# Weird



## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

My some of my goldfish keep spittin the food out sometimes they spit it into pieces and sometimes they spit it out as a whole flake,what should i do?


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## danilykins (Dec 22, 2010)

my fish (guppies and mollies) do the same thing. Its funny though, its like they only do it to the green flake. I think they just don't like the taste of it. I have fish that only go for orange flakes and not green ones and others just go for whatever they can fit in their mouth LOL


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## automatic-hydromatic (Oct 18, 2010)

yeah sounds like you've just got picky fish, lol

my guppies do the same with some color flakes. not problem though; the left overs sink to the bottom and my shrimp swarm over them


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Ya now that i think about it,they usually just spit out the red ones lol!


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Oh also i have a juvenile gold goldfish hes a fantail,hes getting some black lining on the oustide of his tail,is this anything i should be worried about?


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

Have you tried feeding pellets instead of flakes?Flakes are like the generic dog food found at the dollar store,lol.Very poor quality.

Is the black coloring or is his fins getting ragged?


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

I dont know, his fins look fine ill try to post a pic later for now i have church.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

It's on all of hive fins,every single one and its just like an outline of black on the edges of all fins but hes swimming and acting normal


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

Please post a picture, sounds like it could be either a color change or possibly ammonia burn. Pics would help!


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Man i wish i could but i dont have a camera  its on every fin just on 1 out of 4 goldfish and he's a juvenile he currently has no color on his fins.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Probably even better would be to test for ammonia


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Well i'm 14 and i dont have test kit yet cause my parents think i'm going overboard with all this supplies i really had to persuade them just to get a gravel vacuum (which is not working) but the tank did seem to get cloudy and now it just looks like the coloring is on the tips of the fins.I know its hard to diagnose something you don't have stats to read to jump to conclusions,it's a 10g with 3 plastic plants and when i got home yesterday there was a lot of buubles at the top.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Ok, so here's the deal, if the coloring just appeared out of nowhere, wasn't there when you bought the fish, I'm going to say I think this is ammonia poisoning, and that you probably need to do a partial water change. How recently did you do one? I'd replace 50% of the water (do you have chemicals for treating the chlorine and chloramine in the tap water before you put it in the tank? I hope so.) Ideally we would have you do an ammonia test to know for sure, but even without a test, a water change will not make things worse for your fish, and if there is too much ammonia (which can be caused by fish waste or even extra food they don't eat) a partial water change will help fix it.


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

chris oe said:


> Ok, so here's the deal, if the coloring just appeared out of nowhere, wasn't there when you bought the fish, I'm going to say I think this is ammonia poisoning, and that you probably need to do a partial water change. How recently did you do one? I'd replace 50% of the water (do you have chemicals for treating the chlorine and chloramine in the tap water before you put it in the tank? I hope so.) Ideally we would have you do an ammonia test to know for sure, but even without a test, a water change will not make things worse for your fish, and if there is too much ammonia (which can be caused by fish waste or even extra food they don't eat) a partial water change will help fix it.


I agree, how long was the tank set up before the goldie was added? Was the tank cycled? You must get the test kit!!, especially with goldies as they produce more waste than regular tropicals. Show your parents this post and the one before this, if you want your goldie to be healthy and they want you do do a good job taking care of your pet they will understand. 
If you have any other questions let me know.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

I do water changes every 2-3 days but they're manual i stick a pitcher in and pour the water in the sink until the water is about halfway down the tank,then i fill it up with new water.I do not use dechlorinator,with me being dumb i just filled up the tank went to Petsmart bought 2 black moors(looking fine) and 4 fantails(uhh yeah i know now that was way too many fish for a 10g tank) i had the tank filled up with water for at least 2 hours (dumb score 2 smart score 0) i bought the filter gravel and plastic plants along with them and set it up.The next morning 1 fantail was stuck to the filter(still breathing but died a few hours later)I got store credit but did NOT buy another.Then about a week and a half another fantail died(last weekend)same thing stuck to the filter.The water has been getting cloudier,right before the last fantail died this gold fantail got coloring,his fins had absolutely NO color before so this is what worries me.This has not happened to the other fantail nor the black moors(of course!their already black!) so this is where im at right now i'll show them the posts


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## danilykins (Dec 22, 2010)

The rule of thumb for fancy goldfish (like the moors and the fantails) is 10gallons per fancy goldfish. SO if you have a 10gallon tank you should only have one goldfish. I know it sucks but its a rule because they are very dirty fish. What I suggest you do is choose 1 goldfish, and see if you can take the rest back and get credit. This is better for you and the fish. Also take a sample of water with you to the pet store, they can test if for free. Buy some conditioner (you can use your shop credit for this). If you don't want to, then have your water sit for at least 24hrs before adding it to your fish tank. The bad news is you have lost fish and you may lose more because you haven't cycled your tank, BUT your tank can cycle with a goldfish in it but it will be rough on your fish :/
When you get money or store credit buy some real plants that will help with the water quality and help ease the ammonia for the goldfish. 
Fancy goldfish have lots of issues for even the most experienced fishkeeper. Because their bodies are so round and compact this causes them to become constipated and get swim bladder problems. When I kept goldfish I used to go to Kokos goldfish world a lot. (Koko's goldfish world) there is sooooo much good information there, and the people in the forums are realllly helpful. I suggest you read up a bit.


