# I'm gonna try Saltwater...but I have a few ?'s



## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

Hello! It's been a while since I"ve been on here. Had a little bit of a career move, but now that I'm back to being on the right track I figured I'd give salt water a try. I know there's a lot more into this aspect of the hobby, but I've learned a lot. I just wanted to ask the experts a few questions.

Currently, I have a 75 gallon freshwater tank where I house MANY African Cichilds. They are beautiful, but I'm ready for a change. My first question is this: I've had my current tank up for quite some time now(about a year). I was wondering if I cleaned all the cichlid pebbles out and put some live sand in with some live rock, and added the right amount of salt...can I just use this previously used water? It's already cycled so I figured why start all over again. 

Next question: I want to do both reef and salt fish in the same tank. Is this wise for a "salt" beginner?

Also: Can I use hang on filters, or do I need a refuge system?

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks so much.

Noah


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

TrueIrishFan616 said:


> Hello! It's been a while since I"ve been on here. Had a little bit of a career move, but now that I'm back to being on the right track I figured I'd give salt water a try. I know there's a lot more into this aspect of the hobby, but I've learned a lot. I just wanted to ask the experts a few questions.
> 
> Currently, I have a 75 gallon freshwater tank where I house MANY African Cichilds. They are beautiful, but I'm ready for a change. My first question is this: I've had my current tank up for quite some time now(about a year). I was wondering if I cleaned all the cichlid pebbles out and put some live sand in with some live rock, and added the right amount of salt...can I just use this previously used water? *It's already cycled so I figured why start all over again. *
> *No, you can't use the same water, the bacteria is different between the FW and SW. One won't survive in the others environment.*
> ...


And here is my Beginners List for SW:

#1-Dry Rock, there are a few hitchhikers on Live Rock that people want to stay away from, so they opt for using Dry Rock, or Dead Rock. Macro Rock is a good place to start looking for that. Either way you go you will need a minimum of 1lb per gallon. You can use Fully Cured Live Rock, and have the tank cycled in just a few days also. Other way is to use just a couple of pounds of Live Rock and the rest Macro or Dry Rock.

#2-Replacement filter media like filter floss and activated carbon (if you get a filter) Which is really not necessary.

#3-Multiple Power heads (2 or 3) 10x your water volume for just a Fish Only With Live Rock, and at least 20x your water volume for a Reef Tank. So lets say your going reef, and you have a 100g tank, you would need flow in that tank at minimum of 2000gph, or 2 1000gph power heads.

#4-Protein Skimmer, rated at 2 times your water volume. Unless your tank is under 30g, in which case you can do 10% water changes a week to rid the system of detrius. But, you'll have to watch the water parameters close, if things go haywire, you'll have to do more water changes.

#5-Saltwater Test Kits. Reef Test Kit. Test for Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates, PH, Phosphates, Calcium, ALK and Magnesium.

#6-Saltwater fish food. Mysis Shrimp, Squid, Cyclopease, Algae Sheets, Romaine . Flake food is not really a good food to feed your marine fish.

#7-Aquarium vacuum. This one is iffy. Most don't use one, if you have enough flow in the tank you won’t need one

#8-Rubber kitchen gloves

#9-Fish net

#10-Two, clean, never used before, 5-gallon buckets

#11-Aquarium thermometer, digital being the best.

#12-Brush with plastic bristles (old tooth brush) - needed for cleaning the live rock if you don't get Fully Cured Live Rock.

#13-Power Strip, possibly GFCI outlets by the tank.

#14-Optional but definitely recommend getting a Reverse Osmosis or RO/Deionization filter for the make-up water, and a barrel for storing the water.

#15-Possibly a Quarantine Tank for your new fish. They sit in here for a few weeks to kill off parasites and bacteria, to keep it from getting in your main tank

#16-Heater rated for your size tank.

#17-Saltwater Mix. Marine Salt. Instant Ocean is the cheap Salt that beginners and Advanced use alike.

#18-Saltwater Hydrometer or even better a Refractometer, which is more accurate. There is also a Digital Meter that is way advanced if you have the cash.

#19-Aquarium filter (not absolutely necessary if running with adequate amounts of live rock, but nice to have if you need to use a mechanical filter or activated carbon, or GFO and such)

#20-Aquarium substrate such as live sand or crushed coral. Some go bare Bottom, others choose the 2-3" bottom, others, more advanced will try the Deep Sand Bed, which is over 6" deep.

