# Extremely cloudy tank!



## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Hi everyone....im new here maybe someone can help! Running a 46 gal. about 2 months old with a 35 gal eheim and a aqua clear 70. Ive had my water tested twice at a local pet store and both times they say its perfect. I have extremely cloudy water and have tried everything. 10% water changez every other day, added good bacteria drops, vacuumed gravel. I thought i was nust nearing the end of a tank cycle but figured it would be done by now! Any thoughts??


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## Tiari (Apr 25, 2012)

You might consider getting an API master test kit to test your water yourself. Pet stores usually use test strips, which are notoriously inaccurate.

"Perfect" isn't a reading, and without knowing the actual readings it will be hard to tell what the culprit is.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

The pet store used an API master kit with the drops....
Ammonia-0
Chlorine-0
PH-7.8
nitrates-30
nitrites-cant remember


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

There are many reasons why a seemingly well cared for aquarium develops cloudiness. Did it develop suddenly or is this an ongoing issue? Briefly a couple reasons for cloudy water: 1.) Bacterial blooms are often the culprit. They give the water a smoky appearance. Bacterial blooms occur during the initial cycling process and can occur again whenever the nitrogen cycle is broken. On occasion I’ve broken nitrogen cycles when I’ve carelessly cleaned my filter/media and caused too many beneficial bacteria to die…that, or when I’ve changed a filter cartridge without properly seeding it for a week or so. Overfeeding and overstocking is also a sure way to break a nitrogen cycle and the subsequent bacterial bloom is necessary to resume the nitrogen cycle with even more bacteria. 2.) Green cloudiness is often linked to algae blooms that result in tiny free floating algae. My Mom used to turn our tanks green with algae when she’d do too many water changes, or when she’d skip water changes and then attempt to ease her guilt with a super large water change. There is even a higher risk of this in tanks with super strong lighting. My Mom used to say her Angelfish loved their green water and that she did it on purpose. Hmm, I’m skeptical…not about whether the angles loved it, but about whether she did it on purpose. :O)

Also, I spent countless summers working in bait shops on the Missouri river and Oahe Dam and bait tanks would get cloudy and stagnant during hot weather due to decreases in dissolved oxygen and increases in ammonia etc...not to mention heat-induced laziness via summer staff. That doesn't really sounds like your cuprit though...just hought I'd mention it.

If I were you...I'd stop with the water changes and gravel vacuuming for awhile...unless of course the ammonia/nutrient levels etc get out of whack. I suspect you're cycling or recycling and your water may benefit from just being allowed to do it's thing. Keep an eye on those water parameters though.


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

dvantuyl said:


> The pet store used an API master kit with the drops....
> Ammonia-0
> Chlorine-0
> PH-7.8
> ...


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

It didnt happen all at once. When i first fired up the tank it had just a little bit of haze. It stayed that way for a month or so. About a week ago i noticed it looked a little worse. Then slowly day by day it has gotten worse. As of this morning i can barely see the fish swimming around. The fish dont seem affected at all-still act and eat the exact same as day 1!


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

Kill your lights and stop adding food.

See if it is clear in a couple of days.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

What are your feeding habits? What is your stocking level?

You can leave the light on if you like. It won't matter.


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## Tiari (Apr 25, 2012)

*thumbsup thanx* Its great your pet store uses the API tester, a lot don't! Tank is certainly cycled, and the higher rate of nitrates might be what's causing the problem. As stated above could be a bacteria bloom.

You might want to try removing all the decorations, and doing a thorough gravel vacuum. I find by putting a filter mesh bag over the end of my vacuum and held on with a rubber band, I can really get in there, without the worry of sucking out half my gravel. Nine times out of ten, lingering nitrates are from detritus jammed in the substrate, which can cause cloudy water problems.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

2 small plecos, 2 small cory cats, 2 medium african cichlids, 3 loaches
Feed twice a day veggie granuals and all the fish go right to the food and its all gone within 2 minutes or so


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Definitely stop feeding for a 4-5 days after a big water change. You're feeding too much. I would recommend going to an every other day schedule once you resume. I feed my fish every 2-4 days and have left them for as much as 10 days without feeding and they were all fine.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

How do we know im feeding too much? Even twice a day when i put food in the fish all act like they havent eatn in weeks!!


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Because they dont need food twice a day. They will always eat like they haven't eaten in a while.

Remember, the more you feed the more waste they create.


