine. The strips were used but only because they were actually out of the liquid ones they said were good. I would really like to see accurate results. Strips are about as accurate as guessing.I'll go back for those later if my poor fish makes it. She is moving better but still sits too often and hasn't eaten in 2.5 days now. I was told it could just be her age. Age is not a disease. Goldfish can live much longer than 5 years, but only if the water is good.
> If she is ok I'll be sure to do changes more often and I purchased a better hose for cleaning that will make it much easier for me.
> ...


My additions are in red above...


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## jenneelk (Oct 11, 2011)

I use Aquasafe conditioner. 
The cartridges are rinsed in tap water then dipped in a water bowl with conditioner in it. 
I retested the water and the Ph was around 7.0-7.5, Alkalinity was 120-180 couldn't say for certain which, hardness was 150, Nitrite is 0 and Nitrate was 20.
Fish is still at the bottom and not eating... about 3 days now.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

When you rinse the filter pads in tap water you are loosing most of your beneficial bacteria and causing your tank to mini cycle each time, unless you are washing everything in the tank then your are going thru a regular cycle. Do not rinse your filter pads in tap. Put some tank water in a bucket and use that or put tap water in a bucket and add dechlorinator then rinse.


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## jenneelk (Oct 11, 2011)

Ok I think it might be ich? I don't know much about this but noticed today she has some spots on her head and tail edge? Also her belly has red on it which I've not seen before. 
Any thoughts?
Sorry for the bad pics but it's as good as I could get.


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