Volusion Demo Store

Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle and Cycling. Methods for Ammonia, Nitrite Removal.

aquarium heater in Aquarium & Fish | eBay

power heads in Pumps | eBay

NEW | eBay

MarcoRocks Aquarium Products

Bulk Dry Live Rock & Live Sand - Bulk Reef Supply

Live Rock and Live Sand: Live Saltwater Aquarium Rock and Sand

Fish & Aquarium Supplies: Marine Substrates, Sand, Crushed Coral, Live Sand

Aquarium Lighting, Light Information; Reef & Planted, PAR, Watt, Kelvin.

http://live-plants.com/

What Your Coral Needs | Successful Reef Keeping

t-5 lighting in Lighting | eBay

cree led aquarium in Pet Supplies | eBay

Aquarium Salt Mix: Salt for Saltwater and Freshwater Fish Aquariums

Aquarium Water Testing: Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Reef Master Liquid Test Kit

Reef Aquarium Care: Kent Marine Liquid Calcium Supplement

Saltwater Aquarium Buffer: Kent Marine Superbuffer-dKH pH Buffer and Alkalinity Builder


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## ionix (Oct 11, 2012)

Hello! It's been a while since I"ve been on here. Had a little bit of a career move, but now that I'm back to being on the right track I figured I'd give salt water a try. I know there's a lot more into this aspect of the hobby, but I've learned a lot. I just wanted to ask the experts a few questions.

Currently, I have a 75 gallon freshwater tank where I house MANY African Cichilds. They are beautiful, but I'm ready for a change. My first question is this: I've had my current tank up for quite some time now(about a year). I was wondering if I cleaned all the cichlid pebbles out and put some live sand in with some live rock, and added the right amount of salt...can I just use this previously used water? It's already cycled so I figured why start all over again. 

You will have to recycle either way, the bacteria that live in freshwater will die in salt water. And visa versa. Osmoregulation.

Next question: I want to do both reef and salt fish in the same tank. Is this wise for a "salt" beginner?

Start with fish, live rock, substrate and inverts as the first group. Then slowly go over to reef as you really begin to learn more, unless you're well versed.

Also: Can I use hang on filters, or do I need a refuge system?

Depends, you need a light for macroalgae like chaeto and etc., so if you can work it, then do it (compact fluorescent in the right spectrum (5500k-6500k I believe)). There are a lot of DIY refuge AquaClears (I use mine on a different brand but works just as well).

As a bit of additional info., opposite light cycles to the maintank will keep a more stable pH.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks so much.

Noah

No problem. Glad to have you post here.


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## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

Holy crap!!! LOL. That's an awesome list. I really cant thank you enough for this. This is a great check list! Thanks so much for the help.


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## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

When you say powerheads, I'm assuming that those are the fans that create water flow(current) throughout the water. Is that right?


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

TrueIrishFan616 said:


> When you say powerheads, I'm assuming that those are the fans that create water flow(current) throughout the water. Is that right?


Yes, there are several different styles to chose from.
hydor koralia in Aquarium & Fish | eBay
powerhead in Aquarium & Fish | eBay
Aquarium Water Pumps & Water Movement: Marineland Maxi-Jet PRO


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## Kevinf (Dec 23, 2011)

I believe you have alot of homework to do before you venture into salt. You cannot use the fresh water bacteria to cycle a salt water tank. You need to keep larger salt water fish (predatory fish) in a tank not with reef fish and corals. You can use hang on filters but they are not recommended with that of a reef tanks. You also have to invest in a good lighting source for reef inhabitants unless you like spending alot of money on killing corals.
Kevinf


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## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

I've done a lot of research about salt water tanks. A common theme is found in most of my research...no hang on filters and refuge tanks. I was just curious if I could use hang on filters and not use a refuge system. I never found anything on reusing fresh water that's been cycled already. So you're saying that I need to keep some predator fish first, before I go to normal salt fish with reef stuff? I'm confused by what you're saying.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

TrueIrishFan616 said:


> I've done a lot of research about salt water tanks. A common theme is found in most of my research...no hang on filters and refuge tanks. I was just curious if I could use hang on filters and not use a refuge system. I never found anything on reusing fresh water that's been cycled already. So you're saying that I need to keep some predator fish first, before I go to normal salt fish with reef stuff? I'm confused by what you're saying.