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

yeah, I agree, you absolutely have to buy tap water conditioner, and you need to make sure it treats chlorine and chloramine. If your local water treatment plant uses chloramine, letting it sit will not evaporate out the chloramine, so be safe and buy tap water conditioner. 

I also agree with fewer fish in your tank - it will be easier for you to keep your tank clean and your fish will have more room to grow. One goldfish is plenty. If you take good care of it, it will grow really big and live a long time. Focus your money (allowance etc.) on things to make your fish comfortable, like plants and equipment for taking care of the tank: a net, maybe a scrubber to help clean the glass, filter materials for when your filter needs changing (what kind of filter have you got?) better foods, stuff like that you can add gradually. If you don't get an allowance, one thing that worked for me when I was your age was saying "I would like this (fill in the blank). It costs (fill in the blank). Are there jobs I can do around the house to earn the money for (fill in the blank)?" Parents love stuff like that, provided money isn't already tight.


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

You are WAY over stocked in a 10 Gallon tank. I agree with "danilykins" I am also a member at Koko's goldfish forum. It is the best place to get advice on anything goldfish. 
I would try to take all but one goldie back for store credit. With the credit I would get a test kit, and some water conditioner. When I do my water changes I fill 3 - 5gallon buckets the day before, add conditioner and let them site for 24hours. Then I will do the change. This way all of the impurities are out of the water. 
Sounds like your first few died from ammonia poisoning. I will admit I too have done the same mistake with fancy goldfish. If you have any questions just ask I will be glad to help.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

I don't think Petsmart will let you do that do they?I will start gradually getting stuff,don't goldfish eat live plants though?I do also have another 10g stocked with 4 red clawed crabs,and a small divided tank for bettas also...When i first got the fish they all looked sick sittin at the bottom of the tank,but when i start doing pwc's they seemed more active and look alot better now,but one looked fine then the next day he was dead,i did notice before he died he had one tailfin longer than the other,i know it's too late but could that have possibly been fin rot?


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

They have a guarantee on their fish. If you look at your receipt I think it even says so on there. You can bring them back within the guarantee period. 

Some plants that are small, like duckweed, the goldfish will just eat, but tougher plants, like anacharis or java moss or java fern they will not. 

Don't buy another thing before you get some water conditioner.


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

Goldies will eat live plants, it is good for them. Anacharis is one I keep with my goldies, they do nibble on it but it grows so fast you will never notice it. I also keep jave fern, anubias, and water sprite, these they don't touch. With live plants its hit or miss, depends on the goldie too. Anubias and java fern are they only 2 I have never heard of a goldie eating.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Good news!I got water conditioner


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Yay! That will help a lot. If you didn't treat the water when you filled the tank, you might want to treat the tank water that is in there just once. Next on the hit list is water tests, most importantly an ammonia test, but as long as you're doing your partial water changes on schedule you can hope that your water characteristics are in gear for the time being. Just make sure not to feed more than your animals can eat in a couple minutes, and do a partial water change a minimum of once a week. The goldfish experts can tell you what percentage to shoot for.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

So you can treat the water while the fish are swimming in it?


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Yep, its better to treat the water first, so the fish aren't exposed to the things in the water that can hurt them, but if there's a chance that those things are in the water that they're in, its better to neutralize them. Check the bottle to be sure (there will be a warning if adding it directly to the tank is a bad idea, no warning if it is not a bad idea), and mix it with some of the water from the tank first if you want to be extra safe, but I do this all the time, I usually remove water, dose the tank with the neutralizer I will need for the new water, then pour the new water into the tank and allow everything to mix there, mostly 'cause my tank is a 55 and I'm going to be putting many buckets back in, and dosing each individual bucket isn't really practical. My neutralizer does say on the bottle that water will be safe for use immediately, so that is something to consider. Read your bottle carefully and notice details like how much to use, how quickly you can use the water, what things the neutralizer treats for, things like that. If it says 5 ml and doesn't have a cap that can be used to measure, 5 ml is the same as one teaspoon, so you can borrow one of your parents measuring spoons like they use to cook with, and use that (just make sure to wash it and put it back. If all the measuring spoons migrate into the tank area that will peeve your parents. Things like that used to bug my mom.) I use the kind of dropper you use to give little kids medicine, the kind that has a stopper that fits in the bottle top? I just leave the stopper in my neutralizer bottle and use the syringe type dropper to measure out how much neutralizer I use and squirt it into the tank or the bucket or wherever I need it. Very accurate and no spills. But its not a necessity, the caps of most bottles have measuring lines that work just fine (although it is a good idea to rinse them when you're through or they end up with gummy layers of dried water neutralizer on them). If you've read this far you are patient indeed. Boy I can ramble on, can't I?


