# What kind/how many fish to add to an established 30g planted community tank?



## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

I swapped my 30g community tank over to be a planted tank using the Beazlbob method several months ago, and boy have the plants taken off! Here's the latest pic, there's more of the earlier shots in my album:


Now that the plants are happy and keeping the water levels all nice and perfect, I'm thinking it's time to boost my stock level. Currently I'm sitting on:
1 betta
6 male guppies (no baby booms for me, thank you)
6 narrow wedge raspboras
6 black neon tetras
1 bristlenose pleco
3 ADFs
3 ottos
1 lonely regular neon tetra that's the last of my previous school (gave up on restocking them since I think the frogs may have nabbed most of the previous ones). 
A mess of snails that snuck in on one of the plants

I've heard that well planted tanks can handle denser fish populations but I don't know how much I can add... I'm leaning toward a school of long fin zebra danios, or maybe some more male guppies since I've been told that tends to keep them chasing each other more to minimize fin nippage on any one member. I also like platies and swords, but I would want to add 5 or so for a school and I don't know if I have the space for that size fish. Any suggestions for what kind/number of additions would work best? Thanks!


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Are all those fish healthy in there? You're already overstocked....so if you're doing well with what you got, you're already getting the benefit of being planted.

As crowded as it looks with the plants (don't get me wrong, looks good to me), not sure why you are trying to cram more fish in it. Keep going and you'll start loosing them. Stress is what kills most fish. Once that occurs, it won't matter how many plants you have in there.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

I agree with Ben. I wouldn't add anymore fish at all. 

You're doing the Beaslebob method... so you have no mechanical filtration right? Definitely no more fish!

To help keep the fish you have even healthier, you could try filling in the front of the tank (where you see bare gravel) with some dwarf sag' or another carpeting plant. (It looks fantastic!!! But, the more plants the better.)

I'd trade the lonely Neon in, or re-home him so he doesn't get stressed and die.

Guppies and Swords aren't schooling fish. They can be kept singly. (I'm NOT suggesting you add them, just mentioning this because I read you wanted a 'school'.)


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

Yep, all the fish are happy as a clam. I've been using the AqAdvisor thingy to guesstimate how stocked the tank is and it's showing I could fit more easily. I've been told that tends to underestimate how many fish your tank can handle when its a planted tank so I thought I still had room to grow...

Edit: Technically I'm not doing full Beaselbob, I still have my Rena SmartFilter running for mechanical filtration. I know I shouldn't need it, but I can't get over the idea of not having ANY filter on the tank.


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## holly12 (Apr 21, 2011)

Just giving advice. You asked, we gave. Wouldn't add any more fish if we were in your situation, but it's your tank. You may find that you start loosing fish if you add anymore. Let us know how things go.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

AqAdvisor says you're good? Interesting. Nice looking tank.


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

holly12 said:


> Just giving advice. You asked, we gave. Wouldn't add any more fish if we were in your situation, but it's your tank. You may find that you start loosing fish if you add anymore. Let us know how things go.


Yep, that's why I came here. Sorry if I came off like I wasn't believing you or taking the advice seriously, as that was not my intention at all. You guys have way more experience and I trust that over a website with formulas driven by who knows what. I was just drooling over all the pretties at my local fish store while picking up supplies and wanted to check before doing something impulsive that might hurt my fishies. I'll hold off adding anything since it sounds like the consensus is that I'm at my limit.


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

holly12 said:


> To help keep the fish you have even healthier, you could try filling in the front of the tank (where you see bare gravel) with some dwarf sag' or another carpeting plant. (It looks fantastic!!! But, the more plants the better.)
> 
> I'd trade the lonely Neon in, or re-home him so he doesn't get stressed and die.
> 
> Guppies and Swords aren't schooling fish. They can be kept singly. (I'm NOT suggesting you add them, just mentioning this because I read you wanted a 'school'.)


