# Gonna need help on Dirt Tank Build for a 55 gal.



## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

Ok Im really diggin the Dirty tank idea right now. can I just go in my backyard and dig up some dirt and the awsome thing is about where I live i can dig about 3 ft. down and there's some natural undisturbed clay. I could go to a beach and fill up a couple of 5 gallon buckets with sand.

Seeing that the guys tank is already cycled would it be fine if i empty all of the water then put the the dirt/clay mix in put a little water in it to moisten it up then put the layer of sand on. Then put the gravel and stuff on. And seeing that my bedroom is right next to one of my hoses out side, I can have the hose come through the window and fill up the tank very, very, very slowly to a pretty much dribble state on to a plate like beaslbob suggested. So my hypothesis is that there should be close to nill cloudy water and no need to cycle right?


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## wilcockmc (Jan 12, 2011)

Unless you are using the same water and filter of the already cycled tank, you need to cycle the tank.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

are you sure? I did the same thing with my 29 gallon when i went to go pick it up except i did not do the dirt and gravel thing


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## Leopard Gecko (May 9, 2011)

You don't need to use the same water but the same filter is important. If you're using the same filter though you could stock your tank to as full as it previously was. I suggest adding fish slowly though and testing the water to be safe.

I would test the water after a day or two before adding fish too. If the clay has any organic matter or has lots of nutrients in it your tank might have an ammonia spike.


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## susankat (Nov 15, 2008)

I don't know if I would use sand from the beach though, might have a lot of salt in it. Sand is pretty cheap though. At home depot and lowes you can get a bag of playsand for less than 5$, but pool filter sand is finer and takes less rinsing and home depot carries a 50 lb bag for 8$ or less.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

i will check into that


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

but i dont live by the ocean i live near milwaukee by lake michigan no salt there. but would my idea work then?


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

I still wouldn't use beach sand... ever heard of sand lice? Not fun!

Just get some play sand from a hard ware store. It's super cheap!


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

holly12 said:


> I still wouldn't use beach sand... ever heard of sand lice? Not fun!


Sand Lice? Sounds like fleas for fish. lol ok i will see if i can get a couple bags of sand. how much would be good for a 48 X 21 X 13.

Ok, I will put the dirt/clay mix at the bottom then the sand then the gravel. When the tank is full of water do i turn on the filter or leave it off? Plus my parents said that i cant order the plants till next week. The particles should settle by then. 

Well If you anyone here has the time to help me aqua scape my tank. I have no idea how big or how fast these plants grow. So if anyone could draw me a picture in Microsoft paint of where to put my plants I would humongously appreciate it! my tank is 48 inches long and 13inches deep. well here is the hopeful plants I want to get. 

2x Hornwort (Ceratophyllum Demersum) size:?
1x Hygrophila Angustifolia size: ? 
1x Wisteria (Hygrophila Difformis) size:?
2x Anacharis (Egeria Densa) size: 8"
1x Vallisneria Asiatica Var. Biwaensis (Corkscrew Val) size: 12"
2x Echinodorus Bleheri (Amazon Sword) SM Size: 6"
1x Java Moss (Vesicularia Dubyana) size: 4 oz. cup
1x Fontinalis Antipyretica (Willow Moss) Portion size: 4 oz. cup
2x Malaysian Driftwood size:10"-15"
2x Vallisneria Gigantea Marmor ( Red Jungle Val) size: bare root

Also I have some rocks to would like to put in my tank. For the red Jungle Val what does it mean by bare root? Oh, plus i have 2 plecos, one common and one 1" albino bn pleco. So I need to know if these plants wont get damaged from them.

Also how thick does the dirt/clay layer need to be?


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## Leopard Gecko (May 9, 2011)

The common pleco will probably damage most of the plants and the bristlenose might eat your sword plant.


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## Peterjay (Feb 15, 2011)

Leopard Gecko said:


> The common pleco will probably damage most of the plants and the bristlenose might eat your sword plant.



I agree - I'd definitely lose the common pleco. If you go about this in the right way, there's no need to cycle the tank. The plants will take care of that. My 90 gallon has a dirt/sand substrate, and I've never seen a trace of ammonia. You'd be well advised to do a little research on Diana Walstad's method of setting up a planted tank, or check out Beaslbob's method. Take your time and do your research and you won't run into any serious problems.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

ok well i just got done digging a 4 ft. hole to clay. Well you'd expect it to be nice today but no it has to pouring out. So yeah im soaking wet right now. But hey I needed the dirt/clay. I have done my my fare share of researching these plants now. So how long does it take for the sediment from the sand and dirt take to settle before i am able to move my fish in?

also which is better willow moss or java moss?


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## Peterjay (Feb 15, 2011)

There's no cut-and-dried answer to that one. It depends on what kind of filtration you're using (if any) and how mucked-up the water gets. As soon as your tank is planted and the water clears, you can add fish. If it's overly cloudy, just drain and replace the water. I waited a couple of weeks before adding a few fish, but only because I've had trouble finding rainbowfish that looked good. (I'm still having trouble finding any good ones locally) BTW - you don't need clay - topsoil works just fine. I used cheap potting soil.


