# Sad few days!!



## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Had an upsetting past few days!

Two or three days ago, I found 1 dead female cherry shrimp and 1 dead black diamond shrimp. No damage to their bodies... just dead.

Last night, I saw my bamboo shrimp filtering after I turned out the light. She swam away when I opened the lid to put some phytoplankton in for her. This evening after work, my husband and I found her dead between a rock and the side of the tank. (She molted just this past Sunday night.) She looked really fantastic afterwards too!

Later this evening, my husband was watching the shrimp and fish swimming around, and he found 1 dead female cherry shrimp and 1/2 of another one. 

WHAT IS GOING ON????!!!! I tested the water:
Ammonia: 0 - .10 ppm
Nitrite: 0 ppm
Nitrate: 30 ppm

I doubt that low of an ammonia spike would kill that many critters!! (It was higher a few days ago, but I did a water change and it's come way down.)

All the fish look fine, so do the frogs. The remaining shrimp all look happy. It's hard to know how old they are when you get them.... maybe they were old? (The cherries at least.) The Bamboo was only about 2" and they grow to 4", so I don't think old age did her in. She rarely picked at the substrate as we fed her phytoplankton. The only thing I noticed was that she hid a lot more often. (Which she does about a week before and after molting.... which she just did...... so I don't know.)

*sigh. Sad week!


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## fishguardian40 (May 13, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your loses Holly.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks. It's so frustrating when you can't figure out what's causing it! I have a lot of dwarf water lettuce at the top..... the current is still blowing the bottom plants around and agitating the surface to provide 02... but maybe the dim light killed them? I thought most fish/shrimp liked dimmer lighting though. (And the subdued lighting isn't killing the plants at the bottom of the tank - they're growing like weeds!)


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

Any chance something may have fallen in the tank?

So sorry for your loss,and I know just how annoying it is to find something wrong with no signs of what is causing it.


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## pjones (Jun 5, 2011)

*blue sorry


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks everyone.

Nothing's fallen in that I can think of. Husband hasn't accidentally dropped anything in either.... I don't use air fresheners or chemicals near the tanks. I dusted pictures hanging above them.... but I wouldn't think a little bit of dust would hurt them. (The lid would have caught it all.) The cats have no way of reaching inside either, since I've closed off all holes so the snails don't escape.

The only thing I can think of, is on Sunday when putting water conditioner in (I use it as a 'stress coat' since our water has no chemicals or chlorine in it - well water.) I dosed 2 cap fulls instead of 1. I called the LFS that sells it, but the guy assured me that all it did was waste a cap full and the animals would be fine..... could it have been that?

I usually put 5mls of "Cycle" in the tank with each water change, but recently have changed to the "Big Als" brand because it costs less but had the same ingredients...... maybe that did it?


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

hrm I dont think so.like the guy said all you did was waste a capful.I dont think the cycle stuff hurt either,but im not sure on that as I dont use it.I dont think you need it either though.Not so often.Once the tank is cycled,the filter and fish will keep in balance without that stuff.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

True. Once this bottle is done (may as well use it since I bought it), I probably won't get another one.

Thanks.


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## majerah1 (Oct 29, 2010)

good luck.I hope the rest make it through whatever is ailing the tank.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks! Me too! (20g is aaaaalmost done cycling, so they will all be moving soon.) Hope that is beneficial for them and doesn't stress them too much!


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I asked this question once before in another post you made...why do you have any ammonia? Persistent low levels of ammonia can have an effect on fish/shrimp. If you continue to have ammonia present your filter is inadequate, your feeding too much (usually the problem for low levels) or you're overstocked. If you don't fix that you will have more problems. If you're relying on the nitrazorb to help you with the ammonia, you're asking for trouble/ I understand the nz for nitrates maybe, but if without it you have ammonia issues, you have some potentially serious issues.

**EDIT (had to finish working on something) The reason I say what I say is if you think about it, look at what you have in the tank that works to get ammonia down. You have your beneficial bacteria, plants, and the nitrazorb. 3 things that work on ammonia. Many people only have beneficial bacteria and usually have 0 ammonia. I occasionally got a .25 until my tanks became planted ones. There is no way you should have any with all you have in your tank. So if you are reading anything at all, IMO you've got some issues that you need to address.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

It's probably due to the fact that the tank is over stocked. I can't do anything about it until the 20g finishes cycling though. I have no where to put anyone until the other tank is ready. (It's kind of weird though, because a few weeks ago, the 10g was at 0 ammonia, so I don't know why it's up all of a sudden.) 