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Lol ya its tetramin and i checked and it treats chrlorine and chloramine so ill treat it right awaY!


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

Ok I went to Petsmart and got a snail for it,and saw the test kit $30.00 and my mom was like "Uhhh ya maybe next Friday..." but my Local PetSmart does free water testing so I plan on bringing a sample of my water to them soon!


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

How many goldies are left in it?

One thing i want to add, is first a link to a good few articles on goldies.A caresheet,myths and things.
Goldfish Wellness - UltimateBettas
Think a Bowl is Big Enough? - UltimateBettas
Memory Like A Goldfish? - UltimateBettas

Second,i can totally understand the lack of cash when it comes to fish(I owe someone 25 bucks right now because im broke,lol)But there is ways you can help your fish habit without breaking your moms wallet.

trade unneeded supplies for needed ones.Like your siphon.If its no use to you(I dont use one of the big ones either,i use airline and gravity)trade or sell it on craigslist,or somewhere else.If you are artistic,or can sculpt or whatever,make a few paintings or sculptures and sell them.

I am a HUGE fan of bartering,and your mom might feel a bit better about you being more responsible with your fish,and opt to help with the expenses more.


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

Yes, how many goldies do you have left? If you have more than one in a 10gallon tank your going to have problems. Even if you do enough water changes and get the water parameters correct, that size tank is going to stunt there growth. This stunting will be very harmfull to the internal organs and will lead to problems you can't cure.


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## Lil Gashog (Dec 1, 2010)

2 Black moors and 2 Fantails I bought them uhh like a week after christmas maybe before as juveniles I have 3 red claw crabs in another 10g,im tryiing to get rid of them so I can move two to the 10g tank the crabs are in,the gravel vacuum won't work :/

I shake it,suck on the end of it and the water will go through it just wont keep siphoning any one know why?


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## chris oe (Feb 27, 2009)

Siphons can be troublesome. In order for the siphon to start you need the end in the tank to be higher than the end in the bucket, and you need to not "break" the suction by letting the water run out while you get it there. Lots of people do this by submerging the whole siphon and then covering the bucket end and holding it tight while they take it out of the water, keeping the water trapped inside with a thumb or their fingers until they get the end down in the bucket. Then when they take their thumb off the water should come through the tube (so long as the end in the tank is still underwater, sometimes if the tank end comes up, even for a second, it can break the suction and the siphon is all over). I use the tank lid to hold the tank end down by closing it on top of the tube, it doesn't close super heavy, it just provides a little weight to keep the tube in place while I'm moving the other end. It also helps to have two buckets or containers, so that once you get the suction going you can fill one, then let the other fill while you take the full bucket and empty it, 'cause having to restart the siphon over and over is a pain, especially when the water level gets low.


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## J-Pond (Jun 8, 2009)

Lil Gashog said:


> 2 Black moors and 2 Fantails I bought them uhh like a week after christmas maybe before as juveniles I have 3 red claw crabs in another 10g,im tryiing to get rid of them so I can move two to the 10g tank the crabs are in,the gravel vacuum won't work :/
> 
> I shake it,suck on the end of it and the water will go through it just wont keep siphoning any one know why?


When you suck on the back end, do you keep it lower than the part in the water? 
Also, 2 fancy goldfish in a 10gallon tank is not good, the rule of thumb for fancy goldies is 10gallons per fish. If you going to get the other 10gallon set up for one that's great, but one per tank would be best.


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## Utter Nutter (Feb 1, 2011)

J-Pond said:


> When you suck on the back end, do you keep it lower than the part in the water?
> Also, 2 fancy goldfish in a 10gallon tank is not good, the rule of thumb for fancy goldies is 10gallons per fish. If you going to get the other 10gallon set up for one that's great, but one per tank would be best.


I know what you are saying here, and when I try to work out what ltrs a re in gallons so I can see what you are saying, it comes up that my 60ltr tank is only 15 gl. So when I had the 30ltr, I had 4 fish in a 7 gl. I have had two of these fish for 2 years, and have upgraded it as they were getting to big for the tank, but from what you say, even my 60Ltr is way to small. I never tested my water until I got my tropical fish also, but did condition the water -most of the time. I believe my fish are all healthy and happy, I did regular water changes, and at times, did complete water changes, this does not seem to have harmed them, I have only ever lost one goldfish, and that was the day after I brought is home from the shop so think it was probably ill anyway. I have pictures of my fish up in a thread titled My Goldfish.
What Im saying is, yes all the things you are saying are important, but don't scare the boy, goldfish can be hardy little things. I also do not have live plants in with mine, just feed them a mixture of flake (good quality), pellets and frozen bloodworms.


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