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Whatever natural dirt you use, I would recommend mineralizing it first. It's a way to remove most of the organic compounds so you won't have an ammonia spike. Here's a link to a thread on the mineralizing process, or you can Google "mineralized topsoil"

How-To: Mineralized Soil Substrate, by Aaron Talbot - Library - Aquatic Plant Central


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

If you're not going to re-use the gravel that was already in the tank, the tank will start the cycle over again. There is NO way to avoid the nitrogen cycle taking place - the tank will cycle whether you want it to or not. There are a few methods to go about it and some are easier than others, but you cannot escape it. Plants help deal with the issues normally seen during a cycle, but the tank still goes through it. Stock too fast and the plants won't matter much. Ammonia levels can kill in any tank.


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## Peterjay (Feb 15, 2011)

Good points Ben - I don't think I made myself clear. The key is lots of fast-growing plants and light stocking at first. The plants have to be able to keep up with the bioload. Patience is a virtue regardless of method.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

Yeh im using the gravel from my it but he says theres black algae. How does one kill black algae becuase i have been doing research and it says nothing eats it? I do have algaecide will that kill it. I got it from the person when i got my 29. I never used it.

can convict cichlids go with my fish? because thats what he has


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## Leopard Gecko (May 9, 2011)

Subsoil (the soil under topsoil; like your clay) shouldn't normally have much nitrogen/organic matter in it so it probably won't cause an ammonia spike. Put in your clay, then sand (if you're using some), and finally gravel before filling the tank. When you fill it, fill it very slow and use something like a plate to deflect the current. Beaslebob and other people recommended that to me and it kept my water from getting cloudy. 

I would try to get all the black algae off the gravel before putting it in. Try scrubbing it off. 

I don't know anything about convict cichlids but most cichlids are aggressive.


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

I wouldn't put convicts in with community fish.

You could always just keep your lights off for the first week or two and starve the algae. Or you could go extreme and do a complete blackout (before adding plants) using black garbage bags and no light.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

Gizmo said:


> I wouldn't put convicts in with community fish.
> 
> You could always just keep your lights off for the first week or two and starve the algae. Or you could go extreme and do a complete blackout (before adding plants) using black garbage bags and no light.


yeh i was thinking the same thing

could i just bleach all of his gravel?


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

You could see if any local fish stores will take the convicts as donations or possibly even buy them from you. You could also try and sell/donate them over the internet on classifieds websites like Craigslist.


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## Leopard Gecko (May 9, 2011)

You could bleach the gravel but that would kill the beneficial bacteria. It might make it take longer to cycle your tank but if you don't add too many fish at once it won't matter. Just make sure you rinse the gravel well enough that you can't smell the bleach anymore.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

well i have the clay/dirt in a rubbermaid container soaking and I still need to wash the sand. whew, I cannot wait to see this puupy done!

I really hope the guy only has black algae and not cyanobacteria. that wouldnt be good.


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

Gizmo said:


> You could see if any local fish stores will take the convicts as donations or possibly even buy them from you. You could also try and sell/donate them over the internet on classifieds websites like Craigslist.


Idk how many she has but if she has alot of should i buy them she's selling them for 2.50 each. is that a good deal. can gouramis go with convicts if i sell the others?

well got back from the guy, Im going to get the tank tomorrow at 8:45 am central time. CANT WAIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

he said his 4 inch fish is not aggressive , multi-colored and eats flake food. 

Well lets play a game the person who guesses the right name for the fish before I show any pictures of the fish. Wins a gold star!!!


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## Peterjay (Feb 15, 2011)

Rainbow trout. Where do I pick up my prize?


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Oscar


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Freshwater stingray


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## Pigeonfish (Jun 23, 2011)

A puppy.


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## Pigeonfish (Jun 23, 2011)

But rly, Jim, you should try getting a picture of the fish first and post it here so maybe someone can ID it... You know.. before you buy it :3


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

well got the tank the fish I think it is a pink convict and he's in my 29 gallon right now. He seems to be fine with the others he just sits in the cave. Minding his own business.

I have the dirt/clay and sand in the tank now and about to fill it up with the dish inside. here's the fish pic and the what i am doing currently with my tank:

























I think this is a Pink convict:


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Dang. If it was a stingray I would have bought it from you...


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## zephspacer (Jul 29, 2011)

well i got the tank all set up and it had TONS of algae in it. (green thankfully). So I left Alot of the dirty water still in and put the dirt and sand on it. The tank is starting to clear fully. So if it's fully clear can i move my fish and decor from my 29 into the 55? Seeing that i got it filled up really slowly. Also im going to put the filter cartridge from my 29 into the new filter seeing that the guy didnt give me any filters. this new filter requires 2 cartridges so thankfully i kept one my old cartridges from last week. I kept it wet so the bacteria should still be alive. hopefully. so yeh thats all!


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