# Lost 4 fish this week, help :-(



## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

Hi,

I know this is my first post but I've not had a problem before and need help.

I have a 400L (100gal) tropical community tank setup and running well for a couple of years. I've got a couple of Blood Parrots, silver dollars, plecs, albino catfish, iridescent catfish an Opaline Gourami a Silver Shark.

Until recently I also had a Bumblebee catfish, a pair of large Angelfish and another silver shark but they have all died in the last week with 2 going in the last 2 days.

I performed a water and partial filter change 5 days ago after I lost the first fish (and because it was overdue a clean anyway). Today I have performed water tests and found that the Nitrate, Nitrite, Amonia and Ph levels are all fine . . .

One odd thing is that the two newest fish, the two silver dollars, have only been in the tank for 3 weeks and they're fine. Also the Blood Parrot fish tend to be very sensitive to water quality issues, typically showing colour fading when there's an issue but they seem fine as well.

What else can I test for to find out what going on in my tank??


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## archer772 (Nov 8, 2008)

You say your water tests fine but can you post actuall numbers for us?? I think the Bumblebee catfish needs a little salt in the water not positive tho, are the fish that have died looked like they were beat up???


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## Dmaaaaax (Nov 20, 2008)

Do you have soft water? Depending on your tap water, you could have spiked the pH during the water change if your water is fairly soft. Soft water is not well buffered, so for example: if your tank was at 6.5 and for some reason your tap was high this water change lets say 7.5, you could have changed your overall pH by 0.5 or so. This could stress out some fish and leave them more succeptible to disease. How much water did you change? Did you forget to add the dechlorinator?

Or it could just be some disease your not noticing. Are the fish that are dying displaying any odd behavior? Hiding, darting around and scratching against plants, not eating, loss of color, rapid breathing, red gills...etc? 

Until you know exactly what it is you can treat with salt safely.


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## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

The Ph was around 7 and we live in a very hard water area. The fish don't seem to be displaying any odd behaviour and there's no sign of damage on the dead fish . . . I'm stumped

Think I'll see if I can pick up some general treatment and anti-stress tomorrow and hope it doesn't get any worse !!


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## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

I've just got home to discover that my other Silver Shark has died. I realised that the water testing kit I have has 2 separate Ph tests in it, one for low range and one for high. I'd tested using the high range and the reading came out at around 7, the lowest that test will go to. Surprisingly the high range test covers between 6 and 8 so I retested using that one and the result is 7.1, maybe slightly higher (but I didn't think up to 7.2).

How can I lower the Ph level slowly but quickly??


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## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

I took a water sample to my LFS just in case the chemicals in my testing kit had expired but they got the same OK results that I did.

I've started treating with Salt, something I've not done before, I've added some Stress Coat and a few new plants . . . other than that the only option we could come up with was keeping my fingers crossed :-|


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## kardon (Jan 4, 2009)

If you remember, what was your Alkalinity (kH)?

Are your fish picking on each other? When your fish passed away, did you notice a dark greenish area beneath the skin towards the rear of the body? If so, and if the fish was deceased for only a short amount of time, this might rule out the bully factor... the darkish green would be bile and may indicate organ failure.

You mention a partial filter change... did you add new carbon? If the carbon was exhausted it would not filter out toxins in the water.

Even if your water tests picture perfect, toxins cannot be tested and may be present. (Obviously, if you are using a medication, you will want to remove the carbon)

Also, back to the bully factor, how large is your pleco? It wouldn't be the first time a plecostomus decided to attempt an overthrow of authority...

Good luck...


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## Dmaaaaax (Nov 20, 2008)

> How can I lower the Ph level slowly but quickly??


Your pH sounds fine, I would not change it....and your above statement is a contradiction.  Have you tested your tap water to see how it differs from your tank, if at all?

Have you added anything else to your tank a few weeks before they started to die like driftwood, decoration, plants,...anything besides the silver dollars? 

One of the hardest things to find on an infected fish are parasites. Gill flukes and velvet come to mind. A lot of time they show very little symptoms until right before they die. Keep a real close eye out for red gills, faster breathing, and scatching. It could be that the silver dollars brought them over, but are not as succeptible to them, they took time to acclimate, reproduce and are now starting to infect others. The best way to tell for sure would be to swab a dead fish's gills and in front of their dorsal fin and look under a scope, which just isn't an option to ~90% of us.

Unless anything else was put into the tank this is the only other thing that comes to mind as a possibility. Sorry....


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## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

the gills looked fine on all the fish that I've lost . . . although they may have been a tad red on one of the Silver Sharks that I lost. I haven't noticed any unusual behavior but I'll keep an eye open for then scratching.

The carbon filter was one of the filters I changed.

I'm continuing the salt treatment and haven't lost any more fish yet.


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## gunnie (Nov 16, 2008)

Did you add the salt already? Plecos don't tolerate salt well.


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## jodrell (Jan 7, 2009)

My LFS recommended salt at a level that they said all the fish should cope with (1 tps/gal), and I'm adding it over several days rather than all at once


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## gunnie (Nov 16, 2008)

jodrell said:


> My LFS recommended salt at a level that they said all the fish should cope with (1 tps/gal), and I'm adding it over several days rather than all at once


Watch your pleco carefully. If he starts acting wierd, you might want to change out some of your water the reduce the salt content.


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## sinhru (Nov 15, 2009)

Hi, I am new to this hobby. Could you please tell me what needs to be done in case of diseases like:

1. Red Gill
2. Hiding
3. Discolour

Please reply at the earliest. My fishes are not well. (

Thanks in advance.

Rudra


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## ladyonyx (Apr 20, 2009)

To tell you the truth Rudra, the three symptoms above could be related to a lot of other problems. If these three things are happenning together my first thought would be stress. Stress could be caused by a wide variety of things including improper water quality parameters, e.g. ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH, temperature, low O2 saturation, etc. or being bullied by other fish. 
If you have a moment, start a new thread and tell us exactly what's going on in your tank. We need to know water quality parameters from test strips (testing kits preferred), tank size, fish in the tank, problems you're having with your fish, and anything else you think is important.


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## shocktrp (May 24, 2009)

gunnie said:


> Did you add the salt already? Plecos don't tolerate salt well.


I have 4 Plecos in a 180 gallon (formerly housed in a 55 gallon) - my tanks have always had aquarium salt (1 tbsp / 5 gallons) in it and they have never had a problem.


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## sinhru (Nov 15, 2009)

Thanks a lot for your quick reply.

Sure, I am opening another thread and writing all details soon.

Thanks,
Rudra


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## WhiteGloveAquatics (Sep 3, 2009)

My plecos do fine with salt, all my fish do, its called moderation anything can adapt to changes in the environment with slow exposure.


I take close up pics of my dead fish then use the pics to help diagnose any missing hints I didnt catch before.

What color are the fins? any red streaks on the fins or fish very subtle red nothing like a fire engine.


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