You should not be listening to the above Poster. Thats out in left field.
You may start with Reef Fish, and Easy to keep Corals. This will not be an issue. You may use a HOB Filter as a Fuge. But do not use it with its filters, this will couse you issues in a SW tank.
You can not use FW to cycle a SW tank, it will not work. The Bacteria is different. Choose Reef safe fish when looking for fish for your tank.


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## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

I will probably use the hang on back filters that I currently have. But as you've suggested, I'll just take all of the media out of them. Just curius...what will an empty filter with no media do to benefit my tank? I'm curious as to how a reef tank filter's out all the junk.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

You will add Macro Algae to the empty Filters. Live Rock, Live Sand, Skimmers with the help of Macro Algae, all these help in the excess nutrient waste removal.
Here is what I have on my tank, and i'm running a total of 285 gallons of water, including my sump. I have 6400gph total water movement, a Skimmer and a Sump full of Macro Algae. 220lbs of Live Rock and a 2" Crushed Coral Substrate. Thats it. No filter whatsoever.


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## henrod (Sep 21, 2011)

Reefing Madness said:


> You may use a HOB Filter as a Fuge. But do not use it with its filters


So it wouldnt hurt a HOB to add sand or mud and LR to it? If it doesnt i may use my hob filter i got with my 55 gallon when i do my tank?.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

henrod said:


> So it wouldnt hurt a HOB to add sand or mud and LR to it? If it doesnt i may use my hob filter i got with my 55 gallon when i do my tank?.


Can't add sand or rock to a filter, well you can to certain ones. Like lets say the Emperor 400 you can add those things to the side chambers, as the impellar is on the inside and feeds to both sides, it would all depend on which you use. Macro Algae you can, its easier on some more than others. In the above post i was referring to the addition of all those things along with the macro inthe HOB will help.


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## henrod (Sep 21, 2011)

Im not sure what brand mine is but i have two of them and the intake is on the center of them with a chamber on each side. Ill look and see if i can find a brand name or post pics of one of them.


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Sounds like you can do it.


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## henrod (Sep 21, 2011)

i checked on my hob filter but i forgot the brand name on it and the intake chamber is raised from the two outer chambers so what all could i add to it other than LR? could i also put pods in it?


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

The PODS won't stay in there unless they have a reason to, like if you had Cheato or Caulpera in there.


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## TrueIrishFan616 (Aug 2, 2011)

I did a bit more research on sumps. I've decided on getting one for sure. what size do you think i'd need for a 75 gallon tank?


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## ionix (Oct 11, 2012)

TrueIrishFan616 said:


> I did a bit more research on sumps. I've decided on getting one for sure. what size do you think i'd need for a 75 gallon tank?


Before answering that, to add to the pod question, they would live there, as a safe haven though it would be incidental. Chaeto is great though. And a sump isn't a bad place for them to exist, some may get chopped up on the way back up, but they'll get cleaned up (skimmer, CUC). I doubt the little babies (they are the ones in the water column) would get chopped up though (90% survival, they're so small), and the adults aren't usually in the water column (they'd be in gravel and LR, etc.).

I would suggest you think about what you want to put in the sump, and then really you get what is efficient. Don't need too much, I am only going to put a 25g tall on my 40g breeder. Just enough room for a chaeto chamber, live rock chamber (for copepod breeding), and a return pump with my skimmer (and heater, plus etc.). Though extra water volume though would never hurt.

I've seen at LFS these sumps that have planes of glass that sit like | l | and the middle piece sits higher and they put filter floss over the top (changed daily (its way too clean)), I guess it mitigates micro bubbles and pulls out larger particles from the water (hence pristine conditions)


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## Reefing Madness (Aug 12, 2011)

Rule of thumb on a sump, get the biggest one you can stuff into your cabinet space. Size is kinda gonna be weird for sumps. I just got rid of my 35g tall sump, stuff didn't grow to well and it was tough to get into the sump for maintenance, so I upgraded to a 45g. But its a Christmas Tree storage container from Walmart. It happened to be very long and shallow, BINGO, just what I needed. I have no baffles in it with the exception of eggcrate to keep the Macro Algae out of the return pump area. There is a photo of it in my albulm.
Melevsreef.com | Acrylic Sumps & Refugiums


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