Oops, missed some of this while I was running off to dinner earlier. I have some remnants of some glosso that I was told was a carpeting plant, but I'm terrible at getting it properly planted in the gravel. Every time I try to plant it, I stir up more stems that float off to hide in the hygrophilia or get caught in the filter. When I DO get the darn thing planted properly, my frogs seem to delight in swimming straight through it, catching it in their hind feet, and yanking it straight out once they launch off... /sigh... I gave up on getting my anubias nana to stay properly rooted on the driftwood too, as every time I tied it down with string it would be just as free as ever once the string rotted out. I don't have any cement handy and I'd prefer to not have to yank the driftwood out to glue it down on it, so I've sorta been torn on what to do with it.... I haven't killed off or done badly by the other plants at least, so I guess that's still considered a victory though  ?

I feel bad for the little neon, but I never thought about rehoming. I'll see which stores nearby would be willing to take him. I kept hoping he might hang out with the black neons, but that appears to have been wishful thinking. He's hung in there solo for quite a few months, so he's definitely overdue finding a new bunch of friends elsewhere.

I had heard about guppies/platties/swords not caring about having schools, but for some reason I always like having several of them because their interactions are so much more fun to watch in a group with all the colors flashing around together. It just doesn't seem right only seeing one of them with no friends to play with. I guess I'm weird


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I never bother when the recommendation is for a particular fish to have X number of the same fish to live properly or to not stress. Just seen and heard too many times the rule is broken and it still works....just like a fish living in a certain ph and doing just fine outside the prescribed range. No doubt certain ones could do better, but it does not always mean that the poor fish will up and die because he doesn't have friends. JMO.


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## carpus (Oct 16, 2010)

Well said. There are plenty of reasons to have just moderate numbers of fish in even heavily planted tanks. He will find out.



holly12 said:


> Just giving advice. You asked, we gave. Wouldn't add any more fish if we were in your situation, but it's your tank. You may find that you start loosing fish if you add anymore. Let us know how things go.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Gee

you mean it worked? *J/D*


Nice tank and I'm glad it is working so well.

my .02

ps My gut feel is the filter has little to nothing to filter out.*old dude


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

beaslbob said:


> Gee
> 
> you mean it worked? *J/D*
> 
> ...


Yep, worked like a charm *w3 ! I keep checking the levels to make sure nothing's suddenly going crazy on me, but it's holding steady beautifully without any water changes. I just top off the water level every couple weeks and prune back the crazy fast growers as needed, and add iron/fertilizer supplements each week. The fish definitely love the plants, especially the pleco and tetras. I had some initial algae invasion, but the snail hitch hikers had a population explosion and with all them combined with my algae eaters the algae is back down under control (except for on my big anubias, but they're starting to work on that now that they're running out of other places to munch). 

You're probably right about the filter, it's more of a security blanket than anything at this point. Also the fish like playing in the current so I don't mind leaving it in place


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## carpus (Oct 16, 2010)

Are you vacuuming the substrate?

There is more to nutrients, organic detritus, and dissolved ions than the three of them that you can measure.




luananeko said:


> Yep, worked like a charm *w3 ! I keep checking the levels to make sure nothing's suddenly going crazy on me, but it's holding steady beautifully without any water changes.
> 
> You're probably right about the filter, it's more of a security blanket than anything at this point. Also the fish like playing in the current so I don't mind leaving it in place


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## luananeko (Aug 27, 2010)

carpus said:


> Are you vacuuming the substrate?
> 
> There is more to nutrients, organic detritus, and dissolved ions than the three of them that you can measure.


The layer of peatmoss in the beaslbob substrate serves as a kH buffer that lasts for several years if iirc... From my understanding of how planted tanks work, vacuuming the substrate would uproot the plants, remove their food source, and all around throw the ecosystem out of balance.

When I was researching planted tanks I believe Beaslbob mentioned that he's had a tank following this strategy running with no water changes, substrate vacuums, no filters, etc for many years now with all the fish and levels happy and stable. It's very hands-off and focuses on creating a self-sustaining ecosystem in the tank with as little maintenance as possible, which was what sold me on following it


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