# Algae, water quality, planting



## CynthiaCA (Feb 22, 2011)

Hello,

I'm new to the forum and have introduced myself on that section and just posted questions about possible canister filter purchase in the General Freshwater section (any thoughts, PLEASE pop in there).

My problem has been keeping plants alive and not ravaged by algae in this 50gal tank and keeping the water quality excellent. Particulars are:

50gal bow-front tank. Whisper60 filter. ViaAqua underwater heater. The substrate is 3" of Eco-complete. I have a two large pieces of Malaysian driftwood (6 yrs old now, long-ago uber boiled to remove tanins) and several pieces of quarry rock (caves, hiding ledges). I have had hundreds of dollars worth of plants in this thing and only the Anubias nana is able to withstand the algae.

I know I have some dirty fish (described in my signature) but have tried to compensate for this by keep the Whisper60 filters changed weekly, removing 10gals of water weekly and feeding in a very regulated way (to follow). 

*Our cabin is kept quite cold (50degrees). I have a ViaAqua heater which is placed just above the substrate in the back left with its sensor just above the substrate in the left front. With the filter actively moving water in the back right section I am able to keep it set so that the thermometer on the heater side reads 80 while the water falls to 76 on the opposite side. 

*Part of living this extremely rurally is the luxury of uncovered windows. While the tank is not in front of a window, this is a 600sq' cabin, the tank gets indirect light anytime the sun is shining. I compensate for this indirect light by only turning on the full-spectrum lite for a few hours each night for my viewing pleasure, longer on dark winter days if I am in the cabin. 

I have well water here. It is tested yearly and we are blessed to be on the very most top portion of a ridge and thus get no run-off concentrations. Still we do filter our water and the test of a glass of filtered water which has sat for 24 hrs (as I would for a water change) is:

pH: 7.6 KH: 400 No chlorine GH: 400 Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: 20

I tried everything to bring water levels closer to fine and then met a zoo aquarium vet who said: "Start with what you do have or can naturally get and don't keep trying to add chemicals" A good answer and one I should have thought of first as I am an organic farmer...duh. So until I can afford a full-house RO I now go into town and get 10 gals of RO ($3 so pretty cheap) every week. I am about to change the tank so here are the current tank readings, one week after the last change:

pH: 7.2 KH: 80 no chlorine GH: 150 Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: 80

I try to keep feeding simple. To recap: 1-5" Golden Dojo Loach with her two 4" mates; 1-5" Black Ghost Knife (who is NOT happy in this tank recently); 1 random 1" catfish who hasn't grown in 2 years, 4-1" Dayglo Danio, 4-small marble sized Zebra snails. ALL my fish LOVE Hikari frozen brine, tube, blood and spiralina. It is my first choice for group feeding as I know even the Ghost Knife will come out for it. I give 1 cube (directly from the freezer) of one of the varieties each night. My filter runs very fast and as fast as everyone is fighting over the melting cube they still cannot always get it eaten quickly enough and I have taken to turning off the filter to give the fish a chance to eat it. The Ghost hates this competition and once a week I take a frozen cube and actually stuff it under the rocks he hides in while the lights are out (90% of the time I can observe him eat the entire thing on his own). The Danio and Tetra like to eat more than once a day and since they are both willing to eat top-to-mid tank I give them a small pinch of mixed veggie and shrimp meal feed each morning. Despite the amount of algae in this tank the 4 Zebra snails are now hungry (they cannot get at the fine leaves) and I give them an algae chip every couple of days. The snails saved the tank in a general sense as the algae was everywhere before I got them just after New Years. Unfortunately they contribute to a nitrate problem in that their abundant eggs -while they cannot hatch- breakdown as waste as well.

So, here are photos of the algae:



This is the worst case. I have tried clipping off the various leaves as the algae takes hold, pulling the plant and hand cleaning and adding more algae eaters (otos hate this stuff, only the snails will eat it). Eventually I have found that only death solves the problem (either the plant dies or I pull it).

Notice the Anubias:



If you look closely you can see that a very small amount of the thread algae is growing. The plant was covered before I got the snails. These guys like the stuff and are happy to eat it if they can hang onto the plant leaf long enough to do so.

Any advice you all have would be greatly appreciated. As I said, at one point I had this tank very densely planted so I don't think more plants is the answer (although I pray that the day of the densely planted aquarium can be mine!). I have been told that a Co2 system is what I need and well, that just isn't in the financial cards; yet other people tell me that their gorgeously planted tanks have never seen more than a regular filter. I am at a loss at this point. If it is feed, I simply cannot imagine how to make sure the Ghost is getting what he needs short of finding a way of producing living food for him. (Actually ALL these fish would eat living food if I could figure out how). If it is water quality...UGH...I cannot imagine how much more I can do in this rural, financially strapped reality! I am in the process of reviewing canister filters and maybe that will help if I can figure out which brand and which materials would help the problem.