Since the 20g is going to be able to handle 4ppm of ammonia, I'm hoping that it will stay at 0 ammonia once everyone moves in (and I think plus a few Feather Fin Rainbows - they are less than an inch in size.) If the 20g has been cycled to handle 4ppm of ammonia withing 24 hours, it should be able to handle the critters in my 10g that are at 0 - .10ppm. So, I'm thinking of: _4-6 Feather Fins_ (less than an inch each), _4 Chillies_ (also less than an inch each - and they eat hydra), _3 Ottos_ (1.5 inches each and are for algae control), _2 ADF's_, _3 snails_ (for algae control) and some _dwarf shrimp_ (who have a tiny bio load - and are for eating left over food.) In total about 10 inches of fish/animals in a 20g tank.


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## DocPoppi (Mar 4, 2011)

Sorry to hear about ur week, I can tell how passionate you are about ur tank.
I pretty much concur with jrman, continuous low levels of Am are not good for inverts.
I've had simular experiences...
Age could well be a factor, unless you knew how old are the shrimp were?
Wood/bamboo/flower shrimp can get that big, and can live quite a while, but that is in the wild. And as they are all captive caught no telling on the age.
I think once you thin thing out in the other tank you should be ok, I guess in the mean time you may try putting some ammonia chips in a nylon bag and putting that in ur filter.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks. I might try the ammonia chips. (I'll test the water again - last night it was at 0 ammonia.)

Glad to know that you think that amount is ok for a 20g. I'm ok with _fully_ stocked but definitely don't want to_ over_ stock!

Yeah, the Cherries and Black Diamond could have been old. They were at full size, so who knows how old they are? (The only live for a year or so.)

Glad to know that the Bamboo doesn't live that long in the tank either. I felt soooo bad - like I had done something wrong.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I would advise against ammo chips. All they do is mask a problem. I would say that your problem is two-fold. Your filter is probably not adequate either. Larger filter area equals more space to hold bio-media. I would put at least an AC30 on your 10, an AC50 on your 20, and an AC70 on your 36.


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## DocPoppi (Mar 4, 2011)

So as jrman says, and I mentioned the chips are only temp. and can help "scrub" the Am. till you get the other tank up. Then you can figure out how to balance the limits of the two tanks.
Best of luck


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## Future Marine Biologist (Aug 24, 2011)

Sorry to here bout that.


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## Gizmo (Dec 6, 2010)

Have you tested your water for KH, GH, phosphates, or MOST importantly, copper? If your tap water has even trace amounts of copper, then you're poisoning your shrimp. They also don't take kindly to elevated phosphates or hard water.

What are you feeding them? Anything with copper sulfate in it will really mess them up too, and if they're not getting enough food then you're starving them. Do you feed any sinking pellets or algae wafers that the fish won't devour before the shrimp have had a go at them? Shrimp are omnivores and therefore cannot survive on flake food and the occasional deadfall from your plants alone.

Hope the rest of your shrimp make it out ok...


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## Kehy (Apr 19, 2011)

Soo sorry to hear about that Holly! D: Hope you get things figured out soon


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Thanks guys. This is a fairly old post, so all the shrimp died, except for 2 Black Crystals. They are now hanging out happily in the 20g tank with the fish and frogs.


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## Rob72 (Apr 2, 2011)

what are you doing on here, thought you went camping is everthing ok 
how is the tank doing


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Get on chat you! (I'm at the cottage this weekend - the high speed is here! Woot!)

The tank was fine when we left.... lets hope it stays that way!


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## PapaM (Jul 10, 2011)

Holly, have you ever had your well water tested? Did they provide you with a chemical break down of the ingredients? Are your water pipes copper, galvanized pipe, or cpvc? Well water isn't always as pure as some people are led to believe. Sometimes house plumbing can be a contributor to bad water also.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

The pipes aren't copper, I asked the hubbs. No, we haven't had the water tested - it's an Artesian well and it just fills itself - it's not town water or anything.


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