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

I realize that most fish are opportunistic feeders who eat even when they’re already stuffed because their brain is wired to prepare the body for days without food. Yet still, my personal preference is to feed very small amounts of varying foods twice daily. I believe this promotes thorough digestion. I realize that my fish will poop more often, but the amount they poop will be very small and easily and readily consumed during the nitrogen process. Frequent little poops are easier on the bio load than infrequent large poops. As far as only feeding fish every few days...with the exception of hard-core carnivores, I’ve not read anything of literary worth that supports that practice. That being said, many hobbyist's swear by that feeding schedule and claim success so who am I to judge? If it’s not broken, don’t fix it I say. Myapproach to feeding is with an emphasis on best nutrition practices and how to manage the subsequent bioload. That's not to say that there aren't times when it's appropriate to withhold food...because there absolutely are. And that's not to say that another person's methods are wrong. 

Beyond that, I'm not convinced that dvantuyl's cloudy aquarium is the result of excessive feeding, especially given the ammonia levels of 0. And since her nitrates are 30...I'm thinking new tank syndrome. Of course I may be wrong, but considering the current water parameters, unless the nitrites are dangerously high, I don’t see the value of a massive water change just yet. Why not allow the bacter and spira to flourish and stabilize the nitrafication process and put and end to the rollercoastering cycle? I do agree that now would be an appropriate time to temorarily withhold food though.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

I just pulled all ornaments and did a very thorough vacuum. I must admit i was surprised by how much debris was already in the gravel. I also in the process changed about 15 out of the 46 gallons of water. I did notice when i was emptying the water in the tub it had a green tint to it which one would expect an algae bloom as the cloudy culprit. I also re-tested the water before the cleaning and according to the inaccurate test strips (my master kit will be here tomorrow) the nitrates were about 1ppm and nitrites about 40ppm. With an API ammonia test kit, ammonia is still at 0. I know too much lighting csn cause algae blooms so about a week or so ago i cut back my lighting from about 15 hrs a day to about 12.


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

dvantuyl said:


> I just pulled all ornaments and did a very thorough vacuum. I must admit i was surprised by how much debris was already in the gravel. I also in the process changed about 15 out of the 46 gallons of water. I did notice when i was emptying the water in the tub it had a green tint to it which one would expect an algae bloom as the cloudy culprit. I also re-tested the water before the cleaning and according to the inaccurate test strips (my master kit will be here tomorrow) the nitrates were about 1ppm and nitrites about 40ppm. With an API ammonia test kit, ammonia is still at 0. I know too much lighting csn cause algae blooms so about a week or so ago i cut back my lighting from about 15 hrs a day to about 12.


If your nitrites are truly 40ppmm that justifies a small water change...maybe. But since your ammonia was 0 I doubt the nitrites would have climbed much higher. I probably would have just fed the nitrites to the newly cultured nitrafying bacteria, who are hungry, and then got rid of nitrates via water change later on. Then again who knows...that may have been a good move on your part. On a good note new water surely increased your dissolved oxygen levels which promotes good bacterial health too. But...

Sometimes when water is cloudy it helps to resist vacuuming. I know it seems logical that when an environment is dirty it should be cleaned and sometimes yes. But sometimes no too. Each time you vacuume you introduce rich nutrients into the water column. Those nutrients feed and promote reproduction of a free floating bacteria called heterotrophic bacteria. This bacteria is actually unrelated to the nitrogen cycle but it's the culprit of super thick bacterial blooms...the ones where you can't see through the water. This type of bloom can occur in established tanks too but not as easily. Blooms related to cycling tend to be slightly hazy and blooms related to heterotropic proliferation tend to be very thick. It's hard to tell what's causing your blooms...could be a combination of things. This is why I suggested laying off the vacuuming.  My fingers are crossed though! I'd love to hear that your tank water is crystal clear!


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

8hrs is more than enough light. To make it easier just time it to where the light is on only when you are home. The fish don't need the light. Only way to effectively kill the algae bloom is a complete blackout for 4-5 days.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

dvantuyl said:


> How do we know im feeding too much? Even twice a day when i put food in the fish all act like they havent eatn in weeks!!


One indication is you're getting a cloudy tank. *old dude

my .02


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

Just to clarify....you can get a "green" cloudy tank without overfeeding. And you can overfeed without ever getting a cloudy tank. 

I overfeed my tanks every time I feed but they never cloud. I could drop a near entire container in my tanks and the only ones that would cloud would be the ones with limited amount of filtration.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Well started the black out last night gonna run that for 5 days and feed very little once a day and see what happens.


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

No feeding during the blackout though. No peeking, no nothing.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

After 24 hrs of black out and no food (after extensive gravel vacuum and 35% water change) it deffinently looks better but still very very cloudy and green! I fed just a very small amount. I will reply tomorrow evening.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Alrite.....it's been 48 hrs and it looks about the same as yesterday. I got my master kit today and just ran a water test.....

PH-8.2
Ammonia-0
Nitrite-0
Nitrate-40

Since my nitrate level is still at 40 does anyone recommend another vacuum and 30% water change? I'll try to post pics.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

dvantuyl said:


> Alrite.....it's been 48 hrs and it looks about the same as yesterday. I got my master kit today and just ran a water test.....
> 
> PH-8.2
> Ammonia-0
> ...


sounds to me like you need some more day(s) of blackout no feeding.

