# Newbee Please Help! relatively new to tank stewartship.



## marcusone (Apr 25, 2012)

First a bit of background and setup information:
My wife has had goldfish for a very long time... never really doing anything with the tanks except scrape the algae off the tank when it gets bad (well, she wouldn't - I usually had to and change filter, etc). so I decided to take over their care.

We had a 10 Gallon tank with 2 goldfish (fancy tails I believe) in it, living well for about 4-5months. I couldn't find a replacement lid for the tank (had issues with it), so decided to purchase a new 20 Gallon tank (was on sale for a great price - included most things I needed to start).

Monday (now Wed) I purchased:
20 Gallon tank with hood, light, filter (Marina S20 slim filter - with 4 media/filter cartridges).
Marina Cycle and Marina Plus water "additives"
New Rocks (bottom)
Ship ornament (bought from fish store, so I assume safe for fish)

Setup of tank:
Put new rocks in bottom.
Moved about 70-80% of the water from the 10G tank into the new tank, along with about 20% of the rocks, 3 live plants.
Filled remainder with mix of RO (reverse ossmosis water) and untreated/unfiltered well water (fairly hard last time I tested). 
Setup filter as per instructions and turn it on.
Added Cycle and Plus water additives as directed.
Let run for about an hour.

Fish were in their old water in a large pitcher. Looking "unhappy" to my wife and I, so we added them into the new tank (feeling that was better than letting them sit in a jug all night). - Everything "looked" good.

Tuesday (Next Day)
After reading more about fish tanks and looking after them, I realized that I should get more water "additives" to keep on hand, rock filter/cleaner to clean waste from rocks and make water changes easier, air pump, and most importantly a water test kit.

Got home, added the air pump and bubble strip (image: hxxp://img14.imageshack.us/img14/8584/fishtanknight.jpg)
everything looked great, so I took some tests.
pH: 6.8'ish
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: didn't get a chance to complete.

So the tank looked like this before bed: 









this morning (Wednesday) it looks like this (milky/cloudy):









New tests:
pH: 6.8ish
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: about 0.3 maybe 0.5 (kit goes from 0.3 to 0.8)
Nitrate: 110 likely (at the top of the scale, fairly sure).

So I followed the test kit instructions and replaced 20% of the water. Added more Plus and Cycle (as per instructions).

Any other ideas? Should I replace 20% more tomorrow if the levels are still high? Anything else I should do?

Thanks in advance for any/all help!!


----------



## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

There is a fairly good chance that that is from a bacteria bloom brought on by the new filtration system. When there was an abundance of ammonia the bacteria began to replicate and eat up the ammonia. That is what the actual 'cloud' is comprised of and is concidered normal and it will clear on it's own. Keep an eye on your ammonia levels and your nitrite levels, chances are you will be doing daily PWC's until the tank establishes itself. You will need to do 50 percent daily until then. Also, goldfish are very dirty fish for thier size and really need no less than 40g so I would recommend looking around for a bit bigger tank as they get bigger or you will be doing a lot of water changes!

ADDED** Another thing you are bound to get is a brown accumulation of algea, this is called Diadoms algea and it happens in every new tank, just keep cleaning it off and it will die off with time.


----------



## marcusone (Apr 25, 2012)

CrazyMFFM said:


> You will need to do 50 percent daily until then. Also, goldfish are very dirty fish for thier size and really need no less than 40g so I would recommend looking around for a bit bigger tank as they get bigger or you will be doing a lot of water changes!


50% change? most places I've read say not to do that much, and my test kit says just 20%. Should I keep adding the Cycle and Plus "additives" as well?

As for a larger tank, we had 1 Goldfish in our 10G tank for over 5 years. I figured a 20g would be ok for 2 Goldfish - also its the largest we can fit in the location that we have a tank (and I doubt my wife wants a bigger one somewhere else 

Thanks!


----------



## S.Oak (Dec 4, 2011)

Your tank is "cycling". Even with all the additives and supplements that are sold to "instantly cycle" an aquarium, there is absolutely no substitute for tank maturity. Those additives can help speed the process up, but they can't eliminate the process.

I would recommend doing water changes at least every 2 days until it finishes cycling. Probably 2 weeks or so at least. Goldfish are very messy fish and produce a lot of waste, fortunately, they are also pretty hardy and should survive this experience as long as you keep up with the water changes.


----------



## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

Well the thing is, as messy as they are your fish will create more ammonia than 'normal' fish. You can very safely change 30-50 percent of water, I do it all the time with my oscars, all it does is give them clean water free of their waste.


----------



## marcusone (Apr 25, 2012)

CrazyMFFM said:


> Well the thing is, as messy as they are your fish will create more ammonia than 'normal' fish. You can very safely change 30-50 percent of water, I do it all the time with my oscars, all it does is give them clean water free of their waste.


Thanks... then the next question is: Is it better to use the RO water or my well water (that I guess I'll need to leave in a jug in the house so that the temp is relatively the same as the fish's water)??


----------



## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

Goldfish are very hardy and do well in virtually any water at the right temp with healthy levels so RO isn't really required. Actually there are only a few fish that need RO, I would say stay with the well water as long as it tests good.


----------



## marcusone (Apr 25, 2012)

CrazyMFFM said:


> Goldfish are very hardy and do well in virtually any water at the right temp with healthy levels so RO isn't really required. Actually there are only a few fish that need RO, I would say stay with the well water as long as it tests good.


Sorry for all the noob questions: I like to be precise and follow instructions 

What do you mean "tests good"?

Last time I had it tested, it was hard (50 something, but don't recall what the measurement was in), so in the house I have a Softener -> sediment filters -> UV (just in case) -> household.

For the fish, I assume "softened" water isn't good, so I take from an outside tap that is direct Well water.

I really appreciate your help and quick responses! Thank you!


----------



## Crazy (Mar 1, 2012)

tests good means ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, ph, gh, etc. The well water should be fine for the fish. Many of the members here keep harder fish in it so I think you should be safe. The RO system in your house should be great too, and it is handy to already have as some more harder to keep fish need it.


----------



## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Did you not transfer the old filter? Running the old filter on the new tank would have sped the cycle process to where it would be nearly non-existent.

Not sure if you planned to add anymore fish, but the fish you have already maxes that tank out. If you choose to do it anyway, be sure to wait at least until the cyle is finished forming all the beneficial bacteria.


----------



## marcusone (Apr 25, 2012)

jrman83 said:


> Did you not transfer the old filter? Running the old filter on the new tank would have sped the cycle process to where it would be nearly non-existent.
> 
> Not sure if you planned to add anymore fish, but the fish you have already maxes that tank out. If you choose to do it anyway, be sure to wait at least until the cyle is finished forming all the beneficial bacteria.


Unfortunately I didn't read about using the old filter until after I had tossed the medium in the garbage 
Now I know for future.

We don't plan to add more fish, as most people agree that 2 goldfish in 20G is max (or even perhaps too many).

Back to Well Water vs. RO.
In the chat room; most agree that well water (if testing ok) is preferred.

My Tests on the well water:
pH: 7.5
NO2: 0
NO3: 5-10 (hard to tell, so somewhere around: 5 is the lowest on the chart).

I assume this is "safe" for my goldfish. One Aquarium store employee (BigAls) said that hard water (which mine is, last time I checked) is better for goldfish than soft, so I'll keep using the water direct from the well (rather than after my softener/filters).

Also; noticed and confirmed its normal, RO water is acidic (due to removed minerals/metals), so not likely good to use unless I need to lower the pH of the tank, or I add another filter to it to raise the pH.


----------

