# sick fish and ph problem



## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

I ve set up my tank more than 1 month ago..126L.
I have a JBL CrystalProfi e701 external filter..a heater..and an air pump.
I have Anubias Congensis,Althernathera Reneckii,Bacopa Compacta,Weeping Moss, Ludwiglia and some Sword like tall plant.I got plat substrate aqua basis jbl and i put daily liquid CO2.I also have several boiled coconuts and one root [not driftwood nor mopan,forgot the name]
i have several fishes..all small..neons 2 hoplo zebra few guppies a beta cories kuhli loaches a platydoras some snails[apple and nerite].They are almost all fien ..some of them rarely scratch their gills on the susbtrate..one or two cories..by rarely i mean not even once a day..i watch them alot.
Problem is the ph level is..somehwere between 8 and 9..i distinguish the colors hardly.the ph from the sink where i put water from is the same [i use dechlorinator]I ve tested even the botteld water i drink and i find it around 7.5 -8 even it says 7.05 on the label.
What can I do to bring the ph level to the safe one?I don t have any other water source...
I also have a problem with a black molly, at first it looked like he lost some fins ,they turned white and fell..now it looks more like a crater like someone dug a hole in him..I tried putting him in the treatment tank with general tonic from tetra but still no results.He is fine eating and acting normally [i saw him scratch once today]I ll post some pictures.Any help?
https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=bb5241e0b7ab3c28cb7a50de9ef43c5a&oe=5592B829
https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=f29ad938d485e61526e09b239b60ea14&oe=559205D0

could not get better pictures...the are is white mostly ,not fuzzy and it looks like a small crater

please help..


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

As far as the pH goes, I really wouldn't worry about it. Fish can adapt to a pretty wide range of pH, as long as it's stable you've got nothing to worry about.

Not sure what's going on with the molly, sorry


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Could not see pics?
Water parameters??
High pH can make ammonia a problem?(more of one that is)?
Mollies should be the ONE fish you have to LOVE the high pH.
GH would be nice to know also with nutrient parameters.
Over 8-8.3 is pushing it for most common fish beside African cichlids or brackish(molies are all good).


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...=140e738f284e4da9d1b16da524d31ad7&oe=55975569

he seems better..i ve cleaned him there with a cotton bud dipped in the general tonic tetra. the crater has diminished and the whiteness also.

well it worries me with the high ph because my cories are scratching from time to time their gills...two died at the start of the tank..they were scratching then they were swimming directionless..i mean like in circles as a bird flying iwth only 1 wing.
recently i found one of my cories without his tail..it looked like cut with a fine blade..he was still alive but died soon..do you think the raphael catfish attacked him? i ve fed him enought at night for sure and he is not really big..the size of a baloon molly...

i can t measure the other parameters except ph..i will trying buying a test kit as soon as I can afford it..

isn t there a way I could lower the ph by adding something to the water..just like I do with the dechlorinator to eliminate chlorine?
Or if I fill the bottles which i will add water when i change with the tap water..and leave them withot the lid for like 1 week or so ..do you think the ph will lower?


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## coralbandit (Jul 29, 2012)

Molly in pic looks to columnaris IMO.
Without knowing water parameters I woul just step water changes.
How much water do you change ,how often?
Fish Columnaris | Fungus & Saprolegnia | Treatment & Prevention
Mesds for columnaris are kanamycin and furan.
From the link;

Product Resources:
*Furan 2, Nitrofurazone; from AAP
*Kanamycin,; Kanaplex from AAP


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Change the way you think! None of these sound like ph problems. When it comes to ph the only thing you should be concerned with is if it were going up and down. Yours sounds very stable and therefore should not be considered the problem area. Albeit, there are a few select species that tend to do better in certain ranges - but not the fish you list. Keep thinking this way and get to the point of using products available that alter ph and you will kill everything you got trying to get it where "you", not your "fish" think you need it to be.

Sounds to me like you have a water cleanliness issue. How often and how large are your water changes? What are all of your general maintenance practices? These are what dictate fish health more than anything that deals with ph EVER will.

Stop reading what is in books or on the internet about "this fish needs this ph", for the most part it is just optimal for breeding - not for living.


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

I change once a week ,20 L of water.I vacuum like 60 % of the surface of the tank[where the plants are I can t.In the last 2 weeks I ve changed 40L of water...I ve been away 1 week and when I cam back the molly had healed completely.An apple snail I found dead..also found a kuhli..and a molly baloon which was lying in a corner alive..I ve put him separately try to treat with general tonic no use..he can t swim he just spins around diretionless..


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## Arthur7 (Feb 22, 2013)

It might be a stupid question. but the water really comes with the pH 8 to 9 Who from your tap? That's all very unusual in the world.
Since good is not a water change.
Or they may have measured in your aquarium.
Then your gravel and the decoration must be checked.


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

I checked it from the tap.it s clearly minimum 8..or I got problems with my perception of colors..but I checked it twice , asked others too...


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## Arthur7 (Feb 22, 2013)

Czensny indicator is very reliable.


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

Ican afford getting ph minus from JBL.I will use it on the tank to lower the ph to 7-7.5
now it s above 8..maybe above 8.5

the ph minus will gradually reduce the ph i think,then when i change water i can add ph minus to the water which i will pour inside the tank at the change..do you think it is a good idea?
https://www.jbl.de/en/aquatics-freshwater-products/detail/2325/jbl-ph-minus


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I guess you just need to learn the hard way as advice from experienced people don't seem to affect the way you feel or act.

The ph down products will just cause you more problems than you think and I will take a little time to explain how/why. Your water likely has a high kh level or at least 3+dkh. kh is your carbonate hardness. One of the things that this does is keep the ph from going up or down - WHICH IS THE ONLY CONCERN FOR YOU AND PH. You will add your ph down product and it will lower the ph for a little while and then what happens is the kh will eventually push it right back where you started. The resulting effect on your fish will be death since they do not handle a the yo-yo effect very well.

Your problem is your tank is a cesspool due to a lack of fresh water into your closed loop eco-system. 20L of water change for a 126L tank is only about 15%. What are your nitrate readings? These are not harmful unless at a high level and the main way to remove them is by changing water. Yours are climbing every week with NO lowering due to the near-nothing water changes you are doing. My guess is they are well over 100ppm and this alone will KILL most fish out there.

But, by all means, continue down the road of hardknocks and take your licks and learn - hopefully. Good advice helps you, if you don't want to try and change your methods you may as well give up the hobby. You likely won't like the amount of death you will have to deal with.

Good luck!


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

thanks for the help firstly.

how can I lower the water hardness [i presume this is the dKh?]
how much water do you recommend me to change?
i will get a nitrate testing kit this week


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

You should change a minimum of 35% weekly and if you have a lot of fish in that tank 50-60%.

kh is the carbonate hardness, there is also gh. Best way to cut it down is by using half RO or distilled with your water changes. I would not do that before you tested gh/kh and knew what the values were before trying to change them.

Your goal for nitrates should be in the ballpark of no more than 40ppm. This value should be what you attain just before your next water change, NOT after your water change. Test your tap for nitrates first and make sure you get the liquid test. Follow the instructions to the letter or your results will vary too much.


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## sunkeeper (Jan 22, 2015)

will do !
thank you alot


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