Thoughts? Thanks!

Cynthia in Wisconsin


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Welcome to the forum!

Algae is caused by an abundance of a particular resource such as light, nutrients, or CO2. In your case, I would say the light might be to blame. Natural sunlight is notorious for causing algae outbreaks when combined with usage of a fluorescent, albeit you use your fluorescent sparingly enough I would say you can bring your algae under control in other ways.

Another potential source of your algae outbreak is overfeeding. I feed once a day and sparingly at best. As long as you keep feeding on a regular basis, your fish will know when it is time and will be Johnny-on-the-spot to eat. Otherwise, excess food will fall to the bottom, rot, and flood your tank with nutrients for your algae to consume.

One way to effectively nuke the algae is to do a full blackout. Cover your tank with an industrial black plastic garbage bag and turn off the light, and leave it there for 5-7 days, opening it up only to feed your fish. You might lose a plant or two, but the idea is to starve the algae and have the majority of your plants outlast the starvation period, assuming they are bigger and healthier than the algae organisms,


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## rutwyler (Feb 17, 2011)

In my experience, fish will eat as much as you throw food in. Like dogs. However that doesn't mean they need to eat that often. In the wild, they constantly forage for food and are always moving and need to intake lots of calories. In the tank, their movement is DRASTICALLY reduced and so should their food. I would do the aforementioned "Blackout", then cut the food back to once a day. Possible every other day cause of the cooler water. Just be vigilant in watching their weight. I.e. shrunken bellies. I would also recommend maybe taping some Dow board or some other rigid insulation to at least the back. Maybe paint it black or something to camouflage it. But that would help a bit with your temperature regulation. Good luck and keep us posted. 

Oh geez one other thing, the "Quarry Rock" do you know what it is. That could be playing with you numbers as well. Granitic rocks can be very acidic, or sweet. I've smelled old bore holes in granite quarries that smell almost citrusy because of the acid level. Conversely limestone is very basic or hard. It's difficult to make it out from your picture, but it looks like some kinda Metamorphic that originated from a Sedimentary, which could be a conglomeration of a lot of different things... I'm not saying it IS causing any issues, i'm just saying it COULD be causing issues.


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## CynthiaCA (Feb 22, 2011)

rutwyler said:


> In my experience, fish will eat as much as you throw food in. Like dogs. However that doesn't mean they need to eat that often. In the wild, they constantly forage for food and are always moving and need to intake lots of calories. In the tank, their movement is DRASTICALLY reduced and so should their food. I would do the aforementioned "Blackout", then cut the food back to once a day. Possible every other day cause of the cooler water. Just be vigilant in watching their weight. I.e. shrunken bellies. I would also recommend maybe taping some Dow board or some other rigid insulation to at least the back. Maybe paint it black or something to camouflage it. But that would help a bit with your temperature regulation. Good luck and keep us posted.
> 
> Oh geez one other thing, the "Quarry Rock" do you know what it is. That could be playing with you numbers as well. Granitic rocks can be very acidic, or sweet. I've smelled old bore holes in granite quarries that smell almost citrusy because of the acid level. Conversely limestone is very basic or hard. It's difficult to make it out from your picture, but it looks like some kinda Metamorphic that originated from a Sedimentary, which could be a conglomeration of a lot of different things... I'm not saying it IS causing any issues, i'm just saying it COULD be causing issues.


Huh, good question on the rocks. I live over 2 hours from any sort of real aquarium supply house (or any city for that matter, lol) so I tend to trust my online sources for everything. I will check into the rock question. 

I've thought about feeding every other day actually and wondered how everyone would do. They are getting high quality feed. I could try that, certainly. It is always hard to tell if they are still hungry or just being pigs. The Danio and Tetra will follow the frozen block of shrimp around until it falls apart and heads to the substrate, at which point the loaches come out and devour the rest. The Ghost is inconsistent about his eating and certainly does prefer to eat when it is dark, but I have seen him out when he is obviously hungry.

Thank you!


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Easy fix for that type of algae (BBA)....Flourish Excel. I use it on almost all of my tanks. A little on the costly side, but it can be found in 2L size and cost less per oz. My head hurts right now and didn't read through your whole thread, so sorry if you said you're already using. Look at this link and read down a little and you'll see an algae chart to tell you what to do for particular types : _Dosing Regime's_

A total blackout is not necessary unless your water is green....I revert back to my head hurting if you said it was. Try cutting your lighting time in half for about a week and nearly all of your algae problems will go away. Try only feeding your fish just twice sparingly during this period also. If the algae still exist in concentration after that, go for a longer period.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

Your black ghost will learn to come out during the day to feed, You can also teach him to take the food from your fingers. Mine did. He also stayed out most of the day it just takes them time to adjust themselves to that kind of schedule.


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