It will be amazing how quickly it clears. In a day you can go from cloudy to clear. Not just looking better but clear.

hang in there.

my .02


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## M1ster Stanl3y (Dec 10, 2010)

keep it covered and no feeding yet. the advice is sound. patience is the key in this.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Ok....a couple hours ago i just couldnt take it.....i did another 50% water change. I added some algae chemicals that i had laying around. I dont have a lid on my tank and when i lifted up my light hood there was wet algae even on the bulbs! After the 50% removal of water i even noticed little algae specs all over the inside glass. I wiped the entire inside glass and refilled. It is clear enough to see the pick up tube for the filter in the back now but is still extremely green! Im working now on posting pics of before and during and after so you guys can see why im in panic mode!

FYI i do run actinic blue bulbs and rumor has it, the slight UV that those put out can deffinently help algae grow! I ran the same bulbs in an old 40 gal octogon tank i had and that thing was always crystal clear and i even had a turtle in with the fish!!


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

This is what it should look like!!


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

This is a pic of about 4 days ago


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

This is tonight with just a white light so its easier to see that its green


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

The only way is it going to clear is to cover it and don't touch it for 4-5 days. If you let light in you sort of reset the clock...even if the room is just lit up by daylight in your place. You need to just cover and leave alone or you will never make any progress.


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

- Water change to remove the algae chems...* NOTE * Don't use chems in your aquarium
- Green water algae bloom. Complete/Total black out. Do not raise the cover to check on how the tank is doing. Leave it be for 3-4 days. Fishies will be fine.
- At end of blackout period, 50% water change.

Remember....do not expose the tank to ANY light or the algae will continue to grow.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Just an update.......been covered without for for a couple more days now. Did a 30% water change last nite and this morning we are almost back tk normal. I think everything is going to be ok. I appreciate everyones help...you guys are awesome! I still would like some feedback on continuing using my blue marine actinic bulbs. Like i said in a previous post, i used them on my old setup with no major algae issues but didnt know if this is fueling my algae problem in the new setup.


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## James0816 (Jun 19, 2009)

dvantuyl said:


> I still would like some feedback on continuing using my blue marine actinic bulbs.


They have no beneficial use to a freshwater aquarium other than asthetics.

They are excellent for viewing nocturnal fishies like Kuhlii's and such.

One thing I like to do as well is to take some aluminum foil and using a pencil, poke a few holes here and there and then place it under the light. Depending on the current in your tank, it will give a very nice moon accent lighting in the tank.


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## Goby (Mar 21, 2012)

dvantuyl said:


> Just an update.......been covered without for for a couple more days now. Did a 30% water change last nite and this morning we are almost back tk normal. I think everything is going to be ok. I appreciate everyones help...you guys are awesome! I still would like some feedback on continuing using my blue marine actinic bulbs. Like i said in a previous post, i used them on my old setup with no major algae issues but didnt know if this is fueling my algae problem in the new setup.


I would get a UV sterilizer. The _Green Killing Machine_ at Petco may work for your system. It's about $50 and may save you a lot of hassle in the future. I have a larger one and absolutely love it...best investment ever.


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Yeah i just use the blue because i have a bunch of fake anemones and they glow good with blue light!


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## dvantuyl (Apr 26, 2012)

Alright guys......the tank is ALMOST back to normal! Looks real good still just a tiny bit hazy. I added an oversized green killing machine and did another 30% water change. I switched to feeding every other night and feed very little. I guess if it's not 1 thing it's another.....I walked into the room with the tank today and noticed a pretty deent fishy smell. Now from what ive been reading that's usually caused by dirty water. I've done so many water changes and vacuums in the last few weeks, theres no way it's THAT DIRTy! Any Ideas??


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## jrman83 (Jul 9, 2010)

I wouldn't worry too much about what has caused it. If you want to get rid of you can add some carbon to your filter and that should take care of it. If you already use carbon, put in some fresh stuff. Only good for about 2wks anyway.


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## beaslbob (May 29, 2009)

dvantuyl said:


> Alright guys......the tank is ALMOST back to normal! Looks real good still just a tiny bit hazy. I added an oversized green killing machine and did another 30% water change. I switched to feeding every other night and feed very little. I guess if it's not 1 thing it's another*.....I walked into the room with the tank today and noticed a pretty deent fishy smell*. Now from what ive been reading that's usually caused by dirty water. I've done so many water changes and vacuums in the last few weeks, theres no way it's THAT DIRTy! Any Ideas??


All the water changes stirred things up and upset the balance. Hence the fishy smell